Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional Please help me regain perspective

I agree with that, actually. Perhaps I was being too jaded. Pemb, you know where that comes from. Sorry. :-)

I think you can approach this as a problem-solver (not as a "We're done with this!!!") but note that you've seen some difficulties meeting all the needs, and ask them to address the issues.

I don't think you should leave the issues to fester, however. It's OK to be direct about "she hasn't had access to materials" and "the bus is giving her headaches." Ask for solutions directly, of the person most able to give them, and see...

Pemberley, I am SO sorry to read this latest turn of events - I had such high hopes for the current school placement for your dd! I am still hoping you are able to get through this and advocate successfully for appropriate academics for your dd. Sending you a big hug!



I know you must be terribly frustrated at this point in time with the report generated by this consultant after believing that she was qualified and would do a complete and fair evaluation - but fwiw, I would focus on the fact that the district felt there was a need for this report (I'm not sure why specifically?) and that's the point of the report. The report that came back is woefully inadequate - you'll have to document, question, advocate etc - but all is not lost because of the inadequacies and shortcomings of the report. It's just more danged data you're going to need to document and more of a fight to go through - but the points you'll be addressing are all valid and important points so at the end of this next phase of your advocacy, you will at least be making further gains in your fight for an appropriate education and environment for your dd.


One thing I would probably try to do in future conversations is to stay away from mentioning the issue of trust, and focus on what is clearly being done or not being done. The district probably doesn't really care whether or not you trust them, and the concept of trust implies an emotional response. Keeping things factual, data-driven is the way I would approach it. You are in a complicated situation with an out-of-district placement and I would bring all the issues to the table, but instead of referring to lack of trust based on past history, I would just lay the facts out on the line, such as "district did not allow dd access to iPad from Sept. 12 - Oct. 31 (or whatever)" etc. and add "school did not intervene (or whatever)".


Pemberley, have you reviewed any of this with a lawyer? I am wondering if there is any type of free legal service available in your area - we have a local group that will advise and advocate for situations like this and I think that at this point it would be beyond helpful to have a lawyer's perspective on all of this.


I wouldn't worry for one second about looking foolish - the consultant's report is what is going to look foolish once you point out that she hasn't included an interview with your dd's real reading teacher.


Do you have any ideas of something simple that could be used as a goal? Our kids always have to do this as part of their semester goals, and they choose things like "making a new friend". I would try to think of something simple, that can be accomplished, that can't be taken by someone else who is reading it to appear to mean that your dd has a social challenge. Take your idea with you to your next meeting and suggest it if you're not happy with what the school comes up with.


Our schools just include it routinely for every student (typical students without IEPs). I think it's just a school philosophy or a current education philosophy or whatever. In your situation, where it is included as a goal on the IEP, I'd want to be sure there was a clear objective with measurable targets *AND* I'd be danged sure I put in writing, in the parents' comment section of the IEP, the fact that you have no social concerns and I would quote the past conversations from the teacher that support you.


Did you put this all in a written reply to the school? If not, I'd do that right away.


This is part of the reason I believe that it's best to focus on the actual work that's done (or not done) vs a feeling of "trust" when communicating with the school etc.


As the others have suggested, request the dates that books were made available, including details about when/where they were installed.


I know how incredibly frustrating this is, and I'd keep advocating like crazy to get your dd the enrichment she needs. OTOH, I wouldn't be too quick to assume that transferring to the other 2E school will solve all of these issues. It's possible that in switching schools (if you decide to go that route) you'd be faced with trade-offs - maybe they'd rise to the occasion of giving her appropriate reading challenge but wouldn't be as effective in providing appropriate remediation for one of your dd's challenges. It's not something any of us 2e parents want to face, but the reality is that in elementary school sometimes the priority does need to be understanding and remediating the challenges as well as developing appropriate accommodations that work for our individual children. My ds did not have access to *any* type of accelerated or gifted program until 5th grade, and then it was just a gifted pull-out once a week with no real academic challenge at all. *BUT* by focusing on remediation, once he was in middle school, ds was able to fit in and fly - so he could take advantage of opportunities to be accelerated or be in gifted programs etc. If he was still struggling with learning how to overcome his major challenges, he not only would be denied access to those programs (which he's loved) but he would be incredibly frustrated with having continuing challenges. I also think that ultimately he didn't lose any ground overall in terms of where he is now going into 9th grade with where he would have been had he been given access to accelerated academics earlier. Our kids are hugely smart - they are going to fly once they have the support they need. If for right now, you have a place where your dd is getting the support she needs, then I wouldn't be quick to rock the boat. OTOH, if she's not, I'd be right out there pounding the pavement trying to find a school or program that *can* address the challenging half of the 2e.


We have been in a similar situation - ds had a 4th grade teacher who, after seeing his work during the first few weeks of school realized (and related to us) that he was struggling tremendously and she was genuinely concerned for him. SHE initiated the process for IEP eligibility without us having to ask - totally polar opposite of ds' two previous teachers. Once that process was in place, she morphed into an entirely different personality, and all of her descriptions of ds' classwork etc pegged him as a middle-achieving student, not the best, not the worst etc. My take on it is - the school has a position - I don't know what your school's position is, but I am sure my ds' school was trying to make it very difficult to be found eligible simply because they did *not* want to deal with students with IEPs. In our case, that presumption of intent isn't just based on the teacher's comments, but based on feedback from our advocate and from friends who work with special needs kids in other schools within our district (and ultimately confirmed by our local disability law group). When the school (or district) has an agenda, they are going to instruct the teacher in how to handle communications with you as the parent, and there are going to be things she can and can't say. I would go ahead and talk to the teacher, but I wouldn't be surprised if it doesn't give you any insight into what's happening.


I don't know if I've told you about this before, but we did this very same thing with our dd who has medical issues when she was in early elementary and her medical needs were being ignored. Keeping her out of school was the most effective piece of advocacy I've ever done! The administration does not want students being kept out of school - if they are absent at certain times of the year, it can potentially impact their state and federal budget allotments.


I would right away ask (in writing) for documentation of the change in "need". What tests were given? etc. Request copies of all evals, notes, test results. Look to see if any of the testing is consistent



Really, this is actually huge Pemberley. Not ideal, but even if this is all you ever get from this school, it's huge.


Do you think there's any chance the teacher isn't allowing your dd to drink her Gatorade during the day anymore? Could anything environmental have changed? I'd want to be sure there wasn't some trigger other than stress that's led to the migraines returning.


Honestly, I think you're at the point that you need to go through everything with an attorney (or at the very least an advocate).


I think that you've mentioned one thing in all this that looks really good (from my 2e parenting set of eyes). The school has helped with remediation of your dd's challenges. That's what she most urgently needs. THAT is a really really good thing.


I don't think you will regain trust and I don't think you need to. It's not the ideal situation (to not be able to trust) but when you're in that mode of not trusting you are continually watching and staying on top of what is going on in the classroom - and that's going to ultimately benefit your dd much more than having a school which mentions none of this, tells you they will help your dd work through her challenges, and drop her off every day trusting that they will be met and then later finding out... things like you are discovering now.

Sorry my response was so long - I'm sending you a ton of strength and hugs as you move forward!

polarbear

Well put, Polarbear.

Trust is one of those internal states, like fear, that doesn't tell you much about what's going on outside of you. The feeling may or may not be accurately representing the ascertainable facts.

Better to work with the facts: is each need being addressed appropriately? If not, how to fix it?

Hang in there, Pemberley, you can do it.

Thanks for all the additional perspectives. I appreciate it.

I spoke with our consultant yesterday and this morning drafted an email for him to review. I wrote it from the point of view that we need to be sure we are all working from the same set of facts since the information I have been receiving from the school staff seems to differ from what the consultant reports. I asked for the list of dates I mentioned earlier and added that if she is losing ground or exhibiting socially inappropriate behavior this would raise serious concerns about the placement as these behaviors have not been observed or reported in any outside setting. I asked outright if the district had been violating state law by administering the meds or if somehow the school was "confused" and district could help them clarify.

I reserved the right to have our consultant and DD's pysch do observations. I pointed out that if the information we have been provided on these areas seems to differ so much that the great reports we have received on her areas of weakness and AT also become suspect. If it turns out this report is inaccurate we will request another outside evaluation by a person of our choice.

We'll see what our consultant says before I send it off to the district.

Agree with statements about trust, etc., and your latest response seems exactly what is needed.

I am sorry you are having to dedicate sooooo much time to this, seems absurd, considering the main reason: They are also spending time (and $$$) obfuscating and backpedaling and lying.
(You know, I am tired of skirting all around that word. )

I had spent many hours off and on for years (and plenty of sleepless nights considering what to do next) in dealing with stuff like this, although not to the degree you have delved. The first viable chance I got to homeschool we made the switch. If you need services for a child's ld, that makes it much harder, I'm sure.

Good luck to you.

They are possibly not able to emotionally cope with this problem, hence the obfuscating, backpedaling and lying hoping that the problem will go away and leave them in peace.

Sadly, that has been my own experience with this sort of thing. When it escalates, you eventually find yourself in a no-win situation since even if you win, you still "lose" in the hearts-and-minds portion of things. When it is your child, you DO want hearts-and-minds cooperation from those interacting with the child.

When one of the major players poisons that well then they ultimately have "won" because you WILL go away rather than subject your child to a toxic environment.

So yes, deal in facts-- I love Polarbear's way of putting this-- but at the same time, bear in mind that THEIR preferred outcome may be to get rid of the problem while yours is quite different. That said, there are strategic tactics that you will find unthinkable and they will find, er-- useful.

It doesn't mean that they are evil incarnate (though possible given the evidence over the years from the district), just that they have a very different goal than you do.

Quick response from the district with alarm bells ringing about the medication issue and "state law". This could get interesting! I'm guessing this will put some folks back on their heels as they approach the rest of the issues.

The thing is I want this placement to work. I was beyond thrilled about how well things were going. I will not, however, tolerate being lied to or misled. We can deal with any real issue as long as people play straight with me. We cannot allow anyone - district or school administrators - to poison the well.

Interestingly I think this could turn into a positive development. I think my questions may have them defending and improving their placement rather than looking to use this report down the road to block us from seeking a change to the 2E school. We'll see what happens!

Maybe you just need to let them know "in loco parentis" is Latin rather than Spanish?

Indeed. I do think it's possible to take it back from the brink and make it workable. We've seen it. For us this has been a matter of clarifying what obligations the school has, using copious quantities of hard evidence, and then politely but resolutely holding them to those obligations. Working through the hierarchy of responsibility has been important; so has making the issues crystal clear. Not to say we never make enemies, but only to say that you *may* be able to keep them invested in finding solutions.

I hope it turns out that your school can get their act together and serve the whole child.