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    Joined: Aug 2009
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    Originally Posted by jack'smom
    My mom was 34 with me, which at the time was older. We qualify there!

    Same with me. Nowadays, 34 isn�t old at all (IMO).

    Last edited by HelloBaby; 01/10/12 07:39 AM.
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    Originally Posted by Val
    Educated people, who tend to be smarter, tend to have kids when they're older.

    (I'm not sure if there's an implication there that being older raises the IQ of your offspring or has a positive influence on it).

    I was going to bring this up if nobody had. It's a correlation/causation problem. If simply being older led to smarter kids, you should be able to see a pattern of increased IQ among biological siblings.

    When DD was born, I was 30, DW was 25. That would be advanced parenting age historically, but not by modern standards.

    My mom and dad were both 22 when I was born.

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    Originally Posted by Ametrine
    being older when conception occurs is more likely to produce a gifted child.
    This is a great example of Correlation does not imply causation

    Originally Posted by http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Correlation_does_not_imply_causation
    "Correlation does not imply causation" (related to "ignoring a common cause" and questionable cause) is a phrase used in science and statistics to emphasize that correlation between two variables does not automatically imply that one causes the other (though correlation is necessary for linear causation in the absence of any third and countervailing causative variable, and can indicate possible causes or areas for further investigation; in other words, correlation can be a hint).[1][2]

    The opposite belief, correlation proves causation, is a logical fallacy by which two events that occur together are claimed to have a cause-and-effect relationship. The fallacy is also known as cum hoc ergo propter hoc (Latin for "with this, therefore because of this") and false cause. By contrast, the fallacy post hoc ergo propter hoc requires that one event occur before the other and so may be considered a type of cum hoc fallacy.

    In a widely-studied example, numerous epidemiological studies showed that women who were taking combined hormone replacement therapy (HRT) also had a lower-than-average incidence of coronary heart disease (CHD), leading doctors to propose that HRT was protective against CHD. But randomized controlled trials showed that HRT caused a small but statistically significant increase in risk of CHD. Re-analysis of the data from the epidemiological studies showed that women undertaking HRT were more likely to be from higher socio-economic groups (ABC1), with better than average diet and exercise regimens. The use of HRT and decreased incidence of coronary heart disease were coincident effects of a common cause (i.e. the benefits associated with a higher socioeconomic status), rather than cause and effect as had been supposed.[3]

    anyway it's quite possible that there are third factors involved -
    for example, the movie 'Idiocracy' shows a split screen of two families making reproductive decisions - the 'highly intelligent' family displaying all the perfectionism and worry that we see everyday on this board, but in a humorous light. An attempt was made to exaggerate, but I saw a lot of myself.
    www.youtube.com/watch?v=BXRjmyJFzrU


    http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Idiocracy

    Not my favorite movie ever, but 'interesting' - I particularly liked how every time that 'normal' character spoke, all the 'future' people made fun of him for his affected speech. A good reminder of how irritating that can be for our kids (speaking of kids, this movie isn't for most of them!)

    I remember a popular tee shirt when I was in college of a comic book close up of a female with a thought bubble, 'Opps, I forgot to have children.' I think gifted females are more comfortable to challenge gender roles, at least long enough to delay childbearing. I found spending time with my son more interesting than my work life, but I noticed that my local neighbor-moms found the early years of mothering tedious, or complained of that anyway.

    I would guess that older, more experienced parents would be more likely to go through the identification process (which is different from actually having more gifted children) if they have used their advanced age to get more earning power and time off power to go through the identification process. I'd love to see ages of gifted parents in states that don't do gifted testing in the school vs. states that test everyone.

    I also suspect that only children gifted children are more likely to get identified, not because they are smarter, but becuase they probably act out more for a few reasons.
    1) they don't have the relief of a whole passle of sibs to be their home gifted cluster
    2) they don't have the 'home socialization training' of sibs
    3) It's easier for a parent to give 'full attention' to an only, but it isn't easier for a teacher at school to follow suit, so it's more of a contrast.

    Older parents are more likely to grind to a halt after only one child, physically and emotionally. I was 35,DH 42. One kid was enough to wear us out.

    As a 'likely 2E' older mom, I think it took me longer to feel 'grown up enough' to make important life decisions - such as choosing a DH and becoming a parent. Could be my perfectionism for sure. Plus the world was always throwing me curve balls because I didn't know myself as a gifted person, and kept measuring myself against the standards of the people around me and making mistakes that I mercilessly took myself to task over.

    Not my most coherant post, but an interesting topic.
    Love and More Love,
    Grinity



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    I was 25 with first dd9 and 28 with dd6. Dd9 was identified this year in public school as a matter of policy. Dd6 has not been identified. We don't have the money to test and are still trying to make a life for ourselves as we didn't have support growing up. I think that grinity has a very good point that more children go unidentified with parent who had children at a younger age for many reasons.

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    Originally Posted by Grinity
    As a 'likely 2E' older mom, I think it took me longer to feel 'grown up enough' to make important life decisions - such as choosing a DH and becoming a parent. Could be my perfectionism for sure. Plus the world was always throwing me curve balls because I didn't know myself as a gifted person, and kept measuring myself against the standards of the people around me and making mistakes that I mercilessly took myself to task over.

    You've taken this conversation in an interesting direction, because with the causation/correlation problem, I think it would be more instructive for people to share their stories about WHY they had children at the age they did.

    In my case, I came from a poor family, and after a year of failing to put myself through college, I did a 6-year stint in the Navy. I quickly decided that the military life was completely unsuited to family life, and I refused to entertain the idea of a permanent family attachment during my enlistment, which was never going to go beyond the required 6 years. I met DW just about a year after my enlistment ended. We started out as friends for about half a year, lived together for about a year and a half, got married, and then conceived DD on purpose nearly two years after marriage.

    So we basically knew each other for four years before bearing DD. And that timeline was under some pretty severe pressure... DW had endometriosis, and every doctor told us that one of the best treatments for that was pregnancy. But even though both of us felt strongly about having children, neither one of us was comfortable with the idea of having one before the time was right.

    This allowed the condition to progress to the point where DW needed to have a hysterectomy following DD's birth, so it did limit us to the one child. But we otherwise refused to allow the condition to dictate our timeline. And looking back, it seems like it was the right decision. I think we needed that time together to build up our bond, so it could survive the period where DD consumed so much of our lives and left us very little for ourselves, nevermind each other.

    Yeah... there are definitely some strains of perfectionism in that story.

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    Originally Posted by Dude
    You've taken this conversation in an interesting direction, because with the causation/correlation problem, I think it would be more instructive for people to share their stories about WHY they had children at the age they did.

    Because my wife wanted to have a child when she was 24 and I just happened to be 28 at the time.

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    I had our first when I was 28 (DH 33) and second when I was 31 (DH 36).

    I do wish I have them even later. I spent most of my 20s studying, and I want to spend my 30s on my career. It's challenging to juggle a demanding career with 2 small children. I am sure it would be all worth it in my 40s and beyond.

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    Had to laugh a little about what advanced age is thought to be
    I have 3 girls #1 I had at 20 #2 at 38 dh was 55 and #3 at 40 dh was 57 DH (has another dd he was 39) the two younger ones are DYS.... also I believe dh's older dd is also at least hg she's never been tested

    don't know if it matters but they were all naturally conceived

    on the question of why I had my 2 younger children later...after my divorce with my oldest dd I just wanted to spend time with her and work on my career I remarried at 36 decided to have more children about a year later

    Last edited by Skylersmommy; 01/10/12 09:40 AM.
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    A University of Queensland, Australia study suggests that becoming a father at age 40 or older is linked to baby at a higher risk of schizopherenia, autism and syndromes that cause facial and skull abnormalities. They also found that those born to older dads scored more poorly on a range of intelligence tests that looked at concentration, memory, reasoning and reading skills.
    supporting link--------
    http://www.newscientist.com/article/dn16719-older-men-may-have-less-intelligent-kids.html

    older moms have higher risk of having trisomies like down syndrome etc

    the thread is interesting, but we are missing denominator (large population ouside this forum)

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    I had my daughter when I was 22. I was a single parent from the time she was three until she turned 12. I know she was bright because she could read at age 4 but I didn't know anything about gifted kids. As soon as she was reading on her own I stopped reading to her. I was too busy trying to earn a living and attend college at night. Her teachers would tell me that she was very bright but then she went to middle school, became a cheerleader, and academics were not important to her. Her grades went way down, she didn't seem to care, and I couldn't understand why she was like that. I had been able to make good grades while working full time, including some overtime, and going to college at night. She was only interested in socializing and having fun.

    My daughter would fight with my husband who was retired military. He couldn't understand why she wouldn't follow the rules and make good grades. He has a son from his first marriage who tested highly gifted but didn't care about making good grades and staying in school. Having another child at that point didn't seem like a good idea, but I secretly still wanted another child and got pregnant in my late 30's. My husband is almost nine years older than I am.

    While I was pregnant with my son at an advanced age I had no health problems except for the migraines. My son kicked a lot and his kicks were strong, but he had a difficult birth. After he was born his muscles seemed weaker than normal, but he could identify some letters when he was one. When he started reading without being taught and identifying words that were spelled out for him at 2 1/2 he seemed more academically gifted than my daughter did at that age. He had physical delays because of the mild muscle weakness and low physical endurance but he was cognitively advanced. He spent more time more time reading and learning because of the physical issues. He had some sensory processing issues (vestibular and proprioceptive) and at age 11 developed scoliosis and migraines. None of the doctors my son saw ever said anything about our advanced ages causing either the giftedness or the disabilities.

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