Thanks MON, that's exactly the type of input I was hoping to hear -- from a PT no less. And very interesting about qualifying for adapted PE without having the educational delay part, I had not thought about it from that angle as usually what we are worrying about is the handwriting. His issues are not terrible and I hate to have some huge red tapey process going on if it can be worked out informally. Still it needs attention because he's already discouraged by PE. It sounds like an evaluation would be helpful to have in hand to go talk to the PE person and I think our insurance would cover that.