Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Horrific sibling rivalry

I would agree with the advice to go to counseling... this is somewhat like the situation with my older sister and me - and if not dealt with, it only gets worse. In our case, it was special needs due to disability, not differing LOG - that fueled her jealousy - and her temperament tended to have her do all those negative behavior - yell, slam doors, sulk etc.

Also - make sure you know the peer groups your DD hangs out with. That was one of my parents' regrets - they did not move her out of what ultimately turned out to have been possibly toxic school environment, so her friends only fueled her negative behavior and anger.

My older sister's jealousy even got so bad that when she was 11 and my parents could only take my younger sister on a trip - my dad traveled a lot for work - the 11 year was determined to scare her 3 year old sister to the point that she refused to go to the water at the beach simply because she could not go on the trip.

She has a lot of issues stemming from all that today as an adult which is why we have no contact with her (thank goodness - I have no idea how she would have reacted if she ever got a whiff of the LOG of our kids but it would be ugly). She has not been able to develop the maturity and perspective that one tends to expect with adulthood so the rivalry is stronger than ever - but only in her mind since I don't bother talking to her nor really care that she is out of my life after the constant strife she dragged me through for so many years.

This is a good idea.


This is too shame-based for me. DD has a lot of shame already, which is partly her and partly a reaction to not-ideal parenting. Also, it's not shocking anymore, sadly. I do tell them they are kind people, etc.

I will say that the kids still do have fun together and enjoy each other rather often. I have seen families where there is none of this because the children inhabit very separate spheres, which ours do not. However, I am concerned, because the age difference is going to matter more very soon. DD is growing up. In fact, this could be a hidden but important factor.

Also, I would say that DD is probably somewhat jealous of DS, but DS instigates as well; they are both at fault. He is not by any means simply a victim of a jealous sister with emotional problems.

Both children have good peer relations with friends and at school. People who know them in isolation are often surprised to see how they are together.

Okay, I really think you are dealing with OEs and (mostly normal) jealousy and developmental asynchrony. I know you said it's "horrific" but I think I know what you really mean.

When they are close in age and very different temperamentally but also gifted (whew!) this is sorta inevitable. I don't think it's a LOG thing, either, but not sure (my kids are both about same ability level).

I suggest a lot of deep breathing. For all of you. The kids may very well end up being "besties" again after this period of differentiation.

Sorry for double post.

I would not use the character approach (shame based), either. I think maybe digging down into it via cognition might be helpful, as would broadening your kids' emotional awareness/ability to identify feelings/active work on coping skills.

That's my angle, at home, right now. We are an extremely intense bunch, the whole lotta us. It would be much easier if everyone would have the same emotions simultaneously (ha!).

Oh, I don't really have high blood pressure. It FEELS like I do when I listen to them, though! (as in, I feel my body reacting to their bickering) So in that sense, I am having a physical reaction.

I'm not totally resistant to family counseling, but without getting too far into this, we already have one member of the family in CBT, another member about to be evaluated this summer and likely treated, one more being watched for some other issues...family counseling is feeling like a bit much at the moment. I do feel it is bad, but it's hard for me to judge if it's way out there. I know families where kids are physically hitting each other and/or calling each other mean names, taking/destroying each others' stuff, etc. We don't have that here, but we do have a persistent atmosphere of negativity, unpleasant interactions, quickness to anger, and contentiousness.

ultramarina,

FWIW I agree with everything DeeDee posted above. I also wanted you to know that we went through a period of this two years ago with our dds and it was truly a phase. It happened here when my dds were 11 and 9 years old - they are 13 and 11 now, and I do believe a large part of it was due all the hormonal fluctuation due to going through puberty for my older dd.

I think one thing that's really important to remember is that each of our children are unique individuals, and they might grow up to have completely divergent interests, and that that is OK. They might not become friends who will play together all the time as kids or hang out enjoying the same activities as adults. That doesn't mean they won't share a close sibling bond, and it doesn't mean they will fight. My family does do things together, but we also let our kids pursue their own interests and activities (we have three very different personalities here). We expect and try our best to model good behavior and set behavioral expectations, but we don't expect our kids to play together - does that make sense? The thing that strikes me in your situation, personalities aside, is that your children are 4 years apart and different genders.. plus your dd is 11. Neither one of my dds has been very interested in anything there brother has ever enjoyed, and neither one was very interested in spending much time with a 7 year old boy when they were 11. That may sound horrible, but it's not - it's just a phase. My older dd now loves loves loves playing with the younger kids at school. If she had a younger brother, she'd probably love him to pieces *now*, but most likely not a few years ago lol. And even though she'd probably love him to pieces *now*, she'd want to do her own 13 year old things at home rather than hanging with her brother all the time.

I think it's really difficult to read tone on an internet posting, but when I read your posts they didn't come across to me as a situation that was severe enough to need counseling etc - it sounded like a mom frustrated with sibling behavior. I've so totally been there! For us it truly was a phase.

And the note about teachers/etc not noticing it - my children are angels outside of my house. I hear about that all the time. Sometimes I am convinced the teachers/coaches/whoever/ must be talking about someone else's children! They are sooooo not angels at home! Just remember - at home our kids can be themselves. In public they are trying their best to be accepted - and if they are behaving in public that means that the behavior lessons you are teaching them at home are working, it's just not apparent at home. That's all. At home they can let loose and act out and know that, at the end of the day and through it all, they are loved. They don't have that same security out in the real world. Soo.... they act out with the people who love them most and behave for the people who are truly incidental to their lives. Or at least my kids do. We have lots of deep talks at home about the irony of this

Hope some of that helps -

Best wishes,

polarbear

They unfortunately will do some of this (not to quite the extent) when with each other in public. I hesitate to send them to someone else's house together (they have some friends where this makes sense because the friends have a "matched pair" of sibs), which is too bad. I don't want another parent to have to referee this.

I definitely agree that they are allowed to have their own interests and not be together all the time. As I say...I think some of this may be related to DD pulling away as a natural consequence of her age. She is always allowed to decline him if he wants to play and their rooms are sacrosanct--if they want to be alone in there, I protect that space. DD just requested a lock for her door and I plan to get her one, although it makes me a little apprehensive. However...both are extroverts. So they have a tendency to drift into community space and interact even when I really encourage them to have down time/alone time. Also, though they are 4 years apart and different genders, DS is mature for age, DD is young for age, and nobody is very gender-typed here. They still have common ground, though it's diminishing. I admit, I'm sad about it. But I also recognize it as appropriate and inevitable.

I feel your pain. One line from report: when asked what she would change dd8 said dd14 does not her come into her room and closes her door. Now I have "Do you want to build a snowman stuck in my head! My brother and I are also 4 years apart and fought a lot at those ages. For us it was a phase. But, I feel sad about the current state of sibling relationships here. You aren't alone.

I sent you an IM, ultramarina. Let me just say that I sympathize. My kids are almost the same ages and are the same genders. It is hard to maintain a peaceful home, although our problems are a little different.