Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments Motivation and contract learning

Looking for suggestions for DS7. He is grade skipped to 2nd grade and currently pre-testing for language arts and math lessons in his public school classroom. He always passes his pre-test and then sits with the teacher to set-up a learning contract of what he will do when the class is having those lessons.

Right now we are struggling with motivation and follow through. DS7 comes up with an idea--they set-up the contract--he does this for a few days then proclaims he is bored without ever finishing his project. The teacher is starting to become frustrated with him and thinks that she may have to just have him start joining the class for lessons since he will wander around the class when he is bored. Unfortunately DS7 has a tendancy to be disruptive or act out when not engaged.

DS7 is not an avid independent reader (although he can read anything) and he hates handwriting. He has previously wrote a fiction story, created a constellation book, and made a poster about animal blood types. None of these projects ever made it completion before he was ready to move on again.

I was hoping this group might be able to share some project ideas that may motivate him for the remainder of the school year. Next year DS7 will most likely skip to 4th grade in the same public school and I hope that some of the regular classroom work will be at least a little challenging for him since I don't really seem him being successful as an independent learner for another year.

Thanks everyone!

I don't intend this to be offensive, but was wondering, does DS7 know why he doesn't finish ... esp. the 3 projects you mentioned "He has previously wrote a fiction story, created a constellation book, and made a poster about animal blood types"

What does he think about that? Just trying to see a bit more into perhaps his own reasoning...

Has he started to learn to type? I've read that gifted children who can think a lot find handwriting too slow of an output. Or perhaps help him type out everything he wants to say?

Just some initial thoughts... I'm sure someone else will have more ideas.

I can't help you, but I'm interested in the answers you will get because we're in a somewhat similar situation.

My DS6 was skipped to 1st, but he already knows almost all of the curriculum so his teacher gives him independent work for him to work on when he is done with what the rest of the class is working on. Unfortunately, if it is at all challenging for him, he gets frustrated working on his own. I would like to have him subject accelerated so that he is actively taught closer to his level, because it is not working so well for him to be working independently when the rest of the class is being taught. Unfortunately, his teacher sees this as a sign that my DS is immature (well, rather, on par with the other first graders) and that acceleration to an older class is not appropriate (eventhough she knows he's academically ready).

You say that you would like to have your DS skipped to 4th for next year. Does his current teacher think this is appropriate? Would his teacher be willing to let your DS try out a subject acceleration for the last couple of months of this school year to see if him being actively taught new material might help?

I think it is, in general, asking a lot of a 6 or 7 year old to be an independent, self-driven learner of material that is assigned to them rather than self-selected. It's one thing to learn on your own at home when you can do it any way you like, it's another to have to learn on your own under the constraints of a school setting at that age.

I worry about discipline and follow through with my own history. And one of the reasons that I have DD5 in piano is to learn the discipline.

I hate and get distracted with the detail work of finishing something. I am so great with the concept, the ground work, investigating, but refining it, editing, and even organizing it in the final part is a problem. Since I wrote industry reports on Wall Street, this can be a big problem. And why I moved into trading. You do the work quickly, get it done and you move on.

But I do not want DD to have this problem. She loves to learn the notes of a piece and play it. Especially complicated pieces with fast notes. But she doesn't play it perfectly and the work to get the timing exactly right, the fingering, the accent of how the composer wants the piece played etc. That is a struggle. And I keep reminding her that this is why she takes piano to learn the lessons of how to do a project correctly, not just quick and move on.

I think it is too common a pattern to fall into for Visual spatial learners that like to understand the whole picture and how it works but detail work is left for the other guy. I hope I can train DD into a discipline of working on the details. Not easy. I know some kids love to just sit there and work on a project until it is perfect. Slow and steady. Hence the story of the tortoise and the hare.

Ren

Wren,

I am with you and DD on this one as well is DS. Even the word details makes my eyes glaze over. I think that the detail folks seem to be the "producers" and hence it appears that they have done more "work" and created something more than the person who is the big picture person. But don't we need all types? Detail people are absolutely necessary but the old cliche of those who can't see the forest for the trees is there for a reason. We "forest seers" are important too! Now, if I can just figure out what careers are best suited for us we are cool. :-)

The problem, in my most humble opinion, is that the big picture people tend to expect others to see what they see and they don't often explain themselves well -- even though they may have great strategic answers, they "don't show their work".

I think talent is great, but talent doesn't get you to Carnegie Hall without the practice. And I think have the VS big picture strategic vision is wonderful. And it got me some great jobs. But if I had better "show the work" discipline, I would have had better outcomes. Delivering is hard.

And the story is: the tortoise wins the race. I want my hare to win. But she has to learn to focus and keep to the task and the details. Sometimes it is difficult, impossible after sugar intake, but she is developing some good habits. And I give her a lot of exercise to just get the energy out.

When we are based on the ocean in the summer and she exhausts herself swimming in the ocean (she is only 35 lbs and it is a surfing beach), she is a much more focused thinker. And when I was running (really running, not just jogging, 5 miles each morning), I was much more focused).

Ren

Just another thought regarding age and expectations.

It's one thing to have a contract and agree to it but at the end of the day he is 7. Does he receive any support from the teacher or is he expected to do it all on his own? Is he bored or is he losing his way? Maybe he needs someone to look over his shoulder occasionally and acknowledge that he is doing well and answer any questions he may have to keep him on track. He may be receiving all this and I am on the wrong track but I think there can be an expectation that gifted = independent, in depth learning, which in many instances is true but support and acknowledgement goes a long way too.

My DS 7 is also in a mid-year skip to 2nd. He's been in 2nd since January and is just wrapping up his "honeymoon" period :-) From your description, they could be twins. Mine is full of big ideas but doesn't want to put them on paper, loves to tinker but doesn't finish and overall, just wants to "be" rather than "do" if that makes sense.

He was also working on independent contract work in class. He was slow to start, slow to finish and dragging his feet. When it came down to it, he felt like he was being punished because the other kids were working together doing stuff and he was doing boring worksheets in the corner. The teacher changed up his work and made it a little more research based and he is enjoying it and working well again. She is very flexible, however, and very in tune to the kids in her class.

Independent learning in a classroom is a very difficult thing for kids and teachers. It's easier at home when you don't have to wonder what the other kids are doing, how much longer till the teacher pays attention to you, how long till lunch/recess/library/home. I think it takes a lot of effort on the teacher and the child's part for it to really work well.

Thanks for all the suggestions.

DS7 does receive support from the teacher but not on a daily basis. He is also not allowed to ask his questions while she is teaching the other students. He usually has specific times when he can talk to her about his contract work. DS7 is quick to get frustrated and give up if he doesn't get immediate feedback. I just think that DS7 is not one to be an independent learning and one to put thoughts to paper easily. He also sees the big picture more than being able to always focus on those details (which is also a trait I find in myself).

I ended up downloading a guide on the internet called Debate and Persuasive Writing for Elementary students. He seems excited to write a few persuasive papers this week about changing some school rules. Could be interesting. I also have a meeting with his teacher, the school pyschologist and the principal this week to finalize the grade skip for next year.