Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment (New here) WPPSI-III results & ceiling questions

Hello!

I am brand new to this forum and would like to ask for some help interpreting my son's WPPSI test scores and whether or not he hit the ceiling.

He took the test 10 days before his 6th birthday, so I guess he was scored as a 6 yr old. His scores were:
Verbal IQ: 143 (Info: 19 Vocab: 17 Word Reas: 15)
Perfor IQ: 148 (Block: 18 Matrix: 18 Picture: 17)
Processing Speed: 131 (Coding: 14 (Symbol Search: 17))
FSIQ: 147

These numbers did not come with any written explanation or analysis of results, so my first question is what insights the "old hands" (you guys) have about his results.

My second question is whether he hit the test ceiling. And if so, if we should get him retested, if only to qualify for DYS? From other posts, I understand we would probably have to wait a couple years to take the WISC IV, given its similarities to the WPPSI.

Thanks so much for all of your insights. I am completely new to all this stuff (this is my first post).

(Also, any additional resources you can point me to would also be appreciated).

Best wishes (and thanks for your help!)

Christina B.,

First of all, welcome! Those are excellent scores - you obviously have a smart little guy on your hands.

Unfortunately, I am not an expert on testing, so I will let others answer your more detailed questions.

In general terms, I think your ds most certainly did hit some ceilings. Hindsight being 20-20, it probably would have provided you with more information had you waited until he turned 6 and tested on WISC IV.

Others can correct me if I'm wrong, but I believe you could still go ahead and test on the SBV without waiting, if you were simply trying for a DYS qualifying score.

Has he done any achievement testing? That's the other part of the DYS equation. If his achievement testing was strong, there's always the chance he would be accepted with a "not-quite-there" WPPSI score. I know it has happened in the past.

I hope others will chime in to answer your questions in a more detailed way. I just didn't want you to think your question was going unread.

Thanks so much, Irisheyes!

We haven't done any further testing, as this is all new to us. Our son's (DS's - what does that stand for, by the way? I couldn't find it when I looked around ... seem to be so many acronyms...) public elementary school was being threatened with closure so we had to look around for a different school.

We found a fantastic private gifted school who required this test which we did through the school. That's why there were just scores and no explanation, although they seemed positive about his results. Apparently they liked how similar they all were - no big dips or peaks, I guess.

So we are waiting to see if he will get in, although there are 45 applicants for 3 slots, all with IQs over 130! (And one of those slots goes to a girl!). So we are hopeful and not hopeful, if you know what I mean!

I guess we'll wait to see what the school says in a couple of weeks and go from there. If he doesn't get in, we'll definitely have to reevaluate our options because at his rate, he will top out of the public elementary system in 2nd or 3rd grade...

Thanks so much for your feedback, it was very useful!

Per the hindsight argument, I didn't know any better, but now after just some preliminary research, I'm surprised the school didn't come up with this option themselves. If we don't get in will probably do the SBV, but don't know if it is worth the cost. About how much do they run, do you know? It might be hard to convince his dad it is worth it if he already has such high scores. Seems a little greedy, unless DYS really is a good program... Does anyone have feedback about what it has done for them?

Thanks, again!

Basically, whenever the subtest score is 17 or higher, it's considered a ceiling on that particular subtest. I think you can take a WISC IV one year after you take the WPPSI (especially since it's a different test so there should be virtually no identical questions with the preschool version). Your son is without any doubt gifted, however, WISC IV at some point later is probably a good idea as it is a little longer in length than the preschool test and includes Working Memory. Also, it's probably a bit harder as well as it's designed for older kids. You will get slightly more reliable and complete data than with the WPPSI.

Here are some stories from YS kids and their parents:
http://www.davidsongifted.org/young...oung_Scholars___Success_Stories_422.aspx

hth!

Thanks so much all! Sounds like a good idea to wait a year, anyway. (Although I'm worried about working memory, as my son has phenomenal long term memory, but seems so distracted in "the now" that I don't know if he'll do very well on working memory. Although I admit, I don't know much about it, except that as a child I was given an IQ test where they asked me to repeat a series of numbers forward & backward... Thanks too for the link to the YS kid's perspectives...

After reading Deborah Ruf's article, I think he is probably a level 4 plus. He fits in with every age group and doesn't mind doing pretty pedestrian Kindergarten activities - although the other day, he asked me what a square root was...

Our children also attend a private, gifted school that tests in using the WPPSI. In my experience, and YMMV (your mileage may vary), our school seems most interested in seeing if your child surpasses the 130 threshold and that's it. They are not as interested in "how high" they might be. So the WPPSI is enough for them.

Again, this may just be my experience.

But that is why we are considering having my dd5 retested after she turns 6 with an independent tester. I want that information and may use it to apply to DYS.

Oh - and ds or dd means "dear son" or "dear daughter" - just a nice way to refer to them without using actual names.

Thanks again, Irisheyes! Both your explanations sound right on the money. Of course the school is only interested in the threshhold - that's why they have the play date, et. al. to weed the pack... I'm trying not to be too invested in their response immediately after the test which was very positive and reached out proactively to us (several times). Could be just politeness.

On pins & needles ...

When will you know about the school's admissions decision?

Those are very good and solid scores. 19 is the absolute highest score you can get on any subtest.

A couple of random comments. One thing on his favor is that if he had been tested 11 days later, he would have been normed as a 6 year old, but since he was not quite 6, then he was compared to kids 5 years and 9 monhts (I believe). The exact same test responses taken on both sides of the divide, would result in different scores.

Davidson's accepts GAI (General Ability Index) in addition to FSIQ or verbal/performance. While technically there is no GAI in the WPSSI, gifted schools in our area are interested in that. Pyschologists can calculate that from verbal plus performance. My dd's WPPSI report includes that calculation. It is my wild guess that since he is so strong both verbally and non-verbally (143 and 148), that maybe that index for him (my other dd's report called it Full scale w/o coding) could potentially be 150.

If I were you, I would ask if you can talk to the tester (maybe after admission decisions are sent), and ask them to calculate that for you. There is a way to access that info for the WISC (on a techical report found online), but I have no idea whether it would be the same for the WPPSI.

I would definitely consider doing achievement testing. As PP have said, if his achievement scores are very strong, they might take him as a DYS. It is worth a try.

A couple of more things. The gifted school probably doesn't have that many kids scoring in that range; and they might be excited about having a kid like your DS. OTOH, maybe they realize that his needs are very different fom those of the other students. If he is accepted, I would talk to the principal about how they acommodate the kids that are very gifted. If they were reaching out to you, then maybe that is the case (hope I am not contributing to false hope).

IF they don;t accept him, have you looked into your public school's gifted program? Do they have one, which grade does it start? With those scores he shouldn't have any problem qualifying.

Good luck!

Welcome Christina B.

No help to give on the testing, but if you go to the Parenting and Advocacy list, you will see the top thread is all about acronyms. I know I was a bit confused when I started reading all the posts and say so many ds's and dd's and btdt's.