Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional Ever feel like it is E/e?

I think that ANY parent of a special-needs child feels this frustration particularly keenly during PreK through about grade 3, and then again during middle adolescence.

It's the transitions, and figuring out a new way to navigate in a world that isn't made for those differences.

It's so hard to want to address items M, N, and P (which other parents GET to address as their top priorities)... and feel cornered into instead needing to address items A, B, and C since those are such big problems. I've wanted to cry sometimes from the bitter realization that I'm pretty much never going to get to have a "fun" conference with a teacher... it's always about what isn't working or is violating my child's 504 plan. Good times. Well-- you know.

{hugs}

Just keep swimming, right?

Anyway-- like polarbear, I just wanted to let you know that it's really about the "figuring this out" of any new(ish) set of demands. It does get better with time and familiarity, though as you're probably gathering, it also gets bad again when the set of external demands changes again.

The good news is that you gradually become more nimble in your approach to solving these problems, and so does your child. That really is hope, I think. I don't spend nearly as much time battling things as I did in elementary school-- because I recognize brick walls and don't waste time on them now (I immediately look for an alternate route instead).

Yes this bothered me ... I thought to myself 'I really do not like the sound of this.' In my son's school reading in broken down into small groups also and a teacher/paraprofessional works with the children and they are with similarly-skilled peers. The children do their sight works individually and are assessed individually, etc. not with the entire class observing... The kids do compare somehwat because the 'levels' are different colors and they have all figured out the levels and know who is where although this is discoraged by the educators. The type of arrangement you described your son has to go through would have been problematic for my kiddo, I am pretty sure.

The big circle reading thing isn't a regular part of his day. He usually arrives in the afternoon and this was something the morning class aide was doing to keep the kids busy while the party was set up. They usually work in small groups but the kids know who is in what group.

I still don't lke it personally... It would have totally rubbed me the wrong way - they couldn't have done something a little less obvious to 'keep busy'? I dunno I'm a little sensitive I guess

My DS8 didn't remember the names of the kids in his class until he moved to a school where the same kids have been in his class for 2 years. He still gets a couple of the girls with similar names mixed up. He knows them all, just not their names. I don't think this is necessarily related to LDs (my kiddo has none). It takes me forever to get people's names down when I first meet them.

Found this interesting: http://www.spring.org.uk/2011/12/why-peoples-names-are-so-hard-to-remember.php

I think the thing I find frustrating is how the the 2E combination affects finding the right school fit and working with educators.

We met with my son's teacher over the summer with scores in hand. I tried explaining that even though he has a high IQ we suspect he might have LD's that run in the family and that he might not appear to be a top .01% kid like the report suggests. He still seems like "that kid" when you talk to him but I don't think discussions are encouraged in class.

I feel like I may have lost credibility. While it hasn't been said, I fear the feeling from the school is that he is a normal bright but immature spoiled boy (not particulaly gifted or dyslexic) and we are weirdos for having him tested in the first place and for following up with more. That the reason he doesn't dig in and finish his work in a reasonable amount of time is because he used to getting his way. That the reason his work is full of errors is because he doesn't try hard.

I know this isn't true.
The books he reads at school with his teacher are ones we have been over and over and over at home. He has them memorized. He likes being ahead and works on reading at home without any hassel. We are super proud of him for this. We know it is hard and he works on it every night anyway.

When he tries a new BOB book at home it is kind of crazy how rough it is. There are the normal things like reading bed as deb, inverting the u's to make a "n" sound, etc. but now there are things like reading "off" when the word is "on" or reading "jump" when the word is "hop". This is without picture prompts.

Anyway, I know we are doing the right thing by getting more testing.

I think it is just that as we figure out what school will be like for him and we learn more about him, the years ahead look like a struggle for everyone. For him as he tries to get through a system that isn't set up for him and for us as we try to figure out how to educate him.

Sorry eema, I just don't want to be in your shoes in ten years.

Yep, this is very frustrating - but it is what it is. The frustration most likely isn't going to go away for a few years, because you're in the thick of it at the moment in early elementary school. The best advice I have is to give it your all, but also not let it consume you. You *will* see your ds through this and you'll get him what he needs. It's not going to be easy, but it's definitely worth the battle.


I think it's helpful to realize you're not the only parent that your ds' teacher has most likely heard from, especially going into K/1 and even on into 2/3 grades. And the teacher has 20+ kids (usually) to educate. And teachers (rightfully so) will see themselves as trained educators who know something about how to educate children - so they may see themselves as more of an expert over a parent re academics. I'm not suggesting that you shouldn't meet with the teacher or that the teacher should ignore you, but just suggesting that it can be helpful to think of things from the teacher's point of view. So... you're the teacher, and you have a parent who's convinced her child is intellectually gifted and also challenged with an academic ability. You've got (as the teacher) more than one parent who's thought their child was gifted or who thought their child is challenged. It's highly likely that over the years, as a teacher, you would have seen lots of these parents' claims turn out to be over-estimating of either talents or challenges. SO... *you* as the *parent* are truly the expert who knows your child the best, and you know your child is gifted and challenged - so how do you get the teacher to take you seriously? Think of what would convince the teacher: data - reports from credible respected experts - could be inside the school system or private professionals, work samples that illustrate strengths and challenges. Those are the things that, combined with a little bit of patience, have worked the best for us over the years.


You've got to not over think this or worry about it. You'll gain nothing if you never speak up! And the situation with most of our schools throws parents into this role initially. *Maybe* you don't have credibility with the school at the moment (although I suspect it feels like more of a worry than it truly is in reality).. but no matter what credible level you're starting at in the school's eyes, the way to restore and continue to build credibility and to advocate successfully is the same - know your son, know what's behind his challenges, seek out the advice of professionals, get the reports, understand what they say, keep work samples etc. Keep talking with the school, keep making requests, keep advocating - as long as our requests and concerns are based in reality and backed up with the "data" - you *are* credible.

Note - the school might not *treat* you like you're credible - that's a whole other issue!


This is a very real hurdle that many of us who are parenting 2e kids face - so it's good to recognize this may be happening. And the only way I've found around it is to just keep repeating yourself over and over again every time it happens, keep restating the challenges your ds has, keep showing the reports and work samples etc.



I think what you are saying here is his teacher thinks he can read more fluently than he really can because he's memorized books that you've read with him at home (if that's not what you mean, ignore what I have to say :)). I think it's really important to put this in writing down, somewhere. Are you keeping a notebook to use when you advocate at school? This is a piece of info about your ds' developmental history so just make a note of it now, no matter how obvious it is to you now or how much you think you don't need to write it down, as well as writing down as much as you can remember of his language and reading development up to this point. Also find a way to get this into writing re school - the easiest way is to put it in a email to his teacher. Save a copy of the email.


This sounds so much like my 2e dd - she's not dyslexic but has a different type of challenge that impacts reading.


You *are* doing the right thing. Don't let your impressions of what the school staff think, or what they say, change your direction.


It's hard looking forward knowing how much work is likely ahead, and knowing that there most likely isn't going to be a perfect fit. OTOH, that doesn't mean there aren't going to be lots of happy childhood moments along the way, and it doesn't mean that it's always going to feel like a struggle. The next few years will probably be tough - but you'll get through them, and you will be giving your ds an amazing gift - in more than one way. You'll be giving him the framework within which to learn and succeed with his challenges, and you'll also be setting an example that will teach him how to advocate for himself as he gets older.

Hang in there,

polarbear

This is off topic from my OP but MON, how do you get from the teachers saying you bought the diagnosis to trusting them to educate your kid? I would be afraid they would be vindictive.

Our babysitter had a 504 plan and in high school her math teacher brought up her accommodations in class. She was really embarrassed and stressed to be singled out that way as she has an anxiety disorder but was afraid to get her parents even more involved.

Plus there is that other thread going right now about some educator disliking the gifted lable.

Ugh...I kind of feel like if every year it is going to be hit or miss with the teachers not liking me, my son or both, maybe we should start thinking about homeschooling.

Thanks for the thoughtful reply polarbear, it wasn't up when I responded to MoN.

Enough fretting. Off to the beach with DS and his new metal detector. He is convinced he will be rich within the hour.

We are just back from a 2 week vacation - one of those "bucket list" trips many people hope to make before they die. For the most part I was able to escape thinking about all of this but had a couple of experiences (once dining with a special ed teacher and another time with an assistant superintendent from a large school district) where we discussed DD's situation. The looks on the faces of these people with many decades of experience who had never heard of anything like what we are experiencing really brought home just how much she is dealing with. Even on vacation I felt a bit overwhelmed at times. It came as such a relief to get back and find this thread - it reminds me that others understand what we are experiencing and are dealing with the same thing.

Yes we too were told that DD was "indulged" and "padded" (nicer I guess than "spoiled" which is what they clearly wanted to say) and had both her giftedness and disabilities denied at first. I think when you are dealing with people who are less than ideally qualified they can't understand that a child can be gifted but unable to perform at grade level because of another exceptionality. They can't understand it so we the parents *must* be delusional, or worse. DD was penalized for her disabilities - losing playground privileges in kindergarten when she couldn't write out sentences, having her anxiety response publicly punished as bad behavior in first grade and just 2 weeks ago having a substitute para - who was assigned to scribe for her - insist that she do all her own writing because she was just being "lazy" and trying to avoid doing her schoolwork. So yes that "e" most definitely is overshadowed by the "E". And we still have a classroom teacher and principal that just don't get it.

The psych working with DD attended an IEP meeting last fall and told me afterwards that her "heart was breaking" for me. I was surprised because by the time she became involved we had gotten things back on track and the meeting she attended was actually a good, productive one. (I wish she had been at the one where the principal insisted that DD's disabilities "are her problem, not ours. She just needs to get over it.") She explained that she knew what we HAD to go through to get to the point we are now. She said that the parents, especially the mother, HAS to be seen as crazy at first. It is always that way. The parents just have to dig in our heels and hold on while we battle to get our kids what they need. I don't know why it has to be that way but from what she was saying, and what I have read on here, it certainly seems that way.

I started out trying very hard to maintain a good relationship with everyone at school. I was so very appreciative for all they were doing for DD. Then things turned a corner and the principal started going out of her way to make DD's situation even harder than it needed to be. I was clearly labeled "crazy" and was seen as exaggerating DD's situation. Her disabilities were becoming more obvious and the spec ed teacher was confirming them. The giftedness, though, had to be my imagination. We then got a third set of test results that showed the same split - 44 points between verbal comprehension and visual perception. The neuropsych used terms like "gifted" and "truly exceptional" in his report. Her scores ranged from above the 99th percentile to below the first percentile. No one can deny it anymore. No one treats me like I am crazy anymore. And they know that I will hold them fully accountable - they used up all opportunities for benefit of the doubt by allowing the principal to behave the way she did. Everyone understands now but it doesn't mean that what we went through goes away.

More and more people at DD's school understand her situation and the district is providing every conceivable service to her. It helps to not be seen as crazy anymore but DD's situation still remains very, very difficult. I can only hope that with continued spec ed support, assistive technology and the passage of time DD's "e" can be more important than her "E". For now, though, it seems like the disabilities are the primary focus. If we can't get them remediated it will be even harder for the giftedness to shine through.

Oh, we also have no memory for names. Unless a kid is in the "BFF" category or DD has known them at least half her life they tend to be "the new girl", "that boy with the missing tooth" or "I don't remember her name".