Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Identification, Testing & Assessment WIAT scores higher than WISC

Her sister who recently tested had a WMI in the 3rd percentile. Visually older DD's short term memory is good, long term memory too,auditory well that is her weakness.

I understand my children even less than I did prior to testing.

I don't think I am ever testing my youngest.

Reminds me of a favorite quote
Given your daughter's selective mutism, there is no way that an unfamiliar tester would be expected to be able to create a Verbal Index that reflects your daughters thinking skills. So just 'throw out' the WISC from your mind - no easy task - and keep on as you've been. If your gut is telling you that she isn't stretching, even with work a grade level ahead, then proceed as though she isn't.

I believe that somewhere there are guidelines that say that if the profile is as spikey as your daughter's is, then FSIQ shouldn't even be calculated. That is one spikey meatball from the bits you know so far. I don't think she is overachieving, I think that the IQ test is just not working for her.

It is very complicated to figure out how much energy to divert to home-enrichment with the SM and anxiety. Some kids with these issues need an undemanding academic life. Other kids will become more anxious and more SM until they get some academic environment that is demanding, and some 'real' peers, not just agemates. I wish there was a way to predict which group your DD falls into at this moment, but I think 'trial and error and close observation' is your only tool.

I applaud your greatness of courage for the gains you have made so far. I have no doubt that you will keep trying and eventually get things to go well for your DD.

I invite you to stick around here and chat with up about the daily ups and downs. Perhaps the only thing you'll get of value from the IQ test is that the 'findings' led you here.

You mentioned that the Raven's might not be accepted by the school. Let's say that the Raven's was given and your DD scored MG to HG on it. What would you hope that the school would do for your daughter if they accepted the test information?

Love and More Love,
Grinity

We are in Australia so the norms are WISC & SB.I would probably do Ravens just for a tad more understanding. If her Ravens came in low I would seriously look at not letting her be included in extension activities.

I just don't see the benefit to a child with anxiety issues being made to perform above ability.Our long term goal is that by the time she is a teen her anxiety issues are minimal and instead she is just dealing with all the normal teen stuff. She has progressed in leaps & bounds over the past 2 years and I don't want to do anything to risk this.

I will talk to her regular Psychologist in 2 weeks and see what she recommends and look into doing Ravens.

Thanks again.

Miscba, I think that you will find that most Australian schools care more about the letter from the psychologist than the actual test materials used. Most schools a) probably don't really understand what test results mean anyway so just follow recommendations and b) will either be willing to do what a reputable professional recommends, or they won't, but the outcome is more likely to do with their willingness than the test used.

Clearly, her verbal achievement (per multiple WIAT reading subscores) is at the gifted level, and you haven't been "hothousing" the WIAT skills, so in your situation, I would feel very comfortable continuing her in extension activities and taking the WIAT scores as circumstantial evidence of high ability, since you have good reason to believe that the WISC scores were depressed by previously diagnosed anxiety and selective mutism.

It's not fair to her to use a test to measure her intellectual capacity where the format of the test itself necessarily measures her disability at least as much as her ability.

I really wouldn't keep her out of extention activities b/c of the WISC or Raven. If she can do the work without excessive stress, it is a good fit for her regardless of what those tests say. One of the kiddos I mentioned earlier with two avg IQ tests is being subject accelerated in math and in accelerated classes in other subjects and doing well. The skills that support academic achievement and the motivation are there and the child is doing well regardless of whether he is above avg or not in terms of intelligence. And I wouldn't even be sure on the accuracy of the scores you have due to other issues. They could be right; they could be wrong. Either way, I think that it is more about whether the level of work is doable by the child without anxiety.

My younger child is 2e with some very high IQ scores. I can't place her academically solely based on those IQ scores b/c the work causes her anxiety. Her disabilities interfere enough with expressing the IQ that the IQ in some ways doesn't matter in terms of placement. It can't be all about the IQ #s.

That's why I said if we can take WMI and PSI at face value as testing what they say they are. My youngest has twice gotten avg-high avg processing speed scores on the WISC. This kid is fast and I say that as a person who is also very fast. I've taken the adult version of the WISC and came out slightly above the 99th percentile for PSI. I have always been someone who finishes everything in half the time given. I recall a test I took as an undergrad for which we had three hours. It was a huge auditorum with hundreds of people in the class and at Berkeley, so not a bunch of slouches. I finished the test in one hour and was the first person done. The professor stopped me on the way out to talk with me about why I had finished so fast. I told her that I was just done. If I recall correctly, I also got an A.

Having the experience of being someone with that good supporting skill, I can tell you that I in no way question my older dd's lower PSI. She is not a fast person. She is deep and meticulous. My youngest is plain fast. She also has ADD and has horrible attention to detail. (I do not.) Neither of the psychs who tested dd10 gave me her scoring pattern on PSI but I'd be willing to bet a lot that it was either lower due to huge #s of errors or anxiety slowing her down.

We, ultimately, know when the strengths and weaknesses we're being given don't line up with the kids we know.

Thank you everyone for your replies, I think you have saved me from a stress induced breakdown.

On a positive note I had parent teacher interviews at school today,DD's teacher confirmed that she too felt that DD was not working at or above her full ability. She also stated her only concern when putting DD's name down on extension classes/activities is not due to her coping with the workload but instead her coping socially.

Thanks again.