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    #50661 07/11/09 07:02 AM
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    hkc75 Offline OP
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    http://educationaloptions.wordpress.com/

    I'm sure most of you subscribe to these updates from Dr. Ruf but I wanted to cross post here since I found it absolutely dead-on. For the last 6 months I have been working with my DS now 7 on reading and spelling. I probably would have had more luck with the cat. Then spontaneously overnight he picked up a chapter book (The Magic Tree House Series by Mary Pope Osborne which I have read to him in the past) and started reading. He is now on his 11th book and actually enjoys it! There are no words to describe how this feels to me. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to read. I wish I could pat myself on the back for this one, but at last this is another gifted thing that I just get to sit back and marvel at him for. laugh

    Hope some of you find this helpful.

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    Love Ruff!
    Quote
    Phonics is a useful tool later, but teaching smart children to read with phonics is very confusing to most of them and sometimes slows them down. Phonics works to teach �decoding� skills, but a child who knows how to decode still may not understand what he reads. Most really bright children appear to start reading almost spontaneously


    Just wanted to hear everyones opinions on this one. I think the phonics vs sight words is an interesting debate.

    My DD was a spontaneous reader sometime before K. I did not even know she could read until her K teacher told me. I am interested to see how my DS developes this skill.

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    Val Offline
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    My DS9 (two grade skips) and DD4 (about to skip K) both thrived on phonics, albeit at much younger ages than most other kids. DS7, alternatively, seemed to be struggling with reading when he was 6, in spite of reading words when he was a little less than 4.

    Then, just like hkc75 did, I gave him a Magic Tree House book on whim one evening. He started reading it: I was shocked. When he finished later that week (he was reading it aloud to me), we moved to a chapter book a grade level higher, and the effort required to read it was about the same as what was required for Magic Tree House. Trippy.

    This was about 6 months ago and the Magic Tree House books are very easy for him now. I also see him reading other things on his own, something he never used to do.

    He spoke earlier than his brother and his sentences were more complex at an earlier age. People have always noticed his vocabulary, and he was talking in page-length paragraphs when he was 2. He'd get started describing something and...there'd be no stopping him.

    Val

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    hkc75 Offline OP
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    Of note...My DS7 is very, very active. So when I have asked him about reading in the past, he has always said he doesn't like it because he has to work so hard to sit still. Now that it is summer and he is able to get outside and run around all day, he is able to sit still in the evening and first thing in the morning to concentrate on reading. I think that is huge. He is finally able to sit still (after months of OT/PT)!

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    Quote
    Phonics is a useful tool later, but teaching smart children to read with phonics is very confusing to most of them and sometimes slows them down. Phonics works to teach �decoding� skills, but a child who knows how to decode still may not understand what he reads. Most really bright children appear to start reading almost spontaneously


    I think sometimes it is easier to figure out a pattern for yourself than to understand someone else's explanation of it. This may be especially true for very young children who may have pattern recognition skills in advance of their language skills. I know my DD3 would not have learned to read as early as she did if I had tried to teach her how to do it. I will stay out of the phonics vs. sight words debate (at least for now wink ) but I will say that I agree with Ruf that explicit reading instruction is not always appropriate for early readers.

    Last edited by no5no5; 07/11/09 01:24 PM.
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    I absolutely agree with that quote from my experience with my son. He started reading by himself and I was worried he was just memorizing even though he knew the sounds. I got the hooked on phonics and he just wanted to skip through it so I stopped. He is now sounding out words all on his own, yay!

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    Val Offline
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    Originally Posted by Ruf
    Phonics is a useful tool later, but teaching smart children to read with phonics is very confusing to most of them and sometimes slows them down.


    FWIW, I think this statement is a bit of an over-generalization. She made a lot of good points in that post, but I'm not convinced about this one as a general statement. For instance, she doesn't offer any evidence past her own book to support her conclusion, and the book is heavy on anecdotes.

    I expect that HG+ kids can learn in a variety of ways.

    Val

    Last edited by Val; 07/11/09 01:14 PM.
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    It amazes me that there is still a debate about the "way" in which children learn to read. I should think that after so many years of failing to prove the supremacy of one over the other, that it would be obvious that different children develop in different ways.

    I know that my own children have certainlydeveloped as readers in different ways.

    DD9 was fascinated by sound-symbol relationships by the time she was two. Other than referring to letters by sound instead of name, we didn't do explicit instruction or phonics programs. However, she learned to spell before she learned to read and LOVED to try and spell short words. By the time she entered K (at a very young 5 due to late summer b-day), she was reading at a 3rd grade level. By the 3rd quarter of that year she had exhausted the elementary reading assessment. This was pre-SRI, an assessment used for the first time this year (she has not exhausted that assessment--she is "only" at a 12th grade level wink ). When she was learning to read she relied almost exclusively on context and sound-symbol. She enjoyed books with pictures, but did not focus much on them, and was ready to abandon them fairly early, although happily she has rediscovered the richness of picture books this year (many of which are beautifully written short stories). She has always been an exceptional speller. Sound/symbol combinations make sense to her and she is quick to notice and appreciate the meaning of alternate spellings.

    My DS7, on the other hand, was fascinated by picture at a very young age. He was in constant motion--unless a non-fiction video was playing, in which case he was transfixed. He also heard letters referred to by sound instead of name and loved books--but for him, pictures were great sources of information. He would pore over pictures picking out and pointing out details I never would have noticed. When he began to read, he seldom applied his sound/symbol knowledge when stuck--instead he would use context and picture based information to intuit out the words. It took him longer to love reading, I think because it took longer for his text reading to catch up with the depth of content he needed in order to be engaged (he was always more engaged by non-fiction than by fiction--hard to find books at early reading that had any unknown information). He began K at a late K reading level and finished at an early 3rd. Then by the end of 1st quarter of 1st grade, he too exhausted the elementary reading assessment (not SRI, which wasn't given to him). The difference in their route to reading shows in their approach to completely unfamiliar words--he is much more likely to mispronounce, especially if it is multi-syllabic (Amagamon instead of Agammemnon). Also, while he spells 1 1/2 to 2 years above level, he does not spell like DD.

    By achievement level at least, they would both be considered gifted readers (we haven't done IQ testing). Yet they came at reading in completely different ways.

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    My DD also just picked up a book and started reading one day right after she turned 3. She is 3.7 now and will not read but I have a feeling this is due to not knowing all of the words. I know she knows most of the words because as stand alones she'll tell you what they are. Oh well I'll just keep reading to her until she changes her mind.

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    DS learned to read by phonics at 2.5. I didn't realize he was memorizing all the letter sounds from an alphabet video he liked to watch (Leapfrog Letter Factory). Then I discovered that he could sound out simple words like CAT, PIG, etc. one day when we were playing with some magnetic letters at his preschool.

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