Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment WISC-V scores? Gifted? In need of a VECI score?

I am new to this forum and the whole gifted process and am looking for a bit of advice and insight into my unique super sensitive child, starting with the test scores.
A bit of background, DD always appeared bright and intelligent but nothing ever stood out to us as wow this child is gifted. She is 8.5 currently and in 3rd grade. Her teacher this year was the first to use the G word to explain away our social concerns as that's just how gifted kids are. DD has always been advanced in reading/language arts and pretty much average in math. In second grade nothing was said to us about giftedness although I noticed that they were using her to tutor other kids when she was done with her work. I had started to question more and more this year especially when I would see that she has surpassed adult family members in the area of language. (She is able to use vocabulary and word play that normal intelligence family members do not understand). This year has been a year filled with increasing bullying from other students, low self-esteem and general dissatisfaction with her school experience: complaining of being bored but very little differentiation and fear of her teacher who is very authoritative. We started weekly counseling due to major emotional explosions on a frequent basis at home and there does seem to be a pattern of persistent anxiety and low self-esteem that has developed. I requested testing from the school and this is what I have:

WISC-V: FSIQ: 123, GAI: 126
VCI: 146 (Similarities: 19, Vocabulary: 17)
Visual Spatial: 108 (Block Design: 11, Visual Puzzles: 12)
Fluid Reasoning: 109 (Matrix Reasoning: 13, Figure Weights: 10)
Digit Span: 11
Coding: 11

NWEA Testing: Fall: Math: 49%tile, Reading: 93%tile, Winter: Math: 58%tile, Reading: 86%tile

Our school is qualifying her for gifted support based on that Verbal Comprehension Index score of 146 which I know is very high.
The psychologist noted that DD was less comfortable with visually presented items and did not consider her choices carefully for the other tests. I also see that her lowest scores were for tests that were timed. The psych. also noted that her achievement scores were not where she would expect them to be. I am not surprised because I have noticed that DD is not persistent, does not like to have to think, and gets frustrated super easily when she can't figure something out instantaneously (such as math). Her latest report card grades were all As with a high B in math. She has to work for her math grades which she detests having to do. I would guess she is reading at least on a 6th grade level and at that level able to answer concrete and inferential questions as well as retain the material. There is no formal data on that, all I can do is base it off of the books I see her reading at home. As you would expect, there are some odd interests that are not typical for 8 year olds. She is a big history buff.

My questions:
Would it be beneficial to obtain a Verbal Expanded Crystallized Index score for her WISC Test?

Does anything significant stand out from these scores? I am worried by the huge discrepancy but the psychologist says it's nothing to worry about.

Is a child truly gifted when there is only one real elevated index score on the WISC-V?

I'm just going to stop there. I have a million questions related to improving her performance and willingness to work and how to help her emotional development. I would really appreciate any insight you may have.

The scores do support the good at reading/writing and average at maths. She would possibly get better achievement scores if she was taught at her level rather than being used as an unpaid teaching assistant (that is not OK). Does her school do SSA? (single subject acceleration).

Hopefully the board experts will drop in soon.

Was the testing done by a school psych or as a private eval? Was the eval specifically looking for giftedness or something else? Was there any testing done beyond just the ability (WISC) and achievement tests?

I'm not a professional, so take what I have to say for what it's worth (not much lol!)... but I'm the parent of 2 2e teens and one teen who isn't 2e but had a severe undiagnosed vision challenge which through off testing when she was younger. I don't know much about the WISC-V, as my kids were all tested awhile ago, using WISC-IV.


The large discrepancy in WISC subtest scores, combined with the lower-than-expected achievement scores and the behaviors you've mentioned all sound like they might potentially be indicating some type of learning challenge. Extremely bright kids can still have learning challenges. When my 2e ds was in early elementary prior to diagnosis, we knew he was extremely bright because of the level of his verbal communication - yet in school he was refusing to do work, seemed to get easily frustrated with work if he didn't know the answer right away, and he was very slow at timed tasks when writing was involved - so we (parents) thought the problem was gifted + perfectionist, when really the problem was he had a huge learning challenge that was masked by the obvious gifted strengths.

If there wasn't any testing done beyond the ability and achievement tests, I'd suggest seeking out either a private neuropsych eval or further testing through the school. You'll most likely get some better feedback here re what types of things to look for - but basically the idea is finding out what's behind the discrepancy in scores and the behaviors you've noted at school.

Best wishes,

polarbear

I can add a bit more information. She is an excellent writer, good handwriting, advanced writing skills for her age. She is able to do a variety of visual puzzles for us at home such as the thinkfun brick by brick set, however she can be slow at them and doesn't enjoy it. If there was a vision problem would those tasks be harder? It's almost seems like she can do it when she has enough time and is in the right frame of mind. She was tested by the school psych. I worry about seeking out a whole new eval. Would it be worth the stress on her? They would have to do a different test as well.

In answer to your specific questions:

1. The VECI may be valuable if you are interested in using it to obtain access to resources such as DYS, since a VECI in the same range as your DC's VCI would be in the qualifying range, but a single primary index score (i.e., the VCI) would not meet criteria. This requires two additional WISC-V subtests, preferably given by the same examiner. Otherwise, I would not normally pursue the VECI.

2. The large diversity of cognitive scores is not necessarily concerning in itself, but does give one pause in combination with the diverse achievement scores, and with your reports of academic frustration, anxiety, and emotional dysregulation. Posters above are accurate in noting the parallels between cognitive strengths and academic strengths, and the importance of trusting your holistic understanding of your child.

3. There are different definitions of intellectual giftedness out there, even among professionals, but I think most clinicians would consider GT-level scores of this magnitude to constitute giftedness, even if they occurred in only one index.

If one were to pursue further testing, either through the school or privately, one might want to include

a) comprehensive academic achievement (even in the strength areas, as there may be subtleties), rather than a computerized multiple-choice test (which is what you have now) (typically by a psychologist or educational diagnostician)
b) assessments of social language (pragmatics) (speech language pathologist)
c) social-emotional assessment (psychologist)
d) measures of fluency/retrieval efficiency/memory & recall (psychologist)
e) fine-motor skills assessment (occupational therapist).

Thank you everyone. I will consider those ideas. I'm pretty sure a fine motor assessment from an OT would not be needed, she has beautiful handwriting. Her social skills are WNL as judged by an SLP informal consult. Bullying seems to come from being a bit younger than the other girls in the class and not sharing the same interests. My major concerns right now would be emotional development. It's probably not worth it to pursue a VECI score right now but I am curious as to the role visual perceptual skills may be playing in her performance.

Thanks again.