Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums Pre-school please inundate me with advice :-)

I have already posted much of this in other places, but in case you haven't read any of it, here it is: I have a bright 3.5 year old girl who has always been very verbally advanced(letter sounds by 1.5, early reading at two, some spelling at two, making up elaborate stories, ryhmes, jokes, at two, using very sophisticated language now at three and reading much better. Her memory is frightening). She is also quite bright with puzzles, shapes, and numbers, and scored very nicely on an IQ test in verbal and performance though she is too young for it to be valid etc. She has been attending preschool twice a week for three hours and many of the children in her class turned four at the beginning of the year whereas she will turn four in May of this year. Now I am trying to decide what to do for preschool next year and kindergarten the year after. Her school is very play based and their "academics" are covering things she knew before her second birthday. I COULD move her to a longer, more academic program, but I see value in letting her just learn to socialize better and not be off to school that much yet. Our kindergarten only goes from 8:00 until 10:40 every day. She can sit for story time and loves to participate in circle time, but is a very very high energy, spirited, bossy, chatty little girl. I would not call her emotionally mature, but she isn't the worst in the bunch either and pays rapt attention to books when they are read or if something interesting is happening. Many of the children in my upper middle class district will hold their children back until they are 6 or have children who turn 6 soon after kindergarten starts, so even if she goes on time, she will be way ahead academically but possibly behind emotionally and socially. She has wonderful fine motor skills and her drawing is very sophisticated (animals with bodies, heads,tails, antlers, eyes, nose, mouth,ears, hooves, etc.)and her coloring is very neat, in the lines, etc. Her teacher says she give directions for a craft and my DD3 just heads to her table and jumps in and needs little guidance. She has always been a little slow with her gross motor and is a little clumsy at times and is one of the shortest kids in her preschool class. She is pretty(the only reason I am mentioning this is because I have read studies that suggest that children are treated differently based on appearance) and outgoing and the other kids do like her, but sometimes she overwhelms and scares them with her intensity and impulsiveness. Homeschooling is not an option: she doesn't want to learn from me, loves being around other kids, and I need breaks from her intensity. I just worry what in the world environment would be the right fit for her and will take any advice. Thanks.

Your dd sounds quite a bit like my older dd (age 11 now) right down to the amazing memory & great small motor skills and slower gross motor skills. Mine, however, wasn't reading as early as yours but she really took off once she did. I have a few thoughts.

First, I would personally not move her to the more academic kindergarten. She will already know the material and probably be frustrated with the stress on academics she has already mastered.

In our area, too, we have a lot of kids who are held out for K and are quite a bit older as a result. Both of my girls have late summer/fall bds and are much younger. I don't regret starting them when I did even if their grade peers are sometimes 18 months+ older than they are. Dd#1 wound up skipping 5th grade, so she is 2-2.5 yrs younger than some of the kids in her grade at this point. Although some are still just a year or so older.

We are moving more in the direction of homeschooling at this point. Dd#2 is supplementing at home/partially hsing and we are researching hsing for the year after next when they hit middle school and high school respectively. This is, of course, not the only route and may not be the one for your family or dd.

The worst year dd#1 had in school was first grade. This is the reason I'm advising not going toward the schooling with a greater emphasis on academics. Dd#1's first grade was a pressure cooker with flash cards for sight words & math facts, timed tests for math facts, and copious amounts of repetition in the form of repeated readings of the same books to gain fluency, writing spelling words over and over and in sentences to memorize them, etc. She totally fell apart, worked very slowly, missed recess to complete work, and started telling me that she wished she had never been born.

She knew the material but was too young at 6 to cope with being drilled over and over on things she already knew. I doubt that a more academic focused K program is going to be academically appropriate for the degree of advancement that you describe. It is probably just going to be a higher pressured environment with more testing, more focus on learning the fundamentals and getting many of the kids above grade level (but still less ahead than your dd already is).

I'd stick with the play based program for pre-K and K and then reevaluate in 1st. At that point, your best bets are probably going to be a more academic program with significant subject acceleration (sending her to a higher grade classroom for certain subjects including language arts), homeschooling, skipping a grade, or a self contained gifted program that isn't just a high achiever program but a program designed for kids who learn differently.

Twinkle toes, I agree with cricket. She very nicely summed it up so nicely I can't think of anything to say other than "I concur." :-)

I agree with ideas to keep her out of academic preschools and kindergartens. If you think she might be a bit behind socially, play-based pre-K will be exactly where she belongs. In that environment, the focus will be on fun and learning to function in a group.

Have you thought about advocating for her to skip kindergarten? We did this with our DD5, who's in first and partial second now. She had mastered K level stuff well before she would have started kindergarten. Her brother was in first grade at this school, and I brought her with me every day when I collected him. The teachers got to know her and it was pretty easy to convince them to let her skip K (though they also tested her to be sure, including some end of 1st tests, which led to the second-grade-level work that she does). If she doesn't have an older sibling in the school, you can still bring her for occasional visits to let them get to know her.

Skips are usually easier at private schools, if that's an option.

Val

One bit of wisdom that seems to come out of pre-K discussions here is that no academics is better than wrong academics.

The learn-to-read year is really the hard year for kids who are way ahead. For us, as for Cricket2, that's also 1st grade, and it was when we hit the wall with DS8. It was very phonics-based, very sloooooow. But for some places apparently that happens in the K year. If your DD is reading, then that learn-to-read year, whichever it is, is the one I'd skip.

I'll jump in with another very quick thought after reading the above:

I wonder how your DD feels about playing with same aged children?

You may consider having alternatives where she can play with children older than here by 2-3 years, who would match her intellectually. More interesting play.

Thanks everyone. Cricket, I am really sorry your DD had to endure that hellish first grade. How awful. I called the public school where she may go and asked to visit a kindergarten class or observe and they said no. They already seem hostile and I wonder what the future holds. In kindergarten they teach letter sounds and words like cat dog mom etc, that she knew at two. What in the world is that going to be like for her? I hope they also sing and do crafts and read stories for a good portion of the day. Sometimes she pretends to not be able to read and I asked why and she said, "Little children my age can't read" and I tried to tell her that yes, some little children her age can and it is perfectly OK. I am sure she feels different because the children at her preschool do not do it and is already hiding things. She talks in babyish language around them. I am sure this is the same story for so many on here. Someone asked if she likes playing with her agemates and she does since she can enjoy just being silly and rowdy and goofy. You really wouldn't think she were a smart kid if you saw her most of the time jumping and making weird animal noises and doing crazy dances so she isn't always looking for some profound mental stimulation from her peers--she goes to adults for so much.

Cricket - great response, totally agree. I also agree that no academics definitely beats bad academics. Particularly for young children.

I think our learn to read year is all day kindergarten. But it was less drill, less structure, more fun and creative and open ended stuff than first grade. 1st grade year was really dry and awful for my DS. I just wish we would have pulled him out sooner. So look closely at all programs/options/skips available to you. I have a child happily homeschooling now that I never thought it would be possible to do with her. You never know! Take it one step at a time. You can always re-evaluate later. Good luck!

Thanks. I actually took her out and homeschooled the last quarter after the principal refused to move her to a different class. I just wish that I had done it sooner. I work pt though, so hsing full time has not been in the cards yet. We are working on creating something such that I don't need to work outside of the home and can move more back in that direction since it seems to be the preference of my oldest.

thanks, now I am paranoid of first grade LOL She may be a very different child in three or four years. Three is still a baby, but my baby's brain just makes me forget just how little she is and how much she will change. I know I am going to need guidance along the way and it truly helps to hear from people who have gone before us. Thanks again.