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    Joined: Sep 2011
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    Originally Posted by Val
    No or few labs is the new normal. Labs are expensive, and there's a trend among colleges and universities to cut them or not require them. It's depressing.

    That's a shame. Science is inherently a hands-on discipline. It's not just about learning what others have discovered; it's got to be about learning how to discover new stuff for yourself. Also, it's much less interesting without the lab. (not that I wouldn't have given anything at the time to not have to do organic chemistry lab; the number of chemical burns I sustained in the class . . . ugh).


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    For me, it was the loud mechanical stuff. Didn't have problems with math but when we had to do the mechanical stuff, hence I went civil, where there weren't any decent jobs and boring jobs, go I went to Wall Street. I didn't like the geology or soil mechanics. You really have to like sitting to deal with a problem -- for a long time before you get to work on the big stuff. Going to Wall Street allowed me to deal with the big picture of a company over a short period without sitting and dealing with how to design an I-beam for 10 years. You really have to be suited for the work.


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    Originally Posted by Val
    I think this problem is due as much to the way that physics is taught than an inherent super-high level of difficulty. I struggled through first-year physics and really understood very little of it, in spite of doing okay-ish on exams.

    That's how I remember intro college physics. There were 3 tracks, depending on how much calculus background you had, and I was in the middle one, meant for science majors who weren't physics majors. A bunch of us in Mandarin classes were also taking Physics, and we'd all meet at the science tutoring sessions 3 times a week, and get each other as far as any of us could get on the problem sets, then ask the science tutor to explain when we got stuck. In a typical session, we might be able to solve 1 problem between ourselves, out of 10 assigned. (We went to discussion sessions, too, where a grad student attempted to teach us the stuff the professor had been unable to. Unfortunately, the discussion session topics were a level easier than the lecture, and the problem sets were a level higher than the lecture.)

    All of us were passing with Bs at semester break, and none of us enrolled for the spring.

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    The medical professionals we have to see for my son's scoliosis encourage my son to study science and math. Because of his medical issues and his grandmother's illness after surgery complications he has become more interested in learning about neuroscience and biology and chemistry and since math is required, he has become more willing to spend time on that too. He expressed an interest in medical research when he realized that not enough is known about his grandmother's illness and even more so when we found that there has not been enough research done on the causes and effective treatment of ideopathic scoliosis.

    The orthotist we saw yesterday told my son about growing up in a small town like we live in and then going off to a college in Chicago where he originally wanted to study sports medicine. His job as an orthotist allows him to help kids like my son and he enjoys it. My son thinks orthotics and prosthetics might be interesting to learn more about too and he knows that this job requires a lot of science and math.

    His physical therapists also encourage him to study.

    We have experienced waiting lists waiting to see specialists because there are not enough of the where we live. My son sees this as well as the reports on the news about college graduates having trouble finding jobs. I hope he continues to be interested enough in science to continue learning and will not give up if it gets too hard.


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    Originally Posted by doclori
    Also, it's much less interesting without the lab. (not that I wouldn't have given anything at the time to not have to do organic chemistry lab; the number of chemical burns I sustained in the class . . . ugh).

    I remember nearly passing out due to chemical favors from one of the experiments. That was fun.

    I would have enjoyed Wall Street much more than engineering. I had no idea what engineering was when I went into it, and by the time I figured out that it was basically relatively unsafe grunt technology work at the lower levels, I wanted out.

    Law really isn't any better, though. I've concluded that it's just work, in general, that's going to be painful, repetitive, unpleasant, and generally meaningless. After all, it's a job, and you're not doing it to get enjoyment or satisfaction out of it. You do it to continue eating.

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    Originally Posted by JonLaw
    But then you get done, look at your engineering diploma, and say to yourself: "This is of absolutely no value to me. That's five years of my life I'm never getting back. I should have majored in business."

    I looked at my engineering classes and realized that to go further, I'd have to know more math. I switched majors and it was a lot of fun. When I rounded out my electives in the physics and engineering departments, the problems in those classes were trivial.

    When I worked on my MBA, the people with quantitative backgrounds had the highest GPAs, too.

    There is really no substitute for a strong math background in any field.

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    Originally Posted by LilMick
    One girl who made it through those classes and became my lab partner for biochemistry lab actually complained to our professor that she was smart, and, therefore, shouldn't have to work hard in his class.

    I saw this when I was working on my MBA. A lot of people turned in sloppy work, did not study, and paid the price, then complained when they got a bad grade on a test. Others worked hard but made some really bad assumptions on their analysis and when found out by other students, tried to tell us that we made them look bad.

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    Originally Posted by Lori H.
    We have experienced waiting lists waiting to see specialists because there are not enough of the where we live. My son sees this as well as the reports on the news about college graduates having trouble finding jobs. I hope he continues to be interested enough in science to continue learning and will not give up if it gets too hard.

    Rural specialists who will set up shop in several locations across a rural area will do well in the future. A number of professionals do that here in North Texas - one day they have appointments in one city then the next day they are somewhere else.

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    Originally Posted by eema
    And JonLaw - would you mind if I encouraged you to find another job? I hated my first few years of law, but now have a wonderful job. I make way less money, but go to work every day happy. Best trade-off I ever made.

    If I had the faintest idea what I wanted to go do with myself, I wouldn't have ended up here in the first place. I went to law school because I basically failed college, not because I succeeded.

    I've though about med school (now that there is plenty of distance between me and my old GPA), but I'd be 47 before I got out of my training.

    I think I just resent the fact that I have to work.

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    Originally Posted by JonLaw
    I've though about med school (now that there is plenty of distance between me and my old GPA), but I'd be 47 before I got out of my training.

    I think I just resent the fact that I have to work.

    If you had work that was interesting and meaningful to you, you probably wouldn't resent it.

    What sorts of things do you actually like to do? Writing? Solving puzzles? Talking with people? SCUBA diving? Cooking? Eating? Collecting things? Gardening? Drawing or painting?

    There are two books that were written back in the 70's called "What Color is Your Parachute?" and "The Three Boxes of Life and How To Get Out of Them" that you might find useful in your search to find some kind of work that is not soul-sucking torture and drudgery.

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