Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion HELP My 15 year old son is an apathetic IB senior

Thank you so much for all your responses. I did set him up to see a counselor and he has and will continue to go just so he has someone to talk to. He is an introvert but is happy to be around others, is on the swim team and gets along well with his teammates. He is basically a good kid, and sensitive. He told me last night " You know, mom, I have never done my homework except the period before." I tokd him I did know it, but that the strategy stopped working for him last year in Advanced Chemistry and BC Calculus...but the problem is he just accepted the low grades and made a 4 on the AB Calc test so I am not sure what message that gives him...I am going to go to some of the websites and check out the book. One of my friends suggested sending him to a technical school. I think he only need 1.5 courses ( English and a Life skills class) to graduate with a regular diploma. . He took a 3000 level Programming class this summer at the university. Seemed to learn alot and wrote programs, but because of one program assignment ended up making a C instead of the B he had in everything else. I just don't th ink grades mean one single thing to him. I don't know if it is an option to take him out /sit out for a year. I work full time and can't imagine how you could homeschool given that...is there a way.

Again THANKS!!!!!

Thanks. No he does not have ADD. He focusses intensely on one thing...always has. Used to be building with unit blocks when he was small...he could spend the whole day building and creating scenerios. He is well behaved in class...just daydreams, so he says. I beleive it because he used to bring home his notebooks filled with characters and tokens and game schemes he had created starting in about the 3rd grade. Infinitely more pages of game dreams than ever has been written about subject matter.

You know, it sounds like he really just needs time and a chance to consider what direction he's going in. Not a bad place to be.

My son got a 31 on the ACT but graduated with a 2.6 GPA from HS. go figure. Grades never meant anything to him, either. He was sad when he didn't get accepted to the state college because of the test/GPA discrepancy (he also had flunked a foreign language class and never picked it back up, so lacked that requirement for entry). But he learned some lessons. Did some community college but he and school just aren't a match. What he wants to learn he typically just learns on his own.

He's working in retail management right now. Has lots of experience and is also working beside people with college degrees. No one cares that he doesn't have one - he's got the skills. He has dreams and is happy, moving toward them. Has a wife and a new baby. A house and a car. And he's a gamer. Not all that bad.

Could or would your son be interested in a virtual school program? Is he disciplined enough for that? You might want to join TAGMAX or other homeschooling group and see what others have to say about homeschooling high schoolers. I'd say it's totally possible to homeschool until he earns his diploma. Then he could move on to college or whatever.

You might want to have him do the Meyers-Briggs and gain some insight on his personality and how to use it to his advantage and increase awareness of his own weaknesses in terms of approaching projects and getting things done in life.

And just an aside: my son had the entire virtual world of Zelda memorized but would then fail a social studies map test. Go figure! Totally interest, not ability on that one. Don't take grades as a sign of anything other than how well he met the task demands set forth by the teacher on a particular project.

Oh, one other thing. It does sound like you son is coming up against that time in his life where he has to work to learn. It is typically quite a shocker for most GT kids. I was that way - never really studied anything until senior year in high school. Then didn't know how to study! Maybe focus on some of those skills to help him out right now.

He sounds fine. He has just opted out. I was pretty much like him from 7th grade on - I read books, programmed, played games, etc, and ignored school. I could also nail tests. He has learned to be lazy because that is what has worked for him.

I would look around for a book on how to study. If he learns how to study, he will be able to go far in his chosen field, if its gaming. It will teach him to be organized and systematic about gathering and structuring knowledge. It will also allow him to use his time more effectively so he can then spend time doing what he likes.

It takes organization to get an A in an upper level class at a U that does not have grade inflation. Once he knows how to be organized, he should be able to nail the A every time, if he wants.

One of my HS friends who was a Senior when I was a Sophomore runs one of the larger gaming firms. He was GT, a major gamer, involved in a lot of stuff, but was VERY organized - kept good notes. He would wait until the week before a test to start studying, then get a 95. He is the same way at work - focused on his interests, but also organized to know where his boundaries are so he can maintain his commitments.

One other suggestion is that you could find a gaming or programming group that meets locally so he could get some adult interaction to see if that's what he wants to do. Having an adult he respects for shared interests tell him something that he hears from you may turn a light on.

Is something like this an option?

Beach High School

Well, I am praying I will be sensitive in what I say, because I don't know if what I say will be what you want to hear.

about me...I have FOUR twice exceptional teenagers right now - 13b, 15b, 17g, 19g. All accelerated at least two years in every subject (except 13yo in writing). Only because I feel like I have put so much time and EFFORT into thinking, trying, and doing what is right for each of them, gives me a humble motivation that what I say may help you...and others on this list.

What I think your son needs is a parent not a friend. Remember that at best you have 3 years with him at home. Short time for influencing any more, but you can.

First, I think the advice to let your son game for focus reasons is BUNK. Let him learn to focus on other things he loves to do. If he has none, ask him to come up with five things and explore them to help him find a passion or two. You will need to take the initiative and help him find the right mentor/activity/classes. And taking away the gaming device takes care of the "inventive" means of electronic controls.

Second, don't send him away for a year to a horse ranch. He is lost and needs parents right now more than ever. (We think when they are walking and potty-trained things just get easier and they no longer need us as much when in reality they need us more as teens, since they are now dealing with decisions/consequences that will influence their lives).

Third, don't worry about grades as much as whether he is learning or not. If high school is a waste of time academically, college courses are a good choice, but also have him do service through high school/college clubs, maybe even start one. Helping others often shows us the difference we can make in others lives. Teenagers need to know they matter, and service opportunities are a great way to remind them that they do! (Maybe he could start a club that collects older game systems and games, movies too, for donation to a local hospital. Bed bound teens would love this!)

Fourth, if he chooses a short-cut school, make sure he uses an accredited school and that he really is ready for college courses in all subjects. If he's not, keep him at the high school with the ones he lags in, or college will not be a successful experience for him.

One final note...this one is for everyone on the list...
There IS a problem with this generation of teens. I listened to an expert speak at a seminar and talked to my kids about it and they added to this.

1) Teens today are not trustworthy of others as much as in the past. This has to do with the cynical nature of society. They develop the attitude that "I better watch out for myself, since no one will." As parents, we need to tell them that we are not going to "freak" when they make mistakes or wrong choices...that if they want to stand against the crowd (including teachers/principals) for something they believe in, we will hands down support their point of view and stand beside them.
2) Teens today feel entitled. Again, some of this is due to society and some is due to the lack of poverty in U.S. the past few generations. They have things handed to them so easily. It is good for teens to not have every game, Ipod, cell phone type of contraption everyone else does, especially if they didn't work for it. The problem with entitlement is that when you feel entitled you are not motivated to do anything since "you deserve it."
Many moms can relate to this problem when we feel we deserve to lie around since we are truly overwhelmed. If done too long, we become depressed and forget what used to motivate us, what our passions used to be, and just figure lying around is the best way to spend our time.
3) Teens lack opportunities to find out just how smart and special they are. This is where we come in. We have to make opportunities available to them, so they can "discover" that they matter and can make a difference in the world.

My words aren't just hype, but from my heart, since I live with these guys daily (except 19yo at college). I could go on...but I hope these words help, even if it's only in a small way.

Please feel free to email me privately.

Jayne, that was beautifully expressed. I'm so glad there are moms like you that are aware of what the kids today face and parent accordingly.


There is a good chance you are right. That was my exact thinking in high school and I didn't come to that conclusion over night. It was an attitude that culminated over many years.
Perhaps he didn't care about grades when he was getting good grades. Perhaps he was just going along and the grades pretty much followed him doing the minimum effort required.
Perhaps he says he doesn't care about grades because he has never had to "work" for good grades and at this point, he may not know how to get started.
Perhaps he is really saying, I don't know how to get good grades now=I can't get them=So I don't care.

Just some thoughts............. ((shrug))

Everyone has great suggestions. I like Jayne's especially. I thought I was in this boat last year when DS was a freshman, but he seems to have pulled it together.

I do think kids want limits set for them. They'll keep pushing, but they want the limits--I guess it reinforces that someone cares. I keep telling my kids that sleepovers have nothing to do with sleep, waste the next day and all the fun can be had during the day. I'm hoping that when they go away to college, they might think about that and not stay up all night.

My kids are younger but enjoy gaming and I try to limit it. Still, it's more than I'd like. One DS like My SPace and you tube alot. So much time spent on those. For the high school kid, DH & I were out of our minds last year--it would be SO simple to get As. Just do the work...a lot of it busy work, but we all have "chores" we just have to do (scrub floors, laundry..) We kept saying that he could have lots of freedoms if he just did his work. I'm crossing my fingers, but he's fine so far this year. One thing is that he's on the soccer team and practices 3 hrs every day. It doesn't leave a lot of other time so he's had to become pretty disciplined about homework. Maybe your son needs to have another activity that will take a big chunk of time so he can focus. Like Jayne said, we become depressed when we lie around.

Finally, I am convinced that the talent search (or even pre-college) summer institutes are important motivators. They're surrounded by other very bright students for 3wks (without gaming) who are driven--it gets them excited about doing well.

I do not have the answer. Every kid is so different.
Wanted to put my two cents about computers/electronics in general. Both of my kids own laptops, so it is very, very easy for them to be online constantly. The rule we have is no laptops in the bedroom Sunday night till Friday afternoon (when done with anything that needs to be done). They are welcome to use them, but is has to be on the main level of the house (they usually leave them either in living or dining room, but the house is very open so you can't really hide on the main level).
It has really done wonders as far as limiting their online time. They are both quite busy with after school things anyway, but the fact that you have to be online while mom is nearby is somehow bugging them.
The same goes for cell phones - they leave them downstairs upon return from school. My daughter used to be on the phone with friends forever, until we decided that while at home she is supposed to use the landline (still have one). The amount of calls has diminished by good 80%.

I am not an expert - my oldest is 8. However, I wanted to suggest something that is working quite well for us. We give each child 30 minutes of screen time/day (ie TV, gaming, internet, etc). If they want more than that, they can "earn" more. For example, my DD8 was having behavior issues at school, so we worked with the school to setup an incentive system where she earns points for getting work done at school. Then, we convert the points to minutes of screen time. While other incentive programs have not worked at all for DD8, this is having moderate success (she really loves screen time!). When she doesn't earn any extra screen time, we use empathy "what a bummer... you can try again next time". When she 'sneaks' extra screen time, all screen time is suspended until she 'earns' it back. She can earn it back usually in a week or so by going above and beyond, ie helping us around the house more, doing a great job at school, getting extra exercise, etc.

I also recommend finding a mentor for him in the gaming industry.

For your general issues, I highly recommend using "Love and Logic" ( Love and Logic ). The premise behind it is that we need to let kids make mistakes while they're young, before the stakes are high. Their techniques help you resist the urge to swoop in and rescue them or lecture them, etc. You set limits, consistently enforce the limits in an empathetic way, and watch them learn to make good choices. The company has specific classes and books for parenting teenagers.