Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion ACT Compass test; interesting

Um-- you do realize what the percentiles are for earning over a 700 on any one section on the SAT, right?

Yeah, I do realize the percentiles. 700 Math is around 93rd percentile. However, at our district HS it is 70th percentile. I guess my day to day experience is different from the norm. I doubt that many kids in our area require remedial math in college - and those few who would require it don't go to college.

While in some sense I agree. It really should be not all kids should or need to go to 4 year B.A. programs. The reality is what USED to be vocational programs are now in often community college and called "COLLEGE". And it really depends on WHAT the student wants to learn if they need any math beyond Algebra II.

Second.. one thing I like about the U.S. system is that kids who mess up in H.S. for whatever reason have a second chance. Be it they just messed up and didn't take it seriously, their family life was terrible, have a chance to go to community college and improve things, and later transfer to 4 years schools. Often these students who pull themselves up like that can turn into excellent students. While it would be good if we could get everyone through a higher level math before "college" that is currently not the reality of how our system works.

Of course, I personally didn't take a single math class at my (top 20) college....

The use of Accuplacer and Compass for college course placement has been criticized for putting too many students in remedial courses. I think this is mostly blaming the messenger for the news.

http://www.insidehighered.com/news/...ial-placement-tests#sthash.n6hZ5cRm.dpbs
Placement Tests Still Rule
Inside Higher Education
December 21, 2012
By Paul Fain

Research released earlier this year found that commonly used placement tests fail to adequately determine whether incoming college students need remedial coursework. Yet most colleges rely exclusively on tests like the ACCUPLACER or COMPASS, according to a new study from the National Assessment Governing Board.

Only one in five colleges uses any criteria other than standardized testing -- such as high school grades or class rank -- to decide which students require coursework in remedial mathematics, the study found. And just 13 percent of colleges used other measures for placement in remedial English.

There is little national consensus on what constitutes college-ready. The new research found substantial variation in the remedial “cut scores” colleges’ use with the two popular placement tests, as well as for the use of the ACT and SAT to place students. Community colleges generally set a higher bar than do four-year institutions, according to the study, a result that surprised experts.

Roughly 1,560 colleges responded to the survey from the National Assessment Governing Board, which was conducted at the behest of the U.S. Department of Education and with help from Westat, a private research firm. The board oversees the National Assessment of Educational Progress, which Congress created to measure student learning. The findings are based on remedial policies in place last fall.

Remediation is a hot topic among the college completion set. While it isn’t a concern at highly selective colleges, fully half of all undergraduates and 70 percent of community college students take at least one remedial course, which are generally not credit-bearing. But the vast majority of those students will fail to eventually earn a credential. As a result, a growing number of state lawmakers, with a nudge from Complete College America and other groups, support legislative fixes to remedial education.

Placement tests may be part of the problem, according to reformers.

Two highly publicized studies, released in February by the Community College Research Center at Columbia University’s Teachers College, found that large numbers of students are being unnecessarily placed into remedial courses.

...

I remember this news story. As I recall, there were two major problems. First, the colleges were being very casual about the test and telling students, "Oh, it's not a big deal; just go take it now." This was bad for students who hadn't thought about math in three or four months. The second problem was that they wouldn't let them retake the test. When this information came
out, it made the colleges look very bad.

Nowadays, things are different. The college my son will be attending has a note saying that studying is "highly recommended." Sample questions are provided. I checked the other local colleges and found roughly the same things: sample questions and links to study aids and/or advice on how to study. DS's school will let students take the test twice in 365 days; some schools do this, others don't.

ETA: when this story broke two years ago, I also checked the local college websites, primarily as a way to check claims that "no one told me to study." There was nothing about studying back then, and one college even had a blurb about how they weren't a big deal.

Given the watered-down nature of US high school math classes, I do NOT agree with that article's claim that grades are better at predicting placement than these tests, which are untimed and straightforward.

My thoughts exactly.

Similarly in our district. And they are also told that a high score can mean the difference between having to pay for non-credit courses and diving right into a degree-granting pathway. There are also free prep courses available, both before and after testing, at local CCs.