Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments quick preschool decision needed

Well I was hoping to not need to ask this but anyway, DD4 is having issues at preschool (bored and an issue with one child who may be bullying her.)I have been very happy with this preschool, although this term - since May there has been a lack of learning stories on the kids which I find a little troubling 5 weeks into term. My plan was to go in on Monday and readdress the bullying problem and lack of progress reports and go from there.

DD has her WSSP test this week from Wednesday(4 sessions over 2 weeks)and I had put her on a wait list for our local Montessori as per the EP who felt after testing that may come out as a best option. Well a place has come up, either we take it immediately or go to the back of the queue. Any advice, I'm leaning toward changing her as she only has 9 months left before school and I think it would be nice for her to get a few weeks in before the winter holidays (NZ)

However I am concerned after testing that it might come back that Montessori is not the right fit. If it's any help, she has average abilities in maths, but we expect to see reasonably high visual processing and verbal skills. She does seem to crave a bit of order but at the same time doesn't like to be moved on from her chosen activity, I don't know enough about Montessori to know if that is something that is accommodated. I have a good friend whose kids go to a different centre and she describes it as quite regimented, which DD would not enjoy at all. My gut feeling is that mont is the best choice but wondering what you all think about waiting for testing first

I don't know that the testing would show you something that really would give you useful information for making the decision.

The success of a Montessori program really depends on the teacher and how it's implemented.

My son went to Montessori and I am a huge believer in the theories. I loved how they were introduced to complex subjects even in the early years (though not necessarily using the true terms). I found myself incredibly disappointed when it ultimately didn't work out.

With my son, the problem was with the amount of repetition required before moving on to a more difficult topic. For example, he had to do an activity where you had to physically place a bar of 3 blue blocks together with a bar of 7 red blocks to see that 3+7=10. He did this daily for months. And when he made a mistake on one page where his mind was just clearly not there that day, the teacher had him repeat the entire book of 100 problems rather than fix the 10 he got wrong. We were having giant tantrums at home because of this, but the teacher saw nothing wrong because he was behaving in the classroom. I got testing to show that he was gifted and hope to use that as proof that he could handle more difficult work, but this did nothing. It showed that he was a visual-spatial learner and I showed the teacher an article about this style, but all it meant was that she "allowed" him to work on the constructive triangles (putting two triangles together to create new shapes, which, yes, is somewhat profound, but a gifted kid gets the point the first time around).

Ultimately, I felt that I had spent $15,000 to have my kid continue to build block towers and count to 10. I don't think that he made any significant academic progress in his time there, and I don't know that he developed the other skills Montessori is supposed to help build (increased attention span, love of learning, etc.).

Many of the gifted kids I know who went to Montessori had a poor time, with experiences similar to my son, particularly after the novelty of the first year wears off. However, it's totally dependent on the teacher. My son's teacher had been teaching for probably 30 years and was pretty stuck in her ways of what children were developmentally ready for. However, some kinds have different experiences, and in retrospect, if I had chosen a different teacher at that same school, I think we would have had a more positive experience overall.

I'll also say that I've seen a lot of people here say that they've had success with putting their kids in a play-based preschool and working on any sort of academic work at home. If we decide to put our younger child in preschool, I think that's the route we'll go.

How do you feel when you go into the Montessori? Is your child happy there when you visit?
There will be bullies everywhere and a handful of bad teachers. There is no telling if moving the right choice or not but if you get good feelings from the Montessori and your child does too, go there!

Thanks, the Montessori in our area a all have great reputations. I'm thinking if she turns out highly gifted I'll leave her where she is and reduce days/ supplement academics at home. If she is mod if below EP is thinking she might find it a better learning environment - soooo confusing, at the end of the day it's only preschool - I'm just concerned about her happiness - ill call Montessori in the morning and see if they will change their policy in this case...

Mahagogo, I'd suggest going in for a tour at the Montessori again even if you've already done so - most preschools would let you come in once more since you have to make the decision now - just let them know you want one more visit and then you'll give them your answer. You may have additional questions that you didn't have before and that will give you the opportunity to ask them, plus it will give you another chance just to get a feel for the school and the teachers - plus since your child has been offered a slot, you can ask to speak to the people who will actually be her assigned teachers.

I'd also consider *not* conditioning your "what should I do" on waiting on the results of the IQ testing. While it's good data to have, I'm not sure that in this situation it's *necessary* data - plus I also think that there are things you need to be considering here no matter what your dd's abilities test out at. For instance, she has an issue with one of the children at her current school and she's bored. You can try to get as much info as you can about what is happening with the one child - things like that can happen at any preschool. When you tour the Montessori again, ask how they would address that situation and compare that to how the current school is handling it. Boredom can relate to being under-challenged or repetitive work or 1000 other things - and it impacts children who aren't high IQ as well as high IQ kids. Think through what is boring at school for your dd, and compare that to the Montessori school. Do you need to make a change regardless of ability? Or if not, and you feel you only need to make a change once you know the results of the testing - would making the change negatively impact her if her test results weren't "gifted"? (I'm guessing most likely not - chances are the reasons you would want to make the change are good reasons for her no matter what her actual IQ number is).

Hope that makes sense!

polarbear

Mahagogo, my dd went to Montessori at age 3. The teacher was awesome and one of the things she mentioned was how dd has a natural sense of order which makes montessori a real nice fit for her. Also, some Montessori, like the one dd attended, allow the child to choose materials he/she likes and work on it for as long or as little as he/she wants. Dd spent good 4 months punching out all the continents and assembling a world map at the end of the year. Unfortunately, the school closed but I was very fortunate to find a play based alternative education school where dd is thriving. The most important thing is finding good teachers that are willing to be flexible. You know what environment your dd needs in terms if amount of structure vs freedom, repetition vs novelty, independence vs group and guided work etc. Talk to the Montessori teacher about what you have observed in your dd and ask her/him how they typically teach such a kid. Ultimately, go with your gut and if it was the wrong decision, be ready to make a change before it does too much damage. All the best with your decision- I personally know how agonizing it is!

Cool thanks all for your input. I was mainly waiting for the IQ test as I thought it would be a handy factor to have being as we are doing it anyway (to see if she can access a gifted program). I totally understand the bullying can happen anywhere, my main concern is that it has been going on for some time and the kindy doesn't seem to have a strategy that deals with it except she has to tell them about it, no intervention etc. DD also told me last night he is picking on many children and still nothing is being done that is proving effective anyway. From what you have all said change seems like the best, if we weren't testing I think I would be doing that.
Lovemydd, I think the idea that dd can spend as much time as she likes on a project is very appealing, it's the feedback I keep reading about kids not being able to progress as they are ready is the concerning part. DD is at kindy tomorrow so I'll go in and have another look, if it still seems good we'll all go together for a session and go from there.
Thanks all it is so great to be able to put a problem out there and get some thoughts back. All I'm getting from my friends is sheesh it's only preschool, tell her to suck it up and get on with it....

Wow, that comment from others to me is disturbing. Early childhood experiences do matter... All she is learning is that bullies get away with it. Definitely examine whether the current school is one you can work with. We have had to deal with similar issues and have been able to make changes with solutions that worked - and walked away from programs when we realized the administration' actions and policies were unacceptable to us. And it allowed DS to see that we supported him and took his concerns seriously. It matters.

If we had not made the changes for him, he would be so unhappy today that even at 3.5, I feel would have had long term effects, considering how sensitive he is and the fact that he seems to have very, very long memory. He still remembers me catching another kid trying to kick him in the head when he was 2.5 and removing him from the class to his relief. And we did not return to that program (we already told the teacher that we did not trust the other boy for a good reason after a prior incident and they ignored our concern). For DS, that was important to him even at 2 or 3... That he knew we would take action to deal with stuff like bullying or boredom/frustrations.

My thoughts exactly

I am in NZ too. Is it a state kindy or a day care centre type place? Does she actually need to go (as in are you exhausted, sick or at work?). I went back to work when my kids were 6 months and they attended various combinations of barnadoes home care, day care and kindy. I did look at Montessori but the ones in my city are all owned/run by the same person and they only had full time enrolment - it seemed awfully restrictive to me, no more than so many kids working together, work by yourself on your own mat, do the same thing exactly the same way as taught for each work. Compared with this at the day care my eldest and a friend spent the afternoon propping a ladder down the bank and sliding down it in half a mussel float. You can and will teach academics better than any preschool teacher and in a shorter time. Find somewhere fun and only send her as much as you have to or she wants to.