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I'm sure most of you subscribe to these updates from Dr. Ruf but I wanted to cross post here since I found it absolutely dead-on. For the last 6 months I have been working with my DS now 7 on reading and spelling. I probably would have had more luck with the cat. Then spontaneously overnight he picked up a chapter book (The Magic Tree House Series by Mary Pope Osborne which I have read to him in the past) and started reading. He is now on his 11th book and actually enjoys it! There are no words to describe how this feels to me. I LOVE, LOVE, LOVE to read. I wish I could pat myself on the back for this one, but at last this is another gifted thing that I just get to sit back and marvel at him for.

Hope some of you find this helpful.

Love Ruff!


Just wanted to hear everyones opinions on this one. I think the phonics vs sight words is an interesting debate.

My DD was a spontaneous reader sometime before K. I did not even know she could read until her K teacher told me. I am interested to see how my DS developes this skill.

My DS9 (two grade skips) and DD4 (about to skip K) both thrived on phonics, albeit at much younger ages than most other kids. DS7, alternatively, seemed to be struggling with reading when he was 6, in spite of reading words when he was a little less than 4.

Then, just like hkc75 did, I gave him a Magic Tree House book on whim one evening. He started reading it: I was shocked. When he finished later that week (he was reading it aloud to me), we moved to a chapter book a grade level higher, and the effort required to read it was about the same as what was required for Magic Tree House. Trippy.

This was about 6 months ago and the Magic Tree House books are very easy for him now. I also see him reading other things on his own, something he never used to do.

He spoke earlier than his brother and his sentences were more complex at an earlier age. People have always noticed his vocabulary, and he was talking in page-length paragraphs when he was 2. He'd get started describing something and...there'd be no stopping him.

Val

Of note...My DS7 is very, very active. So when I have asked him about reading in the past, he has always said he doesn't like it because he has to work so hard to sit still. Now that it is summer and he is able to get outside and run around all day, he is able to sit still in the evening and first thing in the morning to concentrate on reading. I think that is huge. He is finally able to sit still (after months of OT/PT)!

I think sometimes it is easier to figure out a pattern for yourself than to understand someone else's explanation of it. This may be especially true for very young children who may have pattern recognition skills in advance of their language skills. I know my DD3 would not have learned to read as early as she did if I had tried to teach her how to do it. I will stay out of the phonics vs. sight words debate (at least for now ) but I will say that I agree with Ruf that explicit reading instruction is not always appropriate for early readers.

I absolutely agree with that quote from my experience with my son. He started reading by himself and I was worried he was just memorizing even though he knew the sounds. I got the hooked on phonics and he just wanted to skip through it so I stopped. He is now sounding out words all on his own, yay!

FWIW, I think this statement is a bit of an over-generalization. She made a lot of good points in that post, but I'm not convinced about this one as a general statement. For instance, she doesn't offer any evidence past her own book to support her conclusion, and the book is heavy on anecdotes.

I expect that HG+ kids can learn in a variety of ways.

Val

It amazes me that there is still a debate about the "way" in which children learn to read. I should think that after so many years of failing to prove the supremacy of one over the other, that it would be obvious that different children develop in different ways.

I know that my own children have certainlydeveloped as readers in different ways.

DD9 was fascinated by sound-symbol relationships by the time she was two. Other than referring to letters by sound instead of name, we didn't do explicit instruction or phonics programs. However, she learned to spell before she learned to read and LOVED to try and spell short words. By the time she entered K (at a very young 5 due to late summer b-day), she was reading at a 3rd grade level. By the 3rd quarter of that year she had exhausted the elementary reading assessment. This was pre-SRI, an assessment used for the first time this year (she has not exhausted that assessment--she is "only" at a 12th grade level ). When she was learning to read she relied almost exclusively on context and sound-symbol. She enjoyed books with pictures, but did not focus much on them, and was ready to abandon them fairly early, although happily she has rediscovered the richness of picture books this year (many of which are beautifully written short stories). She has always been an exceptional speller. Sound/symbol combinations make sense to her and she is quick to notice and appreciate the meaning of alternate spellings.

My DS7, on the other hand, was fascinated by picture at a very young age. He was in constant motion--unless a non-fiction video was playing, in which case he was transfixed. He also heard letters referred to by sound instead of name and loved books--but for him, pictures were great sources of information. He would pore over pictures picking out and pointing out details I never would have noticed. When he began to read, he seldom applied his sound/symbol knowledge when stuck--instead he would use context and picture based information to intuit out the words. It took him longer to love reading, I think because it took longer for his text reading to catch up with the depth of content he needed in order to be engaged (he was always more engaged by non-fiction than by fiction--hard to find books at early reading that had any unknown information). He began K at a late K reading level and finished at an early 3rd. Then by the end of 1st quarter of 1st grade, he too exhausted the elementary reading assessment (not SRI, which wasn't given to him). The difference in their route to reading shows in their approach to completely unfamiliar words--he is much more likely to mispronounce, especially if it is multi-syllabic (Amagamon instead of Agammemnon). Also, while he spells 1 1/2 to 2 years above level, he does not spell like DD.

By achievement level at least, they would both be considered gifted readers (we haven't done IQ testing). Yet they came at reading in completely different ways.

My DD also just picked up a book and started reading one day right after she turned 3. She is 3.7 now and will not read but I have a feeling this is due to not knowing all of the words. I know she knows most of the words because as stand alones she'll tell you what they are. Oh well I'll just keep reading to her until she changes her mind.

DS learned to read by phonics at 2.5. I didn't realize he was memorizing all the letter sounds from an alphabet video he liked to watch (Leapfrog Letter Factory). Then I discovered that he could sound out simple words like CAT, PIG, etc. one day when we were playing with some magnetic letters at his preschool.

I do agree with the Ruff quote, at least in terms of my dd (now 5). She started to read quite early. Sight words just after she turned 2 ... entire books/stories before she turned 3. I read to her often as a child, but in terms of her learning to read, I never taught her a thing. She seemed to teach herself. Almost entirely whole words -- with a bit of sounding out.

Then, this past year in pre-k, her teacher tested her in phonics and random made-up words and found her to have some gaps. I said, "Yes, but have her pick up that Encyclopedia Brown chapter book. She can read and comprehend the whole thing." It seemed silly to me to focus on phonics when she could already read and comprehend at a much higher level. Why focus on made-up words when she could actually really read the words on the page?

I'm not saying phonics are bad. I have a second dd (now 3) who is just barely starting to recognize words. I have a feeling phonics will be key to helping her learn how to read. And I embrace that fact. I just don't think you should make a child slog through all the parts when he/she can already read and comprehend. It's like making a child keep working on floating when he/she already knows how to swim (which is happening at our lessons this summer ... but I digress )

my DD5 resists being taught to read, but says she wants to read chapter books. Will not start with little books or single words. Feels indignant, says she feels dumb and embarassed when i try to teach her. I feel she will just fly and really enjoy it once she gets there, but we're just at an impasse now. I've tried copying single pages from chapter books to start on instead, but she gets frustrated. She is so so gifted when it comes to understanding, language, etc, and also great with math.. but this seems like just not something that is coming quick to her. She scored 147 on the WPPSI and no signs of any 2E conditions (very uniform scores).. Wondering if i should give up for now or keep pushing on..When i asked her what she wanted me to do she said "wave a wand and say puff and then i can read.".. ha. I really feel this is the first challenge she has had intellecutally and just feels so uncomfortable with having to make an effort.

irene

My advice: Tell her you are happy to help her if & when she wants help, but that reading is incredibly complex and it may take a lot of work for her to learn to read. The decision should be hers, not yours (IMHO).

I think the phonics quote from Ruf is correct, at least in our house. My DS was a purely phonetic reader for about 7 months from about 4 to almost 5. He learned his phonics a-la Leap Frog at about 2 1/2. He didn't begin putting it together for words for another year and a half after that. Reading phonetically, it was almost as if he was "stuck" in little phonics books. He would sound out everything he encountered- even words he had seen hundreds of times.

When he finally got the idea of sight words, he jumped three grade levels in reading in about two weeks. He literally went from BOB-like books to chapter books.

I think phonics has still been immensely helpful because he can figure out nearly all words he comes across even if he's never seen them before and they're completely out of context. I assume that once they get around to it, it'll help him with spelling in school too.

Irene,
Your DD sounds a bit like my DS when he was 4 or 5. In his case I would say he is a "watcher". Even with video games, he would prefer to watch someone else play up until the point when he feels confident that he can do it all and do it well (in fact, her reason sounds very familiar ). I wouldn't worry about your DD's reluctance to work on reading. We just kept pointing things out casually and reading aloud as much as he wanted (he has always loved, and still loves, being read to). As I said in an earlier post, he was not a child who learned through sound/symbol connection. He was more interested in picture/story. However, once he became interested, he leapt all at once in K to a 3rd grade level; then all at once to a fifth grade level in a nine week span during early first grade.

If you are snuggling with your DD while you are reading, then she is seeing the text and it will help lay groundwork for her. If you are concerned, you might consider focusing on choosing good picture books for awhile. If you choose well, the stories are just as well written and complex, but the shorter structure lends to re-reading and/or to your DD picking a familiar book up on her own. Many kids develop reading fluency with books that are at least partly familiar to them.

In the meantime, you can relax and savor the joys of curling and up and reading to your little darling. Although we have two fluent readers who still love being read to every night, I know some fluent readers who have lost interest in being read to by their parents.

Taminy
My boy hates reading - but he eats up audio CDs/tapes and has incredible recall (tho' the WISC pointed out his working memory is poor). He's going to be tested for dyspraxia and dyslexia on the EP's advice.

He loves the Terry Deary CDs and the Gombrich History Of The World - I'm sure I've posted all this before. We can get CDs on Scientists and their inventions in the UK - which he loves. Just need some maths CDs.

Just hope the reading comes on tap soon, as there is a limit to what he can pick up from this source.

Paul

Can you pick up a book on tape and give her the book to follow along with if she wants? Just a thought.

With our DS, we just read to him a ton, and we used our fingers to follow along when he showed interest. (But as a caveat - he was a very early self-taught reader.)

Good luck!

Master of None ... fair points on both topics

I think I simply felt frustration that dd's pre-k teacher seemed to have little respect for the fact that dd could already read and comprehend several grade levels ahead. Her attitude seemed to be unless dd knew all the phonics/made-up words ... she was exactly the same as every other child in the class, most of whom couldn't read at all.

I do think dd will have to learn some phonics in terms of getting her to be a better speller - which does not appear to be a strength of hers. I have heard this can be common in early "whole word" readers.

In the end, I appreciate your points and hope my dd enjoys learning all that school has to offer (she is only just entering kindergarten). I simply object to the idea that kids need to learn phonics to know how to read.

I have always been a strong advocate of phonics. However, DS6 learned to read through osmosis or something about the time he turned 2, and was never taught any method at all. He has a photographic memory (or at least he did back then, for that) and once you told him what a word was, he remembered it. He was reading license plates and signs on every walk from the time he was 18 months old, and just kept adding words as new ones came along. At some point, around the age of 4, I realized that he was sounding out unfamiliar words--so apparently he just automatically knew phonics as well. I have no idea how he did it, it just happened. When he took the WJIII at 5 years, 9 months, his "word attack" score was >21 years or >grade 15.

DD3, on the other hand, seems to view letters as artistic elements rather than as keys to a language. She knows a bunch of them, but she still sees W in M and E, as if it doesn't matter to her which direction it faces, and A and R and K are all the same to her and interchangeable. DS6 NEVER held a book upside down, even as a baby--he knew which way the letters went before he knew what they were.

Phonics seem to be the way here, too. I figured out reading through intuitive phonics at about 2 (per my parents), and mine figured it out before school similarly. Maybe certain learners have it built-in while others need to learn by whole language?