We are really struggling here with discipline and good manners and just plain doing things you don't want to do but have to. I have two older children who were so easy and were not perfect but almost always respectful of adults and others, well liked by adults and kids and have turned out to be fine young men. Now DD7 and DS9 have a different father and he is, without going into a long sordid story, a much less than stellar parent (serious understatement). The kids are overall fine when it is just us, but at school, in stores, at other people's houses or at a sport or other class they are defiant, willful, hyperactive and rude. I can't tell you how many times I have had phone calls or watched them in action and been brought so low to think that my children are behaving in this way. I am embarrassed, ashamed, frustrated and depressed about it. We do have days or weeks at a stretch when things are relatively calm but I never feel like it is a resolved situation. I dread them going someplace without me because I shudder to think what they might do. They are not physically agressive or mean just act like total spoiled brats which they are not. I just don't get it. They have very serious issues with going to their father's house. Both of them dread it and yet legally I must send them every weekend and also on Wednesday nights. I don't want to use this as an excuse but I do think it is a contributing factor. I have been unsuccessful in getting this changed.

At home I am frustrated because nothing seems to change things. Time outs turn into a nightmare and how long can I take away video games etc. and still have the length of punishment fit their age? Talking things out and having natural consequences works fairly well at home but why is this not transferring out in the world.

Grinity, I have read Nurtured Heart and have been implementing it and this has really helped over the last few months at home - but still no success out and about.

Any suggestions are welcome. Sorry for the rant but I am so worried and afraid that I am letting them down by not being able to fix this.

One final note, they are both going to start therapy next week.

Thanks for listening.