Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion pushing childhood

You reminded me of what my Mother-in-Law, who had three boys, told me some years ago. "If you have a daughter, at worst she can only get pregnant once every 10 months. I don't know when exactly it hit, but when the boys were young, I realized that on any given night once they were teenagers, they could all three get girls pregnant."

Raising kids is fraught with challenges and worries, and all we can do is define our own unique set of values, enforce rules that support those values, and explain why we've come to believe what we do so that our children do not think that we make arbitrary rules in a vacuum. When they do not understand why a rule protects them, it is so much easier to break it.

I agree about passing on the values, I just think how I've lived shows what my true values more than what I'd like to believe. �I mentioned it's more likely my kids will do what they might do within a childish "puppy love relationship" driven by desire than for them to be made promiscuous by outside pressure or the media. �And when they discover it they're going to like it a lot. �Is there a "passionate" OE (blushing and giggling). �At least I'm guessing that's more likely than the friends with benefits thing. �

��And I say what I think I'll do now, but who knows how I'll act when they become teenagers and this becomes real instead of theory. �Just thought I'd share what concerns me about my own family. �I'm more concerned about raging hormones and unplanned decisions than about movies and dolls influencing that certain undesirable career. �But I wouldn't let my hypothetical daughter dress however she wants if it's like that either.

I'll probably let the tinkerbell brand make up and nail polish. �That's if this one turns out to be a girl. �Well, and not a total tomboy. �The one I have now's a boy. �He's got a bowl cut that he asked for. �He's asked for a Mohawk next. �It's a shame because the bowlcut's just adorable on him. �But three-year old's supposed to be about exploring independence and defining structure and boundaries. �(according to some childhood psychology textbook I bought at Amazon). �

Yeah, besides that one consideration there's just pure aesthetics. �If you don't want your five year old wearing make-up she shouldn't be wearing make-up. � �
And really it sounds like you're so involved and doing so much with your daughter she won't miss out on a thing. �I read the things you post. �You want to give your little girl a whole world full of experiences.

Editing to add: �I'm biased. �My parents were unwed teenagers when I was born.�

You have my support.

If a child is going to sneak wearing makeup out of the house, they will sneak whether you have allowed none or some. Sneaking, whether makeup, alcohol, etc., is a result of peer pressure having more influence than the parent or the values the parent has tried to instill in the child. Your relationship with the child has to be stronger, and more valuable to the child than any peer relationship until the child has grown to be an independant person and responsible for their own choices.

How you build that relationship is up to you, but it has little to do with allowing no, or some, or unlimited makeup. I think staying consistant with your values and teaching those values to your child is important. Kids can smell hypocrisy a mile away, and that's a sure way to lose their respect.

My personal thoughts about makeup is it is used to make yourself attractive to the opposite gender. I know many on this thread have other reasons for wearing makeup, I'm just stating my opinion of makeup. For that reason, I only allowed makeup for our daughter once she had reached an age I thought was appropriate for dating. She has always used it tastefully.

I remember a playgroup DD was in when she was 2. They had lots of blocks of wood and wanted children to use their imagination, use a block of wood and pretend it is a phone etc.

It can be a little extreme but I remember as a child having 3 Barbies was a lot. You had a case of clothes for them and a car and a bedroom set. You were pretty complete. DD had Disney princess dolls (Barbie size) plus a bunch of Barbies, and 3 prince dolls, totaling at least 20 before she was 5. My friends and I had rejected clothes and shoes from our mothers when we wanted to play dress up, that was the norm. Now DD has had a closet of Disney costumes with matching shoes, crowns, other accessories. Perhaps the make up is one step further. But I also think putting that on young skin is not good. It is like getting face painting every week. But the concept, I admit, seems similar. It goes beyond pretend play and probably all of it is not good on a lot of levels.

Though dressing like a princess seems to have fallen by the wayside. The "magic" seems to have died somewhere between 4 to 5. But that worries me about the make up. It isn't about "dress-up", pretend, it is more reality based about using make-up, being really you, not Cinderella, and needing make up.

Luckily DD seems pretty OK with my reasoning and accepts my decision. The thing I find a little strange is that the mother who gave the make up doesn't wear it. Maybe on some occasion but we have gone out to dinner with them, socialized frequently since they bought a house at the beach. I also tried to arrange a trip on a pirate boat, these excursions that are great with kids are still young. They dress up, go out on the pirate boat, find treasure. DD had a great time. She could not commit and you had to book in advance. She didn't express real interest in something that her kids would have loved. We even offered to treat for the cost, which was not a lot. But buying make up is fast and easy than driving 8 miles to the harbor and sending them to their room to amuse themselves rather than 2.5 hours on the water in the summer air.

Now I digress and make assumptions and criticize so I should stop.

Ren

Wren,

My DD is now 6 and we've been having the same issues. She's a girly girl who loves to wear dresses and skirts. She thinks nail polish is great and is constantly asking why we won't let her get her ears pierced, wear high heels and make-up.

I'm okay with some things; lots of skirts, nail polish, jewelry. I'm not okay with others; shorts with words written across the butt, super skimpy swim suits, super high heels, make-up, etc. (Ear piercing is in the "you need to be old enough to be responsible for taking care of it yourself" category.)

When she asks why, I sometimes explain that those things are for people who are interested in having sex. She knows enough about sex to know that it's what causes babies to be made. (she's very interested in prenatal development and has been for years.) She also knows that even when she goes through puberty and may be physically capable of sex, it's "not a good plan". (As a side note, she asked about a 15 yo friend, "is he going through puberty now??")

Other times she tries to negotiate by bringing up the peer card, "Her Mom lets her do X." At that point I just answer with, "That's okay, she's not my daughter."

As a birthday gift, she was given her first Barbie this weekend (we've studiously avoided them 'til now). We've already talked about how ridiculous Barbie's heels are and that it's rather silly that she can't stand on her own.

I have no idea how long this fascination will last, but I want her to know that she can talk to me about things. I try to have an open dialogue about my reasons. Really, I can't control her. I have to give her the tools to make the right decisions for herself.

I think I'm just too cheap, lol! We have a salon here that does that type of thing ("Sweet and Sassy" - ugh, even the name is annoying) and more than anything, I wonder why you would pay that kind of money to get a child's nails painted, or hair done. For me (and again, maybe I'm just cheap)it's not so much about the nails as it is about the constant gifting/entertaining. It's about the kids who go to the 8th grade dance and want a limo and a professional updo. We aren't poor, but my kids get presents twice a year: Christmas and birthday. They get clothes if they need it. They don't whine when we walk into Target or get $200 jeans.
As far as the actual makeup, playing with it was pretty rare. I don't think they viewed makeup as a toy. They might paint their nails occasionally, or get a lip smacker, but not much more. They were allowed to pierce their ears in middle school, when I thought they were ready to take care of it. They were allowed $20 towards hair cuts. If they wanted to color their hair (they're both in college now) that was up to them, but it was their money. Beyond being "adult", it just seems too indulgent to be taking an elementary child for a manicure. Good grief - will kiddie facials be next? Kiddie massage? As far as how it affects them down the road, I think it really depends on the kid. One of my dds is a makeup maven (talented artist, so that might be it??) and one rarely uses it. One is a skimpier dresser, and one is very business like. When dd20 was in HS, she went on a mission trip to NYC, and she and a girlfriend bought thongs (yeah, not making this up - apparently in between helping the homeless, they went shopping). At the time,I threw it out. Now, I'd probably pick my battles. But I don't mind saying no, even if I am the only one.
Theresa