Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment calling all testing experts...

Just curious--how often do these kids exist? I feel like whenever I see the breakdowns of high-scoring kids, there is something low in there, usually processing speed or coding or some of the memory tasks, right?

I don't have percentiles for the subtests but I know that with my son's scores all around 140 except his PSI at 109, that puts him in that "rare" DYS category of not having any one score over 145 but being a rare enough profile to have a GAI over 145.

I don't think of him as a 1:10,000 kid but you'd think that he is the way we have to debate, discuss and beg with the school. Some days I feel lucky that is processing speed is "slow" in comparison because we can barely keep up with him as it is. If he has a PSI in the 140 range as well, I'd have likely had a nervous breakdown by now!

If you think about an elementary school teacher with 25 kids in a class, any one teacher will likely NEVER have a kid in the 1:1000 range. I think this is when it seems very, very rare. Looking at a broad populations 1:1000 isn't that big of a deal. But if you look at the one kid in one school with one teacher, it's not nearly as common as the data may suggest.

Yup - that poor elementary school teacher would have to work for 40 years to get ONE kid at the 1:1000 level, and another 40 years before he/she saw the second one! Of course that is just at the school with a mythical normal distribution in it's school classroom. In the U.S. we segrate ourselves by economic circumstances, which over broad numbers has an effect on IQ/school district.
((shrugs))
Grinity

Quite possibly true. I've never really thought of either of my kids as quite that high and it is possible that my younger one's one WISC-IV GAI in that range was an overestimate. She's just so wildly erratic that I also feel like the 2e end of things plays into not knowing as well. I'd suspect that there are 2e kids out there who are more capable than they'll ever show on achievement tests who don't cross the DYS threshold not b/c their IQs were overestimated, though, but b/c they have road blocks that prevent them from achieving in line with their ability. That's some of what 2e is, no?

This is all so mind boggling to me!!!!
So interesting...
and just leads to more and more questions!!

OH - and BTW Grin... Not waiting to 6.3 for any advantage, it is just that DS will be starting a new school with a grade skip right when he turns 6, so Dr. Palmer wants him to have an adjustment period!!!!! ALthough, I do hope to see that little jump in scores!!

Lukemac, found this by Davidson on Hoagies:
http://print.ditd.org/young_scholars/Guidebooks/Davidson_Guidebook_Advocating.pdf

It's a reading list and Handy Dandy advocacy e-workbook so you can flesh out the details of your kids ever-evolving education Needs and upbringing. Free for the grunt work;)

Thanks!! I just printed it out!!

Because this thread is so hot... I will post this question to you all? How do you all differntiate between OG, MG, EG, and PG? there are so many different charts lurking out there...

Remember that - for me - gifted isn't an absolute number - it's a problem that arises when a child is unique enough that she or he needs more academic challenge that is likely to be provided in a regular classroom. So please do not connect my personal definitions with any numbers you may have heard. Thanks.

For the purposes of abstraction, I'm leaving out all the 2E kids from this general set of definition. Srry.

So OG = MG, such at the children are at the top end of class, but hardly unique, and really benifit from differentiated material in the classroom and the periodic pull out. If the school has no accomidations, there needs might well be met by afterschooling, saturday programs, summer camps, WITH top-notch parenting so that they learn good work ethic. A single grade skip can be expected to work for many of these kids who wouldn't be learning good work ethic otherwise.

HG is such that even with good pull out programs and differentiation in the classroom, or a single gradeskip, the child will still feel that school is dull, and that the other kids, even in the gifted program, are incomprehensibly stupid. A single gradeskip Plus pull-outs, plus differentiation might work nicely, or suject acceleration might be needed on top of that - depending how 'across the board' the kid is.

PG is more rare. Individual variation is much wider. Like all kids, but with more urgency, they need to be looked at individually to see what it is that they actually need academically. There may be no overt signs of achievement or accomplishment, but once the child gets over their enforced underachievement, they would likely do well with subject accelerations 2-3 grade levels, or much, much,much more above their agemates, provided that accomidations are made for their asynchronous development. It is said that the higher the level of giftedness the more individualized a solution a child will need.

Hope that helps -
Grinity

Nice summation, Grinity . I like it and, by your definition, my dd12 fits nicely into the HG category, where I'd consider her to be:

A combo of being young for grade due to bd, a single grade skip, in class differentiation by motivated teachers, and accelerated/GT classes for math and literacy has been a reasonable solution for her. I don't think she's ever been totally challenged in her stronger areas, but it works well enough and the quantity is enough that I can't imagine skipping her further if it would mean more homework than she already has (which is a lot!).