Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment NWEA MAP Primary or MPG

Does anyone have any experience with the practical/effective ceilings on MPG or MAP Primary/the difficulty with actually scoring higher past a certain RIT score?

I am pretty familiar with MAP 2-5, but I know much less about this version.

I did find these: https://docs.google.com/document/pub?id=1nA_PlvjvwFTi5vMwRxlfmmVUJo63pfwn67ZAMHaV4oU and https://www.nwea.org/content/uploads/2015/01/MPG-to-MAP-Transition-Guidance-Document-JAN15.pdf

Our schools, however, don't seems to look at the RIT scores when determining the version of test; rather, they base the version solely on age-grade.

Also, did anyone see practical/effective ceilings on the 2-5 version? Yes, it will be different for reading and math.

I am trying to determine whether I am seeing actual stalled growth or kiddos hitting test ceilings. TIA!

How do you know what version they are given? I don't see anything on the report about that.

I'm also wondering if a student's score is lowered the first time they take the test, if they get mostly questions that are too easy, and then they hit only a couple harder ones at the end. In other words, does the test keep going until they are not answering correctly or does it give everyone approx. the same number of questions?

I think they all get the same number of questions...I read that somewhere, and if I find the link, I will post.

The primary version is typically for K-1, but some schools also give it in 2nd. It may or may not appear on your report. The school should know, though.

I don't think the score is supposed to be lower the first time they take the test. The first time DS took the test, however, his MPG math score was much lower than it was the 2nd, and 3rd time. IMO, this was NOT as a result of extreme growth - the 2nd test administration looked more on par with what I think is his "true score" if this makes any sense. In reading, I did not see such a dramatic difference. I think that giving reading MPG to kiddos who have been reading for years is kind of silly.

That is the same link I have for the ceilings. My daughters math score did go down when she went from 2-5 to 6 plus this past year. I did not see a dip when either child went from primary to the 2-5 test.

According to the ceilings chart my rising 4th grader (2-5 MAP) is close to ceiling in math with a 255 and still a little wiggle room in reading with a 237 .

DS scored around 240 for MAP math, I don't know what version it was, but he said it was simple and he didn't even need to write anything down. But for the other computerized testing he has done in the past, I know it went up to super high skills and it was so long, sometimes, that it would take a couple hours for the kids to do. I think it was more like an IQ test in that the kid has to get several in a row wrong before it stops testing. I don't understand how MAP would be all that accurate if a second grader is only given 25 questions but then comes out at a high school equivalent. It probably has to go through a bunch of super easy questions before determining that the kid needs a high level. On the contrary, he said that the reading version was hard at the end and he couldn't figure out what the questions were asking him. It was probably stuff like "what literary device was used...." and kids wouldn't know what it means unless they are actually taught that in school. Even if they read "The Grapes of Wrath" at home, and understand it, that's not going to help.

Good to know about the transition from primary to 2-5, frannieandejsmom.

Based on DD's scores, I have wondered if there is a "soft" ceiling on 2-5 above reading 245, and above math 250. Scores seem to rise, but much more slowly. But perhaps that is just my kiddo!

blackcat, I would assume most second graders take 2-5, but 25 questions? That sounds too short for the 2-5 test - I thought it was longer. I would ask your school - I am wondering if that was almost an abbreviated test or the lower grade version.

Is it possible your DS took the short/"Survey" version of the test? I have no experience with the shorter versions and I am not certain how they compare. http://legacysupport.nwea.org/node/4649

For the reading, I agree. They will get by with simply increasing their reading skills until about a 235 RIT. At that point, if they are not encountering any of the more challenging concepts about literature and language, it is challenging to grow, IMO.

Does anyone know how well the reading MAP (any version) measures above 245? I know that there is technically supposed to be more room (at least on the 6+), but I am wondering if the reading test is really very useful for DD anymore.

I'm not exactly sure how many questions there were, but I remember DD saying something like that...that there are 25 questions and she had 10 left to do the next day (she is so slow)....but that is DD, so who knows.

I looked this all up once (if you could search the forum a year or so back, you might find my previous posts). There is a version where only 25 or so questions are administered. I think there might be situations where up to 35 are, but some of those don't count into your score, if I recall correctly. The test resets to your grade placement if you haven't taken it in a certain number of months--so often, the fall administration has reset to the default starting points, which is items that are slightly below your nominal placement. On the next administration, the starting point is based on your previous score. If you have a third administration that year, and you happen to have scored really well on the second administration, you might run into artificial ceilings, because you already used up most of the high-level items in the item pool, which now can't be repeated for some interval (a year?).

Another factor is the intelligent item selection algorithm, which can be really thrown off by an early error, such as sometimes occurs when young children haven't settled into the testing process yet, or otherwise don't find it sufficiently engaging for full attention. Since the probe is so short, you may not have enough items to work your way back up to the challenging items before the test ends.

And here's the guidance from NWEA on who should take the 2-5 versus the primary version of MAP:

https://www.nwea.org/content/uploads/2015/01/MPG-to-MAP-Transition-Guidance-Document-JAN15.pdf

Note especially the absurd skyrocketing of SEM after about RIT 190 in reading or 200 in math.

So if DS is already scoring around 240 in second grade, should he be given the 6+ version? I'm assuming that he and DD were both given a version with 25 questions (for grades 2-5), although it's possible they gave DD a short version because she is so slow and has anxiety issues.