Originally Posted by mizzoumommy
"A national test on various subjects administered at the same time is about the only way to compare educational outcomes. The AP and SAT subject tests are the ones that come close."

This would mean that standards, subjects would have to be taught *at the same time, etc. throughout the nation in all schools, IMO. Otherwise, you could have a group of students tested on a subject that they have only been taught for a semester and another that has had an entire year to focus on the same topic, depending on how the school interpreted the standard and implemented it in the classroom.

My point is that standards were developed by subject matter experts and then tests were created by them, then the core curriculum was developed by them. WITHOUT any input from non-subject-matter experts, ie the government. People use AP and SAT because they are good, reliable and accredited measures that people trust. If you accept AP as a good core system, then why do we need someone to develop any more standards?

We already have accreditation boards and professors who write textbooks. Again, without national standards.

The National standards debate is frivolous.


Originally Posted by mizzoumommy
"You cannot drop the same curriculum into a Texas agricultural border town that you have on Long Island. That is why you must allow for local conditions. There will be an ag-vo-tech emphasis in that ag town with none of that at NY magnet school.
A national curriculum could leave some room for local/regional subjects and standards."

A national curriculum could leave some room for regional differences, perhaps with the stipulation that such courses can only be offered during certain parts of the year and only for specific grades. For example, in California, California history is only taught in third grade (if memory serves me correctly).


A third grader from the Rio Grande Valley is not equivalent to that from Long Island. And saying when stuff can be taught is tying the hands of the local school district.



Originally Posted by mizzoumommy
"I think "testing" should be early and often to track how a student is doing with results going back into an individualized instruction set. A lot of online coursework does this with good results."

What type of "testing" do you envision and how would it be implemented? What do you mean by "often"?

Ideally, weekly. The test would not test stuff the child knows and just test the edges of their knowledge expansion and then this would feed into the curriculum for the next week.




Originally Posted by mizzoumommy
Yes, there is never an excuse for a "failing" school, IMO. However, I wonder if testing - "early and often" is the solution. Wouldn't this perpetuate a system that "teaches to the test", a system which we are, currently, trying to move away from?


Unless parents support education, then no school will progress very far. I played on a top grade-school football team while growing up and many of the players were black. One wanted me to teach him to read - and it went very well - until his dad found out and berated his son, "you want to be better than your dad?!!" There is also the issue of discipline and learning risk-taking arising from single-parent homes especially for boys.

Ultimately, the issue is one of information and evaluating it. A national set of standards ignores the critical role of local administrators who are in a better place to observe and adjust to local variations in parents, the preparation of the students, and community priorities.

From a GT perspective, having national standards for GT education means nothing. Having a local set of administrators and teachers who have had GT inservice education and then having a few school systems with GT-track curriculums where methods and knowledge is built up is far preferable.

Standards do not get something DONE. Local people who are enthusiastic about what they are doing does. People are most enthusiastic where they set their goals and work towards them and their ideas are listened to. Having some grand poobah tell them what to do will just take the wind out of their sails.