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    #192734 05/29/14 11:02 AM
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    I think this article draws some interesting contrasts between Stanford and Harvard.

    Stanford's introductory CS course uses Javascript; Harvard's uses primarily C.
    http://www.stanford.edu/class/cs101/
    https://www.edx.org/course/harvardx/harvardx-cs50x-introduction-computer-1022#.U4eDyvldVHU

    http://www.nytimes.com/2014/05/30/education/americas-it-school-look-west-harvard.html
    America’s ‘It’ School? Look West, Harvard:
    Riding Technology Wave, Stanford Rises to Top of Some Measures
    By RICHARD PÉREZ-PEÑA
    New York Times
    MAY 29, 2014

    Quote
    But for students more attuned to technology, “there’s a sense that they have a direct pipeline to Silicon Valley and money that doesn’t exist here,” said Nicholas P. Fandos, the managing editor of The Harvard Crimson, who just finished his junior year.

    About 5 percent of Harvard’s undergraduate degrees are awarded in computer science or engineering, compared with about 27 percent at Stanford. At Stanford, about 90 percent of undergraduate students take at least one computer programming class, compared with about half at Harvard.

    The disparity has deep cultural roots at many liberal arts institutions: Anything that looked like practical career preparation was seen as something less than real undergraduate education. Stanford, which established an engineering school in the 1920s, was never like that. In fact, it has become one of many universities that worry about how far the pendulum has swung away from the humanities.

    Harvard administrators have worked for years to expand offerings in computer science and engineering, but the going has been slow. Harvard created its School of Engineering and Applied Sciences in 2007, and it is planning a new campus across the Charles River, in the Allston neighborhood of Boston, largely for those studies.

    Bostonian #192744 05/29/14 12:22 PM
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    And the point is? If you know what you are doing researching Engineering/computer science schools Harvard wouldn't be top of the list. Off the top of my head MIT, Princeton, and Stanford would certainly rank higher.

    Learning C in this class probably does turns students not already planning to major in the subject off programing. 'C' has a longer learning curve than the newer scripting languages. You have to spend more time learning boring basics before you can write anything interesting, and more time debugging. A beginning C class is filled with lots of nitty gritty details. Another comparison point UC Berkley engineering use Python now but until last year used Scheme for this level class. Most of these classes are trying to teach concepts more than details of a computer language. And if a student has already taken a class like AP Computer Science, or have extensive programing experience already they quite likely won't be required to take this class.

    Bostonian #192745 05/29/14 12:26 PM
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    Not coincidentally, Stanford grads go to work at Google and Apple, University of Washington grads go to work at Microsoft: http://www.slate.com/blogs/future_t...google_washington_to_microsoft_sjsu.html

    Not surprising, because people tend to hire who they know, and students tend to target careers in the industries that they see succeeding around them.

    Anyway, Harvard has a brand name that is associated with many things, but technology is not among them. A student in the Boston area who aspires to software engineering knows their time is far better served in MIT than Harvard.

    Bostonian #192752 05/29/14 01:26 PM
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    As a computer scientist at Microsoft (14+ years) who interviewed many, I would say that the most important part (over which good college you are from)is how much you know about the theory of computer science , coding algorithms etc.

    Interview process at Microsoft is very through including 7-8 hours of interviewing at the white board answering many algorithm questions. Interviewers start with saying that answer to the coding problem can be implemented in any coding language chosen. So starting learning JavaScript vs C is irrelevant (though C is much more respected coding language than any scripting language)

    In short, which college you are coming from is not that important as long as you prove your knowledge of coding at the interview. In the interview, nobody gets threated differently just because they are from Stanford vs MIT vs University of Washington etc.


    Leyla #192754 05/29/14 01:36 PM
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    Originally Posted by Leyla
    In short, which college you are coming from is not that important as long as you prove your knowledge of coding at the interview. In the interview, nobody gets threated differently just because they are from Stanford vs MIT vs University of Washington etc.
    Yes, but

    (1) The least prestigious university you just listed is still a state flagship, and even admission to some state flagships has become pretty competitive.

    (2) Interviewing is time-consuming and therefore costly for the employer, but filtering by school is quick, so the school attended may play a role in who is brought in for an interview.

    Bostonian #192757 05/29/14 01:47 PM
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    Are you suggesting that a Microsoft hiring manager would turn away candidates because they graduated from Harvard?

    Bostonian #192758 05/29/14 01:47 PM
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    Stanford is one of the college that has also been in the news lately for innovating its computer science program in ways that have greatly increased the number of women taking CS classes. It's clearly going to be much easier to produce more CS graduates qualified to work in technology fields when you develop attitudes and environments that more strongly appeal to both genders.

    Bostonian #192760 05/29/14 02:09 PM
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    Dude - I guess your question is not to my comment, because I am saying that noone is going to be rejected because they are from a certain college, they will be rejected if they don't have the necessary knowledge (even if they are from an Ivy).

    Bostonian - I just put a few colleges, didn't think much about their ranking. As long as they are from decent colleges, that's fine. As far as filtering, it's not done by college. There are two other steps before inviting someone to campus interview. Hr. technical interview on the phone (30mins or so), computer scientist technical interview on the phone (about an hour).

    Leyla #192761 05/29/14 02:13 PM
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    Originally Posted by Leyla
    As a computer scientist at Microsoft (14+ years) who interviewed many, I would say that the most important part (over which good college you are from)is how much you know about the theory of computer science , coding algorithms etc.

    Interview process at Microsoft is very through including 7-8 hours of interviewing at the white board answering many algorithm questions. Interviewers start with saying that answer to the coding problem can be implemented in any coding language chosen. So starting learning JavaScript vs C is irrelevant (though C is much more respected coding language than any scripting language)

    In short, which college you are coming from is not that important as long as you prove your knowledge of coding at the interview. In the interview, nobody gets threated differently just because they are from Stanford vs MIT vs University of Washington etc.
    Every time people tell me about coding interviews it freaks me out that I am never getting back into this field. I worked as computer programmer for 15 years. Can code in C like the back of my hand. I have a math degree not a CS one and at the time getting jobs as a computer program did not require a CS degree at all. I Fell out of the job market when the combination of the place I was working going out of business, a health issue, and a family life that turned out to be way less stressful when I wasn't working. Never had to do a coding interview like that for any job I've held and it's kept me from even submitting my resume anywhere. Doesn't hurt that my husband has a good stable job.

    BTW where you went to school can help GET the interview in the first place.

    Aufilia #192763 05/29/14 02:26 PM
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    Originally Posted by Aufilia
    Stanford is one of the college that has also been in the news lately for innovating its computer science program in ways that have greatly increased the number of women taking CS classes. It's clearly going to be much easier to produce more CS graduates qualified to work in technology fields when you develop attitudes and environments that more strongly appeal to both genders.
    Harvey Mudd is another great school for women and engineering. Saw an article just a few days about about this. Harvey Mudd's President is awesome and really takes this seriously. Of course Mudd is even harder to get into than Standford.

    http://www.npr.org/blogs/alltechcon...e-College-Is-Closing-The-Tech-Gender-Gap

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