Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment Scores go out tomorrow and I need a mantra

Some may say this is being judgmental toward others.

Kids who are gifted may already be "out there" as outliers... 1 in 1000 or even more rare in their intelligence profiles.

We advocate to raise awareness of their academic, intellectual, and social/emotional needs.

What do you mean by this? That there's no point helping a child develop an internal locus of control, teaching a child to love his/her authentic self, or securing an appropriately stimulating environment? Because basically every researcher on giftedness suggests the complete opposite. A person deserves psychological stability and support irrespective of intelligence. I don't think you'll find many parents on a forum dedicated to serving the needs of the gifted agreeing that substance abuse is an inevitable (and, by your estimation, preferable) result of extreme giftedness, nor that parents should resign themselves ex ante that their children's needs won't be met.

I say this with all respect and sensitivity intended, but maybe it would be helpful for you to find a professional experienced with gifted issues to speak to about your experiences. Living with a child's giftedness can reopen old wounds if you had a bad experience as a child. Your view of giftedness as expressed here is unusually negative, and your children will pick up on this in forming their own views about themselves and their place in the world.

I think you will be pleasantly surprised at the resources and possibility available to gifted children when the team of adults around them is mobilized around their cause. The hundreds of actively posting parents on here are a testament to the reality that giftedness, though it can be challenging, is a tremendous blessing.

I usually don't get caught up in conversations such as this and try to just stay with the convos I can actually offer up something useful in But, fwiw, I am wondering if you really believe this? It hasn't been my experience at all, and I wouldn't want my children thinking so either. JMO, but from what I've seen of life (and I'm old, so I've seen a bit lol!)... what counts in life is your attitude, your self-confidence, your faith that there is something out there worth getting up for every morning. The sum of life isn't about money or networking-type-connections any more than it is about having a high IQ or being beautiful on the outside. Life is what you make it. It's about motivation and caring. It's about passion. And yes, it's about connections - but it's about connections of caring among fellow human beings, the type of connections that make us human, reaching out to understand each other, offering help to those who need it, offering a smile to others simply because we're happy. Connections to family, friends, giving your all to something you are passionate about.

OK, off my soapbox now.

One last question though - I don't entirely understand not wanting to look at the score. It sounds different than not overthinking or placing too much importance on a number - maybe I misunderstood? I do hope your dd gets into the program

Best wishes,

polarbear

It has absolutely been my experience. I won't put my CV on here but essentially, since the recession started, I haven't been able to get work at even 75% of what I was earning before, no matter how hard I try and how many side-projects I do. I tried to get investors for a business but I just didn't know enough people--leads were dry within a day. I work in the public sector so 75% of a salary is about half what people with my skills make in the private sector. Only the skills are parallel skills: all the software is different so I can't transfer laterally.

As for my kid, she got 99th percentile (they don't use decimals) on both math and verbal on the subject tests. However, her CogAT tests were low--very low. Just as I thought: she is very, very smart, but she is not the type of thinker they are looking for in the program.

Four more years of supplementation and extra homework until middle-school when she can choose her classes and they take performance over IQ scores. Sigh. It could be worse. At least I know the education system. I can get her to that level, no problem.

Then she will be in with all the gifted kids anyway. The trick will be getting her to stick with it and not think she's stupid until then. My stepson, in the same school, says that the gifted kids call the general education kids stupid on the playground, and he himself has said 'I'm not one of the smart kids' to us... he is 99th% math performance, 95th% verbal. 'If I were smart I'd be with the smart kids.' There is no advocating for this. He's not gifted, he's just really smart and quick.

I might move her to immersion for that reason alone.

I understand many are suffering financially. Don't know if it helps, but statistics show you are not alone.

This is bullying and needs to be addressed. There have been recent threads on this (here and here), which may be of help.

Re: recession: not really, but thank you. It's not that I feel bad about myself. I just don't feel I can honestly say to my kid, "Work hard, work smart, take risks, and you'll get ahead." It's simply not true. Life is, in part, a gamble.

Re: bullying:
They are addressing it, but the problem is, once the idea is out there, it doesn't matter if the school points out that the kid in particular is behaving inappropriately. "Stop saying she's ugly" is not the going to convince a girl who has just lost a beauty contest in which half her peers got a prize, that she's beautiful, you know?

It is not that my stepson can't stand up for himself. It's that in a school where half the kids are working a grade level or two ahead, and he does not have that opportunity (because he's not profoundly gifted even if he's highly capable), he is becoming aware that he's not been selected for services by the school system.

There is no changing that. Ultimately, to the school system, the gifted kids are worth the effort, and he is not. He's not gifted but he can figure out what that means.

I hope to see if there is something I can do to make sure that general education kids in my own daughter's class have more enrichment and working-ahead opportunities so that they know they have the opportunity to work a grade level ahead IF they finish their work on time. I will have to ask my partner if he can go in earlier so I can work at the school some to make it happen.

Ultimately, nothing makes you feel good about being left behind half your peers in the school. This is of course compounded for my stepson by the fact that like most of the gifted children, he hasn't been learning anything for the past four years and has NO IDEA how to learn a new math concept. He believes math homework should be completed in under 30 seconds. They are doing pre-algebra now, and he's finally having to read his math book, but refuses. So for the first time in his life, he's getting problems wrong.

I do not want that scenario for my bio kid, and it won't happen, because I am more aware than his mom and dad. Believe me I am trying to work with his dad on 'how to teach a child concepts when he's been taught he is in the bottom half of his class and simultaneously has not learned any new math concepts for four years (more like six), as well as believing that nobody with any intelligence should ever have to read the book, and not doing it perfectly the first time is not good enough'. Because not only gifted kids are perfectionists... sometimes normal kids are too. But on top of that I want to make sure my own daughter gets different messages: that she, too, is highly capable, though she doesn't need the special learning environment of the conceptual learners.

I'm thinking of explaining it in terms of conceptual/intuitive learners vs. absorption/sensory learners, and seeing if I can help the school in providing enrichment for general education in those terms. I fully understand about intuitive learners' needing different curricula. I was in such a program myself. I just wish there were a way to differentiate without my kid hearing that she's in the bottom half... which she is, actually, in her own school.

Yes, as you mention getting ahead financially is transient... people experience floods, fires, earthquakes, and many other setbacks. Working hard often makes us feel good about ourselves in and of itself... the work is its own intrinsic reward... individuals may be satisfied to have mastered something new... and proud of high ethics and character, friendships and healthy relationships. The things polarbear mentioned are what really matter.

Advanced academics provided by a school ought not to bestow a sense of worth, favoritism or superiority (or being left behind, neglect or inferiority).

It is true that the needs of many (most?) gifted children are not well-met and unfortunately he has that in common with them.

Might the introduction of new resources, possibly free accessible web resources such as Khan Academy or others, help him spark his interest in learning and struggling through material... possibly acquiring study skills and developing the growth mindset would help him to avoid underachievement if he is underachieving, and even qualify for some level of advanced academics.

You may wish to look at several books such as the perfectionism books listed in recent threads, see if your son may like to read and discuss... often kids will do this if parents also share similar struggles.

The book Mindset by Carol Dweck may be of interest?

Flexible cluster grouping by readiness and ability for each subject, regardless of chronological age may be a way to address this. When kids are not compared to others of their age and are on par with their clustermates they may all feel special in that the grouping is tailored to them. To use an analogy to flowers, some may bloom in the Spring, others in Summer, Autumn, or Winter. Some grow best in sun, others shade. Some need a lot of moisture, others dry conditions. One is not better than another, they can each be appreciated for their own individual beauty. By trial and error we learn how each flourishes.

Does anyone else share my feeling that we are just being told this by people who have most of the money, to keep us quiet?

I just have this sense that I was tricked into a career in public service, into being generous and taking time off to be with my babies as infants, all for "intangible" rewards. I feel that all these warm and fuzzy feeling things are kind of a confidence trick. "You should feel good about helping, not demand money for it." Well where does that leave me? And everyone who says that managed to get money and is comfortable.

When you don't have money, you have no control over your life.

I've got the whole, do nice things, be a good person, do fulfilling stuff, make a nice family thing down. No problem. What I need is cold, hard cash.


I think this is the real difference between gifted kids and high-performance potential children. He won't do that. He won't take our lead on this and he's not interested in being advanced. He has taken his label and said he's happy with it.

My own kids are different. They are used to being challenged academically. They do not expect to learn at school, and they know that it's about proving yourself.


The district is far too standardized to move to that in the short term, BUT I completely agree.

I might check out that book. I appreciate the recommendation. I do think that we have a similar outlook... my depressed outlook about the future in this country (another reason my kids are bilingual) doesn't translate to my opinion of my own child's capacities.

On a positive note, my daughter received a packet of math challenge work she can do over the weekend, and turn in for extra credit! It's 2nd-3rd grade level fraction work. Woot. She's excited about spending some time on it together tomorrow.

Possibly not, as it has been several days and no one has responded.

Some may see your statement (people who have most of the money encourage others to keep them quiet) as rudeness to polarbear, myself, and others who've volunteered time to encourage you and attempt to address your numerous concerns. Your statement may not get you a lot of love *.

*recent post, "Telling people xxx ... is really not going to get you a lot of love..."

At what point do you take responsibility for researching possible outcomes and being accountable for your decisions?

Chris Gardner was mentioned up-thread. He maintained an internal locus of control and can be an inspiration to us all.

You sound unhappy.

Many parents discuss and weigh whether to accept a child's trajectory or to decide to intervene (possibly utilizing psych/therapy/counseling services) to convince DCs to make full use of their skills, talents, and potential.

Our eyes may see some of the same things, possibly we have a similar SES vantage point, however what we've internalized and chosen to focus on may be quite different, giving us a dissimilar worldview.

Sigh, it has been one year since I posted here but I thought I'd get back to this thread before posting another.

"I am wondering if you really believe this?"

Short answer is, heck yeah.

"You sound unhappy."

Kurt Vonnegut was once asked about an author who'd made millions off a single book, and how that made him feel. And he replied, "I have what he'll never have--I have enough."

We don't have enough to give our kids what they need to get into college (we are narrowly paying down debt). I don't want to be rich, but I would like enough to give my kids opportunities.

I don't know anybody in the public sector who feels they have enough to give their kids the same opportunities that even they had themselves. I know valedictorians who are working second jobs.

Tell me that's not supposed to hurt.

What does it mean to take responsibility for 21-year-old me's choice to work in the public sector? Like, "Wow, I feel really guilty and stupid for believing my mother, my teachers, and the hippy-dippy advice of every adult I knew. I should have known better."

I did absolutely everything I could do to balance success and self-support given the information I had.

What I can do for my children is give them better information.