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Wow, those are great scores! As for the immediacy of MAP testing, one possible reason is that some schools only have access to the MAP testing during certain periods of time, so the window to take the test may be soon closing. Our school also wanted our DS to take MAP testing the spring of his kindy year, which he did. We are not dealing with the stress or testing anxiety, so take my comments how you will. The MAP testing is a great tool to find out what your child knows now. It is not timed, your child should be given as much time as he needs. He will be able to keep going as long as he answers a certain questions correctly. It is possible that your school finally does "get" it, and they're trying to plan for next year by seeing where he falls. Schools are much more comfortable dealing with testing that they regularly use.

Hopefully, they will take your DS's anxiety into consideration. Good luck. Oh, and apply for DYS!

Thanks. I feel like the achievement scores are hopefully impossible to ignore or explain away under the current circumstances. I found the report very interesting. I hate the idea of slapping numbers on my son, just as I hated it for myself, but if it helps get him what he needs, so be it. I am thankful that we will likely get some services for him from the DYS program. I would have to make it my full-time hobby to learn enough about education to teach him the way he deserves to be taught.

That explains the haste to do the MAP testing, I guess. He says he would like me to be in the room. So I will ask for that, and see what they say. Oh, and I promised him a puppy if he does his best and doesn't quit until the end. We'll see how it goes. Thanks for the dose of reality-- hopefully they are just getting ready to do right by him.

I should warn you that I'm an eternal optimist. But hopefully, they really have some good reasons for the MAP testing and the timing.

Hi,

I am not be in possession of all the details but I don't get the vibe that it's a attempt to keep him from being accelerated. (Perhaps knowing them better you are able to see past face value though). If the MAP is their favorite way of assessing 1st and 2nd graders, perhaps they are thinking that he's kind of like a 1st grader rather than a kindergartener and just wanting to use their own favorite test.

To be totally blunt, your letter seems kind of defensive and long winded (though the actual concerns are valid). Perhaps others on here will feel entirely different but that's my gut response. If I was the guidance counselor I might almost think, "wow, what are they trying to hide, did they prep him and now they want to prep him for the MAP too?".

I do think your concerns are reasonable and in general the idea of responding to the guidance counselor is good -- I might say something like, "Thank you for trying to reach us today and for taking an interest in DSs situation. We are interested in talking with you further about the idea of MAP testing. Specifically what MAP testing entails and how the results would be integrated with the other testing he has had already. He's had an awful lot of testing already and we had actually told him he was done with testing. We do want to make sure though that the school has enough information about his abilities and needs - perhaps there are some holes? When would be a good time to meet with you?"

In your response I would just ignore their comment about wanting to test in the next couple of days. Tomorrow's Tuesday, it's a beaurocracy, by the time you've talked about it with the guidance counselor say the earliest you can meet being Thursday, then there's unlikely to be time for anyone to actually test him this week.

When you do talk with them if you are against further testing you may want to be very well informed about how the achievement testing he's already had obviates the need for the MAP. "So we did some reading on what the MAP is and we're really not seeing...."

Polly

I'm basing my fears on our history with the school. We live in an area where an anti-skip policy is in writing on the school district website. The past assessment by them seemed to possibly be an exercise in justifying their position that no kindergartner would ever be allowed to go straight to first. The last TAT team meeting, in mid-November (that's how long it took them to move on assessing him), ended with the special ed. teacher telling us that not every child was academically gifted, but that our son might turn out to be gifted in the performing arts, based on his status as class clown. This year they've mostly just given him worksheets to do on his own time.

I'm not really against further testing, and it seems like if he will stay in this school system he will have to learn to deal with the MAP. I just don't want a repeat performance of him giving an underwhelming performance with a school psychologist who is frank about her lack of experience testing young gifted children, and whose results cannot be fully computed because of an "abnormally significant discrepancy" among the subtest scores. (Note that in retrospect I think she had a very tough job testing our son, with his avoidance issues, for the first time in his life.) I guess it helps that the MAP is computerized. How hard could it be on him?

Your suggestions are great, thank you. I will see what the wife says (she just got home).

ETA: The wife feels that they're trying to set him up for failure. I guess neither of us are optimists. :| This does feel like a repeat of last time. But I don't know how we can really refuse.

ETA: We feel that they can only be doing one of two things: casting about for a way to shoot down the test results (in which case we may still let him take the MAP), or getting ready to accelerate him using their preferred tools to make sure he has hit all the points on their curriculum. If the latter, they should be able to tell us up front. So we will simply ask what the goals are and play it by ear. Thanks to all.

This thread will never get to 100 pages if we don't post in it. So here's what my wife just sent:

I'm sorry I couldn't respond earlier. I spoke with Theophilus and we'd like to know the specific goal of testing Shloim immediately with the MAP. Is the school now gearing up to accelerate him based on the MAP results?

We're concerned that Shloim would be at a disadvantage compared to all other students taking the test, based on lack of prior experience with the test and lead time. We're actually still trying de-stress him after the most recent testing, and just got done telling him there would be no more for a while.

Can we set up a time to discuss the idea of MAP testing?

After further thought, I think the desire for MAP testing may go deeper than mere comfort. In the school's position, I wouldn't feel good about accelerating someone, grade- or subject-, without some assessment of readiness based on the curriculum, which the Woodcock Johnson couldn't possibly provide. I'm hoping for the best.

DS5 was actually pretty psyched about taking the test when he went to bed. Or psyched about the puppy possibility, anyway. The wife was not.

I think when you work with a school district who makes it obvious they will only do for your child what has been done for every child who came before them, showing you they don't look at each individual case, it is easy to feel they are always looking to negate your info. From my personal expericence, I try to be optimistic that their methods will work, but at the same time I also feel schools can be good at telling you what you want to hear at the time in hopes you go away. Then when you come back looking for more, they rephrase things or change them all together.

I think the letter your wife wrote was great and to the point. I do think from my experience with the map, with a child who is a perfectionist, that the test is low stress for the child. My dd6 thinks it is fun. I do not think it should be the only method of assessment, but can be a good tool. The results come right away so that is good. I hope it goes well for your son and the school opens their mind to more options.

Thanks very much for the input, landofthelost and Dottie. We are meeting with the school psychologist and K teacher this morning, and have gotten confirmation that the MAP testing window closes this week. Hopefully puppy power will pull little Shloim through with no lasting emotional scars. I agree that the wife's email was much better than mine, and it incorporated some of Polly's good advice.

((happy dance and fist pump))
Good Job Lucounu for going forward and getting the testing to quantify the home-behavior you have observed!!!!!!

I do disagree that the MAP testing is a bald attempt to undo the testing data. I think it's more likely to translate unfamiliar language (IQ-speak) into familiar 'we can work with that' language.

For example, if they are going to skip him, wouldn't it be nice to skip him into a classroom that had many kids similar to your son in MAP test scores? Maybe they would look at the MAP testing and decide that a single skip wasn't enough and to suggest a skip of two or three grades - whatever it takes to get some readiness level peers near by.

Well, that does seem far fetched, but, it's possible!

Love and More Love,
Grinity

FYI Lucounu- if you do MAP, get a promise/commintment in advance that it will be untimed for your ds. We were told nothing in advance so it wasn't like we were promised anything, but at our school they did tell dc to guess and get out once the last of the older kids left. It was essentially a timed test, 45 mins, due to scheduling. It clearly didn't hurt dc much as they had pretty good scores, but still. If you think the results are going to be used to translate your ds' ability to the teachers/staff, then I'd be sure to get a solid commitment that he'll actually be allowed to do what he can on it without being kicked out. He'll do great.