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    Joined: Oct 2014
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    As far as I can tell, there is nothing that will destroy love of math faster and more thoroughly than elementary school. As DS went from utter math monster, to thinking he both hated math AND was no good at it, I found it necessary to constantly reiterate that what he did at school was not math. It was repetitive computation (and lots and lots and lots of writing), but it was not math. It's been a struggle to keep the idea of "math" attached to those things in which he finds great beauty and joy.

    It's been an even greater struggle to convince him that he can and must work hard, on hard problems that he doesn't know how to do, in order to find that beauty. Many of you provide strong reminders of why it's so hard on kids to wait so long before experiencing their first math that requires them to think. OK, sorry about rant. My actual response to OP now blush

    Labmom, since you're homeschooling, how essential is it to follow a particular curriculum and accomplish specific tasks (i.e. do Algebra next year?). Can you take some time (even if just the first few months) to simply explore neat ideas? Wallow in videos (like Numberphile and the zillion awesome links down the side) and cool books (from Fred to Penrose the Cat to Martin Gardner). In other words, teach her to think mathematically, and solve problems, but not necessarily focus on the next step in the math curriculum?

    A transition step might be to build some problem solving skills - and confidence - by working on some math contest challenges at a level a bit below her current abilities. The actual math in the contest questions won't be hard; it's the learning to think that's tricky. I find the Math Kangaroo questions, for example, require little math but a lot of out-of-the-box thinking (don't know if the US questions are similar; here's ours: https://kangaroo.math.ca/index.php?kn_mod=samples&year=NO).

    Also, you may find quite different types of math appeal to different kinds of thinkers. DS is extremely visual spatial, and adores geometry and anything visualizable; linear stuff like algebra, not so much. He endured AoPS Algebra until we got to the chapter on Cartesian planes, and suddenly he is literally quivering and giggling with excitement (me, I'm way better at algebra). If you have the flexibility to find what floats her boat, and focus there for a while, it might be easier to then go back later and work on some of the missing tools that will help her do the kinds of problems/ math she likes. (In our house, Algebra is a necessary but unpleasant step to get to AoPS geometry).

    Keep us posted - this is obviously a challenge shared by many. Good luck, and good for you for taking the leap into homeshooling; I hope it goes really well.

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    Labmom Offline OP
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    Yes, yes, and YES...to everything you wrote Platypus! My linear brain wants to move in the must follow a path mode, but DD would welcome a mix up of ideas. And my end goal is to get her to love (or as I said at least tolerate) the math process...which isn't rote work but problem solving. She thinks way outside of the box in her daily life and problem solves quite well.

    You comments made me think back to when she was 3-5 and loved anything "mathy" (which was really just problem solving at that point). At that time I thought she would soar in mathematics because she "got it". Enter life in public, then private school, and an awful program called "Everyday Mathematics" and it sucked the joy right out of her. And I was stupid enough to believe the teachers that this was the way to deeper understanding and I should stop doing what we were doing at home. Stupid me! Trust your instincts folks......

    Thanks again to all of you...now I am off to find some cool, interesting things to bring the spark back!

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    Originally Posted by Labmom
    Originally Posted by bluemagic
    My DS16 is also very good at math, picks up new concepts quickly and test well. But it has always taken him a lot longer to do math homework than the other kids in his gifted program making math frustrating. I didn't really understand what was going on until I got DS tested last summer. DS has much lower low processing & working memory but very gifted at Perceptual Reasoning. Therefore explaining why he picks up the material easy but gets bogged down in hours of homework. Therefore you might want a math program that doesn't include large amounts of practice.


    You might be onto something here....her processing speed is quite a bit lower than her Perceptual Reasoning as well. It is hard for me to figure out how much work to "assign" to see if she has truly grasped a concept and we are OK to move on. Hopefully I will figure this out fairly quickly or we will both be struggling! We are currently refreshing Pre-Algebra so she will be ready for Algebra in the Fall.

    Three to five problems is all it takes to see if someone has a concept. If they do move on...if they don't then who wants someone practicing something wrong for twenty problems.

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    Originally Posted by Labmom
    "Everyday Mathematics"
    Yes, many parents have voiced concerns and complaints about this program, which was created for common core standards.

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    You could try looking at the LivingMath! website for non-textbook ideas. We have heaps of recreational math books at home, mostly Martin Gardner, but also a stack of Murderous Maths, Theoni Pappas books, and a random assortment of others. DS9 also goes on Vi Hart and Numberphile binges.

    There are also lots of math books like Balance Benders out there. My kids generally like doing these, and don't consider them math.

    DD8 seems to be similar: good at math, but seems to think she isn't and says she hates it. I'm working on turning it around, too. This summer we are trying a combination of Khan Academy (she tolerates) and LoF (she loves), which I think of like dinner and dessert.

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    Originally Posted by indigo
    Originally Posted by Labmom
    "Everyday Mathematics"
    Yes, many parents have voiced concerns and complaints about this program, which was created for common core standards.


    Are you sure about that? I am not in the US but Everyday Math was first published in1988 according to their site and complaints about common core seem alot more recent than that.

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    Originally Posted by puffin
    Originally Posted by indigo
    Originally Posted by Labmom
    "Everyday Mathematics"
    Yes, many parents have voiced concerns and complaints about this program, which was created for common core standards.


    Are you sure about that? I am not in the US but Everyday Math was first published in1988 according to their site and complaints about common core seem alot more recent than that.
    Sorry for the imprecise language.
    Quoting from the website: "engineered for the Common Core State Standards".
    EM4 is the "aligned" version, created/engineered for CCSSM.
    This is the Everyday Math that most families/students are familiar with, as EM has been put into widespread use specifically because of common core, hence the recent complaints.

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    EDM has been around used increasingly since the first edition in '98, and wasn't created for CC state standards (which the NGA officially organized in 2009). EDM has had to align with CCSS, though, in it's latest edition, and there's some conflict over it; for example, the kids were previously not pushed using EDM to do rote memorization, but now they do math fact fluency. Also, the lack of technology references in the CCSS might conflict with the EDM encouragement of use of calculators. (Note, as a non-educator, my observation compares extended family & friend experiences in elementary arithmetic ten years ago to my kids today.)

    Last edited by longcut; 07/13/15 09:21 AM.
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    I got an email from CTY about a game called Descarte's Cove that looks a bit like Myst - could be fun. I am on the fence myself as coming from CTY it is automatically $$++ does anyone here have any experience with this program/game?

    Last edited by madeinuk; 07/13/15 09:42 AM.

    Become what you are
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    The Number Devil...madeinuk, we picked this up at the library and DD won't put it down. Thanks!

    In our area, EM preceded the Common Core by many years. Now we have the double whammy...Common Core EM.

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