Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Too Many Geniuses or Not Enough?

The irony of it is, regardless of what one thinks of the points above, that the flawed system that values convergence of thought and high achievement over high IQ also results in GT programs that are full of white and Asian kids who are often from high SES homes b/c those are kids who are more likely to have been hothoused to an extent or to have parents with a vested interest and knowledge of how to game the system to ensure that their kids get "in."

Very true

As a relatively new poster, madeinuk may be unaware that this board has discussed group differences in IQ before, for example at

http://giftedissues.davidsongifted....cs/96230/Re_Gifted_or_Not.html#Post96230

and the following posts.

Oops, I see.

The sad irony (as I see it, admittedly) is that IQ is the fairest measurement. Someone can have a high IQ but score low on achievement tests, for example. Achievement tests obviously only measure what the person taking the test has been exposed to which will likely have a stronger correlation with non low SES than IQ.

I still think there is a branding issue. Given the huge semantical discrepancies, moving away from categorizing kids to categorizing learning environments may be the way to go. Getting the right groupings may create a self-assortative force.

Such as:
Rigorous competitive
Deep explorations
Sound fundamentals

Interesting. Do you have some references for (b).

Please, let's not go there. As Bostonian says, we've discussed group differences in IQ here before (more than once, actually), it always generates heat, and it doesn't generate light because the main purpose of this board is to discuss the needs of individuals.

I like that! I believe that part of what appeals to me about that is that I see a lot of our current GT ided kids who are more high achievers than gifted going for the "rigorous competitive" whereas my kiddos would better get their needs met in something like "deep explorations." I do suspect that over time if it became clear that one grouping was full of brighter kids, though, that grouping would gain prestige and again be the one to have your kids in.

Hi Everyone,
Writing from Toronto now. I read all 8 pages while I wait for the movers and you discussed IQ tests to death so no need to go there. But somewhere in the middle, someone made a point about athletes that made me think. If you are a good athlete, you can get good general training at your school but if you are in the top 1%, you only get good training if your parents pay. Particularly for anything individual and pay up. And if you are an amazing football player but are in a town without a good football program, you probably not get noticed. If you are MG, you probably can get into some gifted or enriched program and it works. But if you are HG, then it is hard to justify the costs of programs in sparsely populated areas and the onus is similar to having an amazing gymnast as a kid. You have to find the programs and pay for them.

In this age of Internet, there are so many things to choose from and have access, even if you live on the range in Wyoming. But I have long come to the conclusion, even living in NYC with programs-- but generalized programs until 7th grade -- and that is one school, high school for the rest-- that you have to find resources for your kid and supplement and create an optimal program for them.

On an aside, I am reading the price of privilege. And it seems that helicopter parenting aside, she kind of slams the working mother who doesn't really connect with her kids and if you are not having family dinners 5 nights a week -- which I am, (self pat) then you are a bad parent and creating an empty adolescent.

I guess I should have made a new post.

Yeah, kind of sucks to be a parent who isn't independently wealthy, I guess, if your child requires more intensive services than are readily available.

Because being a full-time parent is kind of incompatible with most highly-paid career paths. Not everyone is a single parent by choice. But a good many wind up that way via circumstance.