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Joined: Jul 2011
Posts: 2,007
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I kind of flipped back and forth with respect to cheating in high school.
Sometimes I cheated to win and sometimes I let people cheat off of me without cheating off of them (meaning that I tied one hand behind my GPA back, so to speak).
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Joined: Oct 2011
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I had a US History class where I never did the homework, which was always lame worksheets. I'd sit down at my desk and copy off my friend before class. She sat right by the door, and sometimes the teacher would walk in, look down, see what we were up to, and walk right on by without missing a beat. It wasn't usually just me copying, either... sometimes I think she was the only one in the class who actually did the homework. This was an AP class. It was the only AP subject in which I got a 5 on the test, so obviously there was no harm.
In Trig/Pre-calc, I used to store formulas in the programming area of my graphing calculator. And then I'd almost never use them, because the very process of keying them into the calculator cemented them in my memory.
So.... there's cheating, and then there's cheating.
I do find it instructive that we're sending children to these pressure-packed environments, where they learn to discard their ethics entirely, and that this path is the fast-track to Harvard and Yale, which are the fast-track to political leadership and CEO positions. Yet, we wonder why we are where we are as a society.
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I do find it instructive that we're sending children to these pressure-packed environments, where they learn to discard their ethics entirely, and that this path is the fast-track to Harvard and Yale, which are the fast-track to political leadership and CEO positions. Yet, we wonder why we are where we are as a society. It's because we're collectively stupid. Cheating always caused me chronic guilt and self-hatred where I would try to destroy my academic career as punishment.
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Joined: Feb 2011
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Well, students who cheat their way through high school certainly don't discard the practice afterwards. Why would they? It's a proven winner. I've been appalled at what some of my DD's friends think of as "not- really-cheating"-- and these are the "good" kids. They cheat to get A's, not because they "need" to do so.
Schrödinger's cat walks into a bar. And doesn't.
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Well, students who cheat their way through high school certainly don't discard the practice afterwards. Why would they? It's a proven winner. Because it's evil and makes you a horrible person?
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Well, students who cheat their way through high school certainly don't discard the practice afterwards. Why would they? It's a proven winner. Because it's evil and makes you a horrible person? But evil people never see themselves as evil, and horrible people never see themselves as horrible. Final score: Cognitive Dissonance - 1 Self Awareness - 0
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Well, students who cheat their way through high school certainly don't discard the practice afterwards. Why would they? It's a proven winner. Because it's evil and makes you a horrible person? But evil people never see themselves as evil, and horrible people never see themselves as horrible. Final score: Cognitive Dissonance - 1 Self Awareness - 0 But what about the complete depravity of mankind? We're all debased and evil! http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Total_depravity"Total depravity is the fallen state of man as a result of original sin. The doctrine of total depravity asserts that people are by nature not inclined or even able to love God wholly with heart, mind, and strength, but rather all are inclined by nature to serve their own will and desires and to reject the rule of God. Even religion and philanthropy are wicked to God to the extent that these originate from a human imagination, passion, and will, and are not done to the glory of God. Therefore, in Reformed theology, if God is to save anyone He must predestine, call, or elect individuals to salvation since fallen man does not want to, and is indeed incapable of choosing God.[4] Total depravity does not mean, however, that people are as evil as possible. Rather, it means that even the good which a person may intend is faulty in its premise, false in its motive, and weak in its implementation; and there is no mere refinement of natural capacities that can correct this condition. Thus, even acts of generosity and altruism are in fact egoist acts in disguise. All good, consequently, is derived from God alone, and in no way through man.[5] This idea can be illustrated by a glass of wine with a few drops of deadly poison in it: Although not all the liquid is poison, all the liquid is poisoned. In the same way, while not all of human nature is depraved, all human nature is totally affected by depravity."
Last edited by JonLaw; 09/26/12 08:41 AM. Reason: Winning!
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But what about the complete depravity of mankind?
We're all debased and evil! See, you're doing it wrong. It goes, "Everyone is debased and evil... except me!" Or more precisely: I am a good person. You are alright. He/she has some issues. They are totally evil.
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But what about the complete depravity of mankind?
We're all debased and evil! See, you're doing it wrong. It goes, "Everyone is debased and evil... except me!" Or more precisely: I am a good person. You are alright. He/she has some issues. They are totally evil. Do people really have that much of a problem admitting that they are bad? Let's try logic. I cheated. People who cheat are evil. Therefore I am evil and deserve punishment for my crimes against God. That was easy. I am evil and deserving of punishment.
Last edited by JonLaw; 09/26/12 08:56 AM. Reason: Winningerest!
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Do people really have that much of a problem admitting that they are bad? I don't think that good or bad is the point. People mostly behave as they've been taught to behave, and their environment teaches them what's acceptable. Most people are also unwilling to rock the boat. Sometimes people don't have much choice about rocking the boat. For example, if you have people to feed, and effectively everyone is doing whatever it is you object to, you can't always afford to rock the boat. So if you're working at some financial services-type place and everyone in the industry says that handing out mortgages to people without requiring proof of income is really great!!! and that turning junk mortgages into mortgage-backed securities is really great!!!, most people will go along with it. Some because they think that this stuff really is great. Others because they don't want to speak up even though they don't agree. Obviously, the situation is more complicated than this, but the basic idea is there.
Last edited by Val; 09/26/12 10:00 AM.
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