Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment New Member- Help with testing please

Hi friends- new here, and I am completely lost, so I am hoping some of you can offer guidance from your experience.I'll jump to the point. Requested IQ test from the public school fo rmy grade K age 6 DD- they told me they were doing a full assessment but only completed a "Kauffman Brief Intelligence Test". Scores from this were much lower than I or her teacher expected (129 Verbal, 122NV, 128 Composite). Tester didn't seem to be able to speak well to scoring method, just saying she used the formula that came with the test. She explained that scoring continues until the child misses 4 questions in a row, my daughter tested out into the 16+ age range on both verbal and non verbal portions.
My questions is: is there any reason to suspect this is an unreliable measure? Starting to think I have been delusional. DD has most "characteristics" of gifted children, reading at age 3, math computations in her head, incredible memory, etc. As well as I know her, her teacher and other professionals I have spoken with who know her expected her to test into "gifted" range. Should we consider seeking a private psychologist to the testing and get a WISC or a SB? (and how do I find one0 Hoagies didn't have a suggestion for my area). I wanted testing to get a picture of her ability for ideal school placement, and possibly enrichment programs that require IQ 135+. DD is refusing to work at school, puts forth minimal effort and is quickly losing interest/ desire to learn at school. Any input/advice offered is welcome, please. I am feeling lost!

First off, welcome! Secondly, those scores are not bad--actually they're quite good. (If you include the confidence interval/standard error of measurement, they are not significantly different from GT range.) Whether they turn out to be representative of your daughter or not, they still represent a very small chunk of the population. Onto the meat: the KBIT is a screening instrument--all right as far as it goes, but not to be compared to a true comprehensive cognitive assessment, such as the WISC or SB, or even the KABC, DAS, or WJ. I've used it for gifted screening in the past, but that was more a function of the trade-offs involved in testing many, many children in a short period of time. Many psychologists prefer it for young children, because it is short, and they choose to reduce factors of fatigue, at the expense of detail. I wouldn't call it unreliable per se, I just wouldn't ask it to do more than that for which it was designed.

Another significant consideration is age. Early childhood scores are notoriously unstable, partly due to the vagaries of maintaining optimal test behavior in a small child, and partly due to the wide normal variation in developmental curves. In another two or three years, you'll probably be able to obtain a more accurate picture of her cognition.

If scores are important to your family, then, by all means get a WISC-V or SBV done, knowing that they will be subject to the same early childhood score instability, but more wide-ranging in cognitive domains. However, once you've done one, you will close the door on retesting with the same instrument for another two years, as that is the minimum interval for valid retesting.

At this point, I would be less concerned with exact scores, and pay closer attention to qualitative concerns. An IQ of 130 and an IQ of 140 are not that different at age 6, in terms of feeling that kindergarten is not academically challenging or engaging. How she responds to that frustration can be affected as much by her temperament and (especially) her classroom environment as by her LOG.

Thanks, Aeh, that helps put things in perspective a bit. I understand her scores were good by comparison, but her teacher and I both were surprised by them and didn't feel that they really reflected her true ability. Perhaps it's just too soon. I also know they did the screening on a particularly "off" day for her (getting sick, no sleep, etc.), but of course they don't tell you in advance what test they are doing or when, so no avoiding that.
I did a little digging this afternoon and found a few sources that indicated the Kbit2 can fail to identify some gifted children as compared to the WISC III and IV (not the WISC V?), so screeners should "use caution" when screening for gifted programs. Then I saw other articles stating that the KBIT gave scores higher than the WISC and my head really started spinning!I suppose you must be careful about which versions you are comparing if you really want to split hairs.
But truly, we are concerned about her getting the best fit academically, because she often (not always) has a very difficult personality. High perfectionism, refuses tasks or negotiates to get out of work, "plays dumb" pretending she doesn't know her alphabet or the days of the week, and just generally drives us mad if she feels like causing trouble. Other times she is an absolute dream to work with. We are struggling to find out what type of environment will bring out more of the "dream" student and less of the uncooperative streak in her. I was looking to testing to see if I could qualify her for some of the youth programs offered by Davidson and others, hoping that being exposed to material designed to engage her interest and challenge her might help.

Just a quick note of support, welcome!
I would retest if I were you, your intuition is probably more reflective of what you are seeing than that quick test. We decided to test our son because we really needed to know where to start with school. I'm so glad we did and after researching and talking with the wonderful people on this forum, I suspect that our son's scores will be higher next time he is tested, if he is tested in the future.

When I first contacted the school about having her tested, I also looked around for a private psychologist who had experience with educational testing for gifted children. I really didn't have any luck, unfortunately. The one person I managed to find who does it told me the school would be better at it because they screen kids all the time for LD. (Not the same thing, but good experience to have.) This person also told me the different IQ tests were all "basically the same" and there is no need to worry about finding the "right" test to bring out my daughters strengths. Needless to say, I wasn't filled with confidence.
If we do decide to move forward with further testing,(we may still decide to wait a few years), can anyone recommend a good resource to look for a qualified professional experienced with gifted children? The hoagies site didn't have anyone for our state.

I used the psychology department of the local major university. The testing was completed by a grad student and supervised by professor. This particular university does research on giftedness (we participated) and so is very familiar with gifted testing. And they do research into anxiety. Something of concern for one of my two kids. I hit the jackpot in finding a place for testing for my kids where they were experts in my areas of concern.

They do it on a sliding scale and we got an additional discount for participating in the gifted study (which was a few addition rating scales and questionnaires to fill out...the research they were doing was on parenting styles and the gifted child).

Welcome! We used the Hoagie's list, and found an excellent tester: http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/psychologists.htm. Your DD sounds a bit like mine, btw...she is very, very self-directed, which can sometimes border on uncooperative. Trying to work with the school to find good teacher fit before the year starts has helped with this.

We waited to test until we needed it for a program. My DC were tested between ages 6-8, and the results did match what I see in real life.

Best wishes to you and your DD!

These statements don't actually bother me. There may be subtle differences between the tests, but I don't think that any of the full (not screening) instruments would miss a gifted child entirely. aeh, do you agree?

Yes. Though the tests each have different strengths, and there are nuances which favor certain kinds of giftedness in each test, all of the standard comprehensive cognitive instruments should be able to spot some indication of giftedness, with the possible exception of certain types of 2e kids, whose testing profiles might require a little more clinical skill to interpret. But even then, none of the tests is likely to miss giftedness entirely, somewhere among the index scores, even if the global score doesn't hit the magic threshold.

I have my favorites, of course, for various reasons, but I wouldn't discount results from one of the other ones. The more important perspective on the "right" test is actually the examiner, who is largely responsible for setting the examinee at ease, drawing out optimal performance from her, and having the clinical skill to interpret test behavior and results in the context of the child and her family system.

Aha, okay... this is helpful, thank you! I was wondering if there was a test that best compensates for slower processing speed, because I was afraid that it could skew her results. In other words, what if she doesn't hit the magic number because she sabotages herself by making the blocks line up perfectly or stalling the questioner by analyzing the questions... Also a test that highlights her working memory. (I don't think that is a factor on the Kbit?)
At this point I am looking to dig a little deeper, because I don't think the Kbit she completed really matches what we see. (I feel a lot better that teacher agrees). Her memory is of particular interest to me. As young as 2 years old she would go somewhere once and be able to direct you back to the same place. I know a lot of young kids will memorize the way to school, or to the grocery store or something, but having only been somewhere once before? For some odd reason people get so fixated that she learned to read at 4 (assuming they believe me) but this information doesn't seem at all useful. Maybe because it doesn't directly translate to academics? (It's not on the MAP test! lol. not really, that's pretty sad.) We don't really NEED testing done at this point. I was just thinking that IF she did test into a certain range it would open doors to more opportunity. (online programs, etc.) Thanks everyone!