Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Questioning teacher???

It seems to me that some of this issue and how to approach it really depends upon the specific child and his/her attitude toward authority.

Some kids are naturally resistant to authority. These are kids who might get in trouble somewhat regularly or are the "lawyers" who question every bit of every rule ever handed down to them looking for loopholes. When a teacher is wrong with this kid, it might be a good time for him learn some lessons about respecting authority and managing his tone to elicit good reactions from his audience.

But for other kids, those who start from a position of respect for authority and who pride themselves on following the rules, the experience of having a teacher who is wrong might be a good opportunity for them to learn to *challenge* authority. Blind obedience is, IMHO, just as bad for a kid as blind disobedience. I think our goal should be to try to get kids from both ends of the spectrum to the middle, where they understand appropriate times and methods for challenging authority.

For our part, DS9's 1st grade teacher was not a good one, but DS9 was a rule-follower. I was actually relieved when he (mostly politely, given that he was a 6yo) challenged the teacher a few times because it told me that he was not a sheep, that he would stand up for himself if the situation called for it, that if things were bad he would let us all know it. We talked a lot about the situation and that we could disagree with what the teacher did, but that we should still be respectful and polite. That there's a right way and a wrong way to approach the situation.

3 years later, he is still very respectful of authority, but he is also a kid who respects himself enough to speak up politely if something is wrong. I am very proud of this aspect of his personality. I think he has a real strength of character.

Just another point of view...

OH HELL MAYBE ITS TIME FOR THESE "PROFESSIONALS" TO LEARN TO ACCEPT THEIR OWN ERRORS. iF THEY HAD IT THEIR WAY THE EARTH WOULD STILL BE FLAT AND THE SUN TRAVELING ROUND THE EARTH. I AM A TEACHER AND WILL ADMIT TO ANYONE THAT I DON'T KNOW EVEN CLOSE TO MANY THINGS. THAT IS WHY LEARNING IS FUN. DISCOVERING SOME NEW WAY OF PERCEIVING THE WORLD. IF THEY WANT BEIGE AND TAN GO INTO DECORATING OFFICES. ENJOY THE PROCESS IS AS IMPORTANT AS THE FINAL PRODUCT. EDISON SAID I HAVE DISCOVERED 10,000 WAYS NOT TO DO IT. QUESTIONS ARE PART OF THE ESSENCE OF OUR GIFTED KIDS. WHY SHOULD THEY BE THE ONES TO LEARN TO PLAY NICE WITH AN ADULT WHO NEEDS TO EXPAND THEIR PARADIGM. OKAY OFF MY RANT

Reminds me of Constance Contraire's "Rules and school are tools for fools! I Don't give two mules for rules (Mysterious Benedict Society, p. 74)" While I don't totally agree with this statement, my kiddo thought it was hysterical when she read the passage as part of her homework last winter.

I hope everyone is having a NOT beige summer!

I agree, Kriston. My parents tried all kinds of tactics with my brother, but he was just a square peg who never found his fit in school. He was genuinely smarter than many of his teachers & he apparently questioned them or their knowledge. And as I said before, he never learned to approach them with grace. I think he developed a reputation of being difficult that preceded him when he was really just frustrated. He had fun learning on his own but school was miserable for him.

So far none of my kids have run into this type of situation. If/when they do, I hope I will be able to keep a level head & guide them calmly through whatever happens. Right now I tend to be the one who questions their teachers if necessary.

Thank you, vicam! I love that my kids ask so many questions. And I encourage them to try things on their own so they can experience "failure" along the way.

This thread makes me break out in cold sweat. DS7 is very strong willed. He's only been to school for 6mths and he's been "punished" for asking embarrassing questions. I stepped in and the episode is firmly behind us, but it has coloured his attitude towards school, not that he was agreeable towards it in the first place. He can be curt to his nearest and dearest, but he also apologizes when told and is able to rephrase to something more respectful when reminded. He's actually past his worst point since he began, which coincidentally started a few months after school and is once again my sweetest little boy at home.

But at the last PTM, it was clear his teachers were frustrated. Not handing up work (why they waited 6 mths before telling me, I have no idea), handing up shoddy work despite being reminded to re-do because he feels underchallenged is not helping him with his case. His teachers say he is compliant on the surface. But when he has the opportunity, he rebels ("I realized that I could actually get away with not handing up work, so I didn't!"). I've tried very hard to talk him out of this slump, but he is very strong willed. He's not grade accelerated but at the last check, he's been accelerated 4 grades for math which I feel is fair because his writing is at grade level. I know he is planning to get homeschooled and is turning up the pressure.

Perhaps I should feel relieved that he's still working within the system, ie, trying to persuade me by discussing the pros of homeschooling each day, coupled with a few insinuations that I let him down by sticking him into school. It's probably too much to ask that he changes his attitude towards school, but I would really appreciate it if he would just tow the line for the few remaining months that is required of him.

From what I can tell you, questioning authority is part of my gifted experience. I often used to question my teachers because they were unfair and morally cruel (calling kids who cried "babies, ect.), but now I just sometimes correct my teachers on grammar and stuff like that.

Well, there is definitely that. Which reminds me of another exceedingly important lesson that I took away from my high school years, if I can get by with one more story.

I learned this in business law class, but it was not part of the curriculum. I forget exactly how it all started, but as the year progressed I came to realize something that came in handy ever after. I got off on the right foot with the teacher somehow (probably several reasons--my dad had the typewriter repair contract with the school so the teacher knew him and I had that association in his mind, and I was the sort who tended to have the right answers, and I was probably a kiss-up as well, LOL) and one of my classmates got off on the wrong foot by being a screw-offy class clown. After those initial impressions were formed, it turned out that I could do no wrong with this teacher, and classmate could do no right. It didn't matter what I got up to, or how well he did, the teacher had his attitude set in stone. In fact, we could both be doing the exact same thing in class and he would get in trouble for it and I wouldn't! (Yes, I probably abused this knowledge, I must admit.)

So there is something to be said for managing not to rock the boat at the beginning of the student-teacher relationship--but once you get into that groove, you're probably ok no matter what else happens!

Although some may be compliant, most gifted children have trouble with authority, especially when they know they're right. I have often corrected my teachers on their grammar and spelling (they have no problem with it), but back in fifth grade, when I argued over morality with teachers (calling kids who cried "babies, yelling at the teachers in the last quarter about their rewards system which may squelch children's self-esteem), I was called, "arguementative". In my opinion, I thought that I was right and that the teachers were being insensitive, and I probably was. Gifted people have those "issues" because they know they are highly morally and intellectually sound than most, and if anyone dismisses your child as "arguementative", know in your heart that he is intelligent enough to not be a sheep and have his opinions!

Gifted kids also tend to be perfectionists, so if given a rule, they want to follow it. Generalizations like this aren't necessarily helpful.

I think it has more to do with personality than anything else. Of the 4 gifted people in our family, 3 are teacher-pleasers. So we're out there!

This is such a great point! DD is a teacher pleaser(not completely sure where ds is going to fall--at present he's much more peer focused then teacher focused and rarely has anything good or bad to say about his teachers--however, I suspect he's going to lean more towards the argumentative side). It's been a slow process in helping DD see that it is ok to voice a disagreement. It doesn't help when (as with our avocado incident) the teacher fails to acknowledge the legitimacy of the view point, but weve seen her more and more willing to stick to her guns as she has matured. It will be interesting to see what middle school brings. I was a TOTAL teacher pleaser in elementary school and then had a teacher who so offended my sense of fairness in middle school that I lost all fear of challenging authority. In hindsight I don't regret challenging the teachers I challenged (the teachers I respected found me to be an active, respectful participant in class), but I probably could have let some things go that I didn't. Once a teacher lost my respect I looked for every loophole I could find--definitely more about my attitude towards the teacher than a reflection of my need for truth and accuracy . Still, If I'm honest, I have to say that I vastly prefer my sassy middle/high school self to my sheep-like elementary self!