Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy feeling overwhelmed!!

My older son tied his classmates shoes together in circle time when he was in Kindergarten, and my youngest is a constant source of new emails coming home to inform me of some new issue. The younger one seems to be a natural leader, and when he gets a goofy idea in his head, the rest of the kids follow suit. He's incited all the kids in his first grade class to get up from their desks and march around the room singing Canon in D, he convinced his recess buddies that climbing the slide while holding onto each other's backpacks was a good idea until one of the kids at the top of the ladder fell and pulled the rest down, and he actually has a waiting list for kids wanting a chance to "star" in the next "movie" that he shoots at home.

I think gifted kids tend to look at ideas that pop into their head and ask, "Why not? Wonder what would happen if..." - and then they go for it. It's just the challenge if directing that creative drive in a direction that won't lead them to a life of sitting in the hall or principal's office.

As to not knowing his math facts and complaining that they're hard - it could be an indicator of a learning disability, but it might just be the gifted mind not wanting to mess with rote learning. My older son hated to read, and he despised writing so much that he refused to create a short story for some writing festival his school was hosting in elementary school. And since 100% participation was required, the teacher passed a page around the room and had each kid add a sentence to the last. They put my son's name on it since he had one sentence in it that was actually his, and that was his entry. This is a kid who now reads college science and math text books on his iPod Touch for pleasure.

Thanks everyoen for the input.

The gifted facilitator and psychologist did say that the low processing score was due to adhd, which he has been diagnosed with. They made some accomodations with an IEP for him for the classroom which includes extra time on standardized tests and not having to show work on concepts that he's mastered (can do in his head). Not sure if that counts for timed multiplication tests but in teh grand scheme of things, does it really matter if you can do 100 multiplication facts in 5 minutes?

I'm not sure if he actually has memorized the facts or if he is calculating them as he goes. On the woodcock johnson test, he scored 96 percent on math problem solving and 32 percent on math fluency mult,sub,add. I just think it's strange that there's that much of a gap between the two scores.

LotsOtots5 - sent you a PM.

Hi,

My DS10 sounds alot like yours! He scored 142 on the verbal portion of the WISC IV, but had a low processing speed score (100). He hasn't been diagnosed with ADHD, but I wonder sometimes.

He likes video games, beyblades and manga comics. He was a very avid reader early on (reading 200 page novels in grade 2) but now seems to prefer comics and ghost stories. He has very little interest in school, needs to be coerced to do his homework and gets As and Bs. He also took quite a while to learn his multiplication tables (requiring bribes, etc on my part, which I don't like to do) but is excellent at math logic.

He considers himself to be an average kid. I have been feeling lately (since we had the testing done) that I'm failing him somehow by not finding a more stimulating environment. He was in a Montessori school and had lots of behavioural issues (writing letters of protest to the principal, staging demonstrations at recess, subtly trying to pull a hair out of a boy's head to make a voodoo doll, etc). I switched him to a regular public school (there is no gifted programming where I am) and the stricter, more structured approach has helped -- he hasn't had any behaviour issues at the new school, and pretty much does his work when he is told. But . . . he still says that school is a waste of time and feels that he is being forced to learn things that will be "of no use to him in the future".

So, while I have no advice, I sympathize!!

I asked my son about the multiplication facts. He said they're boring. I asked if he thought maybe he should just do them and get them over with and he said no, they are a waste of time. So I ask him what he would do if he didn't have to take timed fact tests anymore and he said "poop". Yes, so very insightful.

Verona, thanks for sympathizing It's nice to know there are others out there with similar situations. My son likes graphic novels. We're headed to the library today because I saw a whole slew of yu gi o graphic novels that I know he'd go nuts over. Hey, at least he's reading something right??

Have you tried the "Diary of a Wimpy Kid" series? My son loves them, and I think they are pretty funny too!

I promised my son a new video game after he had learned all his multiplication tables (being able to answer without a pause using flash cards). He learned much faster after that! I don't like using rewards generally, but I figured it was something he really needed to know and it wasn't easy for him. I also got him to consolidate them by doing lots of multiplication and division problems -- he didn't mind that so much.

Do you have details on that WISC IV? I'm thinking that if he scored a 140 on Full Scale including low processing speed, he might have some 'super high' scores on other areas, right? Have you seen him inside the classroom? Does the school work seem hard or easy? Does he rip through his homework or study of tests? Did they end up putting him in the Gifted Program even with his behavior?

Look up 'Twice Exceptional' - the combo of AHDH and Gifted can be quite a handful. For him, for you and for the teachers.

Ask yourself if your son has decided that 'messing with the teacher's heads' is more interesting than anything else that is going on in the classroom. He wouldn't be the first 2E kid to decide that.

Also - is there another sibling who has 'cornered the market' on 'good at school' (I'm reading into your 'lots o tots' username.)

Welcome and glad you are here!
Grinity

Welcome!

Timed math facts have been an issue for us too. Last year (gr 2) DD had to do "Rocket math" where they needed to do 40 simply addition problem in a minute, if they didn't get it the first day they did the same ones the next day and the next and the next until they finally managed to get all of them done correctly in a minute. Well, after about 2 1/2 weeks on the same set of 40 questions DD was convinced that she was horrible at math and could not do it! Eventually we figured out that like your son she thought they were stupid and didn't see the point of having to do them that fast. She could do the facts, but wasn't interested in going quickly because she would have to write sloppily! When we suggested to just do them and get it over with, she too refused saying it was a waste of time.
Her teacher used this issue as an excuse to not give her other more appropriate work in math because "if she can't do simple rocket math then how can she possibly already know how to multiply and divide?" It was a very frustrating time for us. We finally convinced the teacher that she knew the facts and that as scientists DH and I would not allow them to continue to convince our daughter that she hated math and was no good at it. We got them to agree to decreasing the amount she needed to get correct each day and eventually her confidence started to return.
Good luck!

Verona, he loved those books!! He's read most of them I think. Then he got into these books called "bone" and now he's got one called heroes of olympia or something. It looks like a series but we've only seen one book around so far.

Grinity,
I do have the scores. I don't know that his processing speed is REALLY low but it looks low compared to the other scores. He scored 136 on verbal comprehension, 143 on perceptual reasoning, 141 on working memory and 100 on processing speed. I have the scores broken down by the individual sections but I'm not sure if that's useful. The school psychologist said that the low processing speed was because of adhd and she said it was no big deal since they were doing an iep and would allow for extra time on standardized tests. Also, they did let him into the gt class. It's once a week for a whole day.

And I think my daughter might be my "good student" She is a well rounded girl and right on track for 2nd grade. The big difference is that she is a people pleaser and my son isn't.

Kerry, I'm going to decide that it's not a huge deal. The teacher isn't holding him back from learing other math but he does have to do the same test every week until he passes. He says he does know the facts but that he just can't do it fast enough. He doesn't seem really concerned with it.