Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment Should we have another assessment?

Touche' Kriston!!

I've been told the same thing about Dr Silverman. $1500. is alot of money but it's all about perspective. Just how important is your child? Would you pay 1500 for surgery? In my mind this is diagnostics, same as you would have done for a physical problem. As far as having it done cheaper somewhere else? Maybe it is a little on the "overkill" side but isn't it better to get it done once and get it done right?

Just BTW, I don't think money has to equate to a good testing experience or a cheaper tester to a bad one. We actually had a better testing experience with a less experienced psychologist than Dr. Amend. But I also don't think that greater expense necessarily equals snake-oil salesman.

It's a pretty variable industry cost-wise, at least from what I've seen.

Stating that someone appears to be pushing for more testing than would likely be necessary isn't smearing anyone unfairly. Frankly I do not know Dr. Amend. So the question is what do you know about him that you hold him in such high regard? Unless you have a professional working relationship with him or any other doctor you really don't have a clue as to how good or bad a doctor is.

I'm quite sure that investors putting money in Mr. Madoff's investment fund thought he was an excellent fund manager... yet we know where that ended. If someone is charging $1,000 to change the oil in your car it doesn't mean they aren't doing a good job of changing the oil. They might do a fine job, but it doesn't mean that they aren't trying to make money and it doesn't mean that they aren't trying to charge as much as they can.

The only thing about Dr. Amend that would give me pause to use him would be his website. I would wonder why he has two offices in two different cities. I would wonder if he was actually doing all the testing and work or if he was having other do work for him. But if you believe he is a good doctor you have the right to that opinion. I don't know his work, so I can only say that it sounds like a rather excessive amount of testing and expense.

The goal is always to get it done right... but you appear to be assuming that the price has any relationship to the quality of the service. Does a Rolex keep better time than a Seiko watch? No, in fact a Seiko would be capable of more accurate time... Smart money would look at the average rate for a procedure, and then look at other factors to decide which doctor to use. Just going out and saying I want the most expensive doctor isn't going to insure you get quality care.

Most people would pay price when it comes to their children, that fact is also known and used by some people to charge excessive fees.

So no one who is not also in the business can know if a person has a lot of business? I know that he has a long waitlist for appointments because I know other parents of GT kids who are trying to get their kids in to see him. He is not out scraping up work.

I know he is well-regarded because my son was tested by him and I live in the area he serves. He's a national expert. Seriously. His books are highly regarded by parents, educators and other psychologists. He is a proponent of serving the needs of GT kids. If you are the parent of a GT child, you tend to learn these things.

Again, I am not saying that the child in question requires that much testing. I have no idea if it's necessary or worth the money. It's a lot of money.

I *am* saying that you don't know that the child *doesn't* need it, and I'm saying that there are better ways to ask if that much testing is necessary than to smear Dr. Amend's reputation without even knowing him as you did.

P.S. He is doing the testing himself for that price. He does have assistants, but he charges less if you see one of them. I know because we saw him.

I didn't say you had to know him professionally to know whether he has a lot of business. I said you would have to know him and work with him professionally to know if he was a good doctor. You used him and were happy with the results. So you assume he is a good doctor. What about the parents that used him and didn't like the results, I'm pretty sure they would simply assume that he was a bad doctor. In any event, neither parent is really going to know if he is a good doctor or not.

You should reread what you wrote... "I know he is well-regarded because my son was tested by him and I live in the area he serves." Do you really think because a doctor performs a test and live in your area that he is "well-regarded"?

I must say that considering how you assume anyone even mentioning that his prices are high or that he seems to want to do a lot of testing is smearing his name, makes me wonder if you are maybe his wife or mother.

I'm fairly new to these forums so perhaps someone could explain the rules to me - are there rules against flaming here? Both the Madoff and the wife and mother comment should be considered way over the line in my opinion.

Dr. H doesn't seem particularly well informed about the complexity of gifted+Asperger's concerns. It isn't as simply as just get Asperger's diagnosed and boom you are done. We started with an evaluation from a perfectly competent psychologist who didn't know anything about giftedness and we learned very little that was actually helpful to us. The autistic spectrum is huge and simply saying "aha that kid is on it" doesn't really help a whole lot. Especially HG and PG kids can look very much like they have Asperger's when they don't and misdiagnosis is something that happens quite a bit. Obviously, you can't really help a kid if you don't define the special need accurately in the first place.

And, even if a parent gets an accurate diagnosis of Asperger's knowing how to approach that in a gifted child may be different because there may be a question of how to fit special services in with needed academic acceleration. Social and emotional considerations may also be different when the child is both gifted and has Asperger's. Understanding the child's intellectual strengths may help in creating an effective plan to address some of their challenges.

I don't think every parent who wants to get their child evaluated for giftedness needs to hire a national expert like Dr. Webb or Dr. Amend. However, if you've exhausted local options and you are dealing with a child who is likely not just gifted but disabled, I believe it makes sense to consult with someone who has actually treated a sizable number of kids with similar challenges. Just like if your child needed heart surgery. If no one in your area was very familiar with the particulars of their condition you'd hopefully seek help from someone more experienced. People who have actually parented a 2e child know that really understanding their child's challenges and having a plan to address them is every bit as important.

As far as Dr. Amend being well regarded, that is simply a fact. He is nationally known as an expert in gifted children and in 2e children especially gifted kids with Asperger's. He's written well received books and is involved in top gifted organizations like SENG and the Davidson Institute. He was recommended to the poster for a reason. I am glad to hear she's getting a consultation and I hope she finds it helpful in sorting out what her child needs. I've been in her shoes and it is not an easy place to be. Getting further evaluations made all the difference for our child.

Now that's a bit much. We tend to shy away from personal attacks on our boards, DrH.

Kriston, like me and *many* posters on this board, have done a lot of research on GT issues and testers. When a newbie joins the board and starts blasting people with statements that seem largely based on assumptions without posting an intro or any reason they're here, it raises the suspicion of regular posters who are, as a rule, very well-informed.

I'd trust Kriston's assessment of Dr. Amend, OP.

No, you asked how I knew he was well-regarded unless I am in the business. My response was that I know because a) he tested my son, so I have some personal experience with him, and b) because he serves my local area, and so I know MANY people who have used him as a tester. He has also spoken to a group of parents of GT kids that I have attended (and to other groups in the area that I have not attended, but know about). If he were a snake-oil salesman, I think I'd have some sense of it by now...as would the entire rest of the gifted community at large!

That he is nationally recognized as an expert is, as Mia and passthepotatoes have noted, simply a fact. Do your research. Check the titles of books that people praise. His books are there. Check the speakers at national GT conferences. He is there as a speaker.

Again, I will reiterate that his eminence in the field does NOT necessarily mean that Squirt should spend the money to take her child to KY to see him. I agree with you that higher cost does not necessarily equal better value, and I have stated that repeatedly. But you made specific claims about a specific person. I found that to be problematic, and so I defended his professional status.

For the record, I am not his wife or connected to him or his business in any way. I just don't like to see aspersions cast on a good person who is not around to defend himself.

And now I feel I have defended my position on this sufficiently. Moving on...