Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums Math acceleration - forward or sideways ?

Friends of mine, both Phd in Math, parents of three boys, do not rush at all. How many way to produce number 10? Well, if the kids think they know ALL, they try negative numbers, when they figure that, they go to fractions!

One thing about working "faster" or the "pace" of a course is simply accomplished by the testing out option. In our middle school (Connected Math curriculum), there is a pre-test for each unit. If kids scored 85%, they move on to the next pre-test. The downside is if all they're doing is pre-testing, because they needed to be placed one or more grades above the original placement. DS11 was not happy doing 7th grade pretests. Finally, the school let him and 3 others jump to Alg 1. Another way to accomplish more appropriate pace is to modify homework assignments. For "mathy" kids, 110 problems a night is not going to help them. A few problems per concept is sufficient. I make sure I include these two items in their IEPs each year (testing out and modified/abbreviated homework assignments).

I completely agree about math contests being very good for depth, and have asked the school to re-instate a Math Club. The teacher is doing her doctorate work, so I don't have confidence she has the time to do this. If I were interested in starting a Math Club, do you have suggestions about how to do it? I know the key would be to find a tutor to lead (because I don't think I am up on my math enough to lead them). The school has limited resources to pay a tutor/mentor. Or maybe I could do it? I don't like leaving it up to a teacher who has other committments and may or may not follow through.

Let me know if you have suggestions for how to start a math club/team. Thank you!

I've been following your posts, and checking out the math contests. I've been thinking I'd have to get GS8 ready for independent contests next year, since any school sponsored contests don't start until middle school in our school district. But maybe I should be looking into starting a math club for our 3rd-5th graders?

I agree, Kriston. In the first few years there is really not too much you can do but to move ahead. Now with DS5 doing 4th grade math we finally got to the point where we can go deeper and do problems which he finds challenging while having the math skills needed to figure them out. I am really exciting about that part.

So, here is our challenge and I have gotten very diverse opinions. Molly is 7 and profoundly gifted...mostly, incredibly creatively...she reads at a 10 grade level and is very artistic. But, she is advanced in all grades. By age, she is 2nd grade....but is working in 4th grade math and 6th grade in all other subjects. She HATES math because it is so black and white. BUT, if math involves critical thinking, she loves it. She is able to do long division and multiplication....but she has NO interest in memorizing math facts and, while she can do complex, multi step equations, she still uses her fingers or other manupulatives for simple math. As frustrating as this is to me....I have been told not to worry. What I am being told is that it is more important that she undstand the concept....which she does....at a 6th to 7th grade level. I was told to allow her to start using the calculator.....when she does, she can blow through her math at mach speed and do some very complex critical thinking exercises. So, I wanted to field this to other math gifted kiddos and see what everyone thinks. Her little sister (5) is also profoundly gifted in the area of quantitative analysis. Contrary to her sister, she has already memorized math and works through her math (3rd grade) very quickly, seldom using manipulatives or fingers. I am very worried about advancing my 7 yo in math when she still needs manipulatives....but if I hold her back and make her do 4th grade again, she will be so bored as she know how to do it.....it is just a matter of how she gets from point a to point b.....but she still gets there.

Terri

I would not make her repeat material. Just continue to work on the math facts on the side. Math facts are like spelling words.

Maybe she doesn't like memorizing...give her some other strategies for speeding up those calculations. Is it multiplication tables that are the problem?

Have you seen this?

http://www.visualspatial.com/articles/mthstrat.pdf

Well, you hit it on the nose....she is a visual spatial learner! No question. We have a friend, Ken Robinson (run a querry with his name and "ted talk". He understands Molly completely and is mezmorized by her. He speaks all over the world about the loss of creativity in education. He is amazing and is working to help us find ways to make Molly's education more engaging and creative....it is very difficult for us because she is profoundly gifted, profoundly homebound due to an immune disease (boy in the bubble) and all of her needs are met inside the walls of our home. I am my children's everything ......fun sometimes....challenging always.

Terri

I think it is important that the basic arithmetic is strong. I have one of those mathy girls and I have always tried to provide challenging/fun activities outside the lower school curriculum. However, she still had to work on the basics until she was proficient. You don't need to stop giving her fun stuff to do, but I don't think she should get away with not doing the basics because they are boring. She will need them later.

As for a calculator, my dd was not allowed to use one until recently. She needed to complete the lower school arithmetic (including percentages, fractions and decimals) and be acurate when doing long division and multiplication and show me that she could do those things without the calculator.

The calculator is certainly a great tool when doing complex math, but I don't even think they should use it until they are doing calculus and graphing. Even if they are doing "fun" stuff such as CML word problems they are still learning and practicing their basic skills.

When my dd complains that something is boring I tell her that the sooner she masters it, the sooner she can stop doing it. It usually means she puts the extra effort to get it out of the way. I don't believe children should keep repeating over and over what they have already mastered, but I do think they need to work on it if they haven't and should not be moved up until they do. Our children learn so quick that it usually doesn't take very long.

I don't think we should teach our children, gifted or not, that we only do things that are fun. Most of life isn't.

Just my opinion.

I think you may have misunderstood what I was saying. She spend a great amount of time doing the math.....she is not allowed to "skip" it nor would I ever allow her to do so. She has "mastered" the skills in that she is quite competant at the actual equations, it is just that she still has to use manipulatives. My understanding is that this is more developmental than cognitive.....but she is still required to do ALL of the math...the fun stuff ONLY come AFTER she has done the boring stuff. I strongly believe that it is more important for a child to understand what 72 divided by 8 means, rather than memorizing an obscure number that fails to give her understanding of what she is doing. So my question is not about skipping math....but rather the continued use of manipulatives.

Terri

I too am lucky that DS5 is very good in memorizing math facts and stays away from manipulatives most of the time. I expect DS4 to be more like your daughter when it comes to math.

I would move her on to the next math level. Learning new concepts will keep her interested in math and may be even realize that there is a good reason for memorizing the tables and such.

I would let her use the calculator but I would alternate between her own calculation (manipulatives or whatever gets the job done) and using the calculator. That way she still practices her arithmetics and hopefully memorizes it but it doesn't keep her back too much.