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Hi all,
I just wanted to share my utter surprise (shock) with something that happened yesterday.
DD and another gifted child (9years and some) were returning from school. DD forgot her homework words sheet at school. I turned to the other child and asked if she could call him up to get the homework words. The kid goes "no, i am busy, I have homework to do". I said "what?" and he repeated it. He went on and on about how DD could justify not doing the homework to the teacher and how he was rescuing her! The homework he was referring to was his mother's enrichment work not mandatory school work but that aside, what surprised me was a lack of respect and seeming lack of social context. DD, I am sure would never have done that especially if asked by another parent. To me, this is a pointer about how I should raise my children with old fashioned values and being civil, courteous, helpful etc. The adage 'It is nice to be important, but more important to be nice' comes to mind.
Comments?
more background: DD has always complained abt the kid's 'attitude problem just because he is so smart' and I saw it first hand yesterday.
Guess how-not-to-be lessons are just as important as how-to-be!

that kid sounds like a piece of work...... tell you daughter to avoid him.....

How's his mom?
Sounds like the other child is not enjoying that homework and it is mandatory for him and he's crabby (best case scenario). It also sounds like he did think it would be "a favor" to someone to keep them from doing their homework...
Hm. I guess having lots of nieces and nephews rolling around the house all the time, I have gotten into a bad habit of telling a child when I think they're being rude, now even kids I am not related to: down at the bus stop, etc.
Usually really freaks 'em out! (and they'd probably cough up the homework!)

I'm the same way, Chris. I'm a total buttinsky when it comes to manners. I don't try to embarrass kids or anything--I realize I don't know the backstory, and there could be issues I know nothing about. But I do quietly suggest alternate ways of handling things when bad manners are evident.

I'm afraid I can't help it! Call it "positive peer pressure," insofar as "peer" = another human being who has to share space with the child.

Chris: the mom is very domineering. The kid almost exists to please her..oh well.
He has an overwhelming need to be the best which is fine by itself but even it meant that has to put down the rest (and he has).
I hate to not give "kids" the benefit of the doubt but this one gets none!

Kriston, I feel very shy and uncomfortable about redirecting others' kids. I dont want to incur the wrath of the parents for business they should have gotten to in the first place. (Besides, we are from another country and I sometimes get caught in 'gosh, am I displaced in time, culture and age?' I wonder how I will be able to handle my own DD's puberty phase, etc..cross-the-bridge..).

I am in the toddler phase of everything but I watch my friends doing things that in my opinion set the stage for what is coming in the future and it is with that attitude that I enforce manners with my DD. In regards to another thread about bossy ... my DD is extremely bossy but also has a high sense of empathy so it helps even things out. People are always impressed with her when we are out in public. She minds well and is respectful of others.

But as far as butting in to the parenting of others ... that is just my opinion, I would be butting in. If they show concern I will open the can of worms but I don't harp on it. I was in that position with a close friend of mine when we had a play date for our daughters. Her daughter was so uncontrollable it made me completely uncomfortable and now I will not put my DD in that situation again. It was really heartbreaking when we left them that my DD quietly sad that "M. really doesn't know how to mind her mommy." I also had the DD that was trying to mimic a little of what she saw M. do and this made it an easy conclusion for us that we would not have anymore play dates with my friend until she tackles some of M. problems. I didn't say anything but a few weeks ago the topic came up and I voiced my opinion on the issue. Hopefully the mom will do something to correct it.

I hear you. I think you're much closer to the norm than I am!

I just honestly can't help myself. I'm a not-really-recovering bossy GT kid and former teacher, so I have a really hard time biting my tongue.

And just to clarify in light of KM's intervening post: I don't advise or criticize parents. That's not my place.

But if a child is openly rude or disrespectful to me or to my kids in my presence and the parents don't step up, I do refuse to accept that behavior. I would do the same with rude adults. I think I have the right to require that my kids and I be treated with a certain level of respect and kindness, and I know we won't get it if we don't expect it.

Just MHO...

When you state it like that Kriston, I totally agree and have found myself jumping in and this is toddlers not older kids so I am sure the line will be even more evident on what I will be willing to accept.

A lot of people would disagree with us on this though, KM. Or at least would worry about making someone mad if they did it. That's never happened to me--at least not to my face! (Knock on wood...)

I always figure that I'm not doing anyone any good if I hold kids to significantly lower standards than I'd hold adults to. I know that they're learning, and I'm fine with their not being perfectly behaved. It's a process. But how will they learn if no one ever tells them that rude behavior is not okay? And what am I teaching *my* kids if they see me accepting blatantly rude behavior toward us?

At least that's my reasoning...

Funny thing is that some parents want you to step in. My first time working with younger kids I was a Cub Master of a new cub scout troop. Parents at this time needed to attend the meetings, I felt very uncomfortable enforcing good behavior on other parents children, espesially when they where in the room. On one outing I had a new parent (He was also a Middle School Principal. He had no problem stepping in, and the parents where thankful. Big shock to me, I now am more assertive, with rarely any issues. However I haven't tried it with strangers.

I liked your comment and agree. I think we learn a lot about the kind of people we WANT by FEELING the consequences of others negative behavior. We certainly wouldn't want to make some other family FEEL the way we just felt.

Ii can be a catch 22 for me b/c sometimes I just react. But it is hard to find a line b/c DD questions why others are allowed to get away with things and not her. Today at lunch this toddler who was younger then her was allowed to walk around the whole place and DD was upset. Why does that kid get to and not me? I had to explain to her that the other child has not been taught to behave properly but she has and she knows better.

I am sure just as much as I am appalled by my friends' kids behavior they probably think I am to hard on my DD or expect too much from her. I try to keep my expectations in mind when around the other kids but sometimes I can't help but question the behavior when it is something that I would not tolerate from DD.

It will get better once the kids are not toddlers anymore. At this age lots of bad behavior is ignored. Expectations for toddlers are quite low and sometimes there is a good reason for it

I am like Kriston. I don't let other kids get away with bad behavior. I don't care if the child is mine or not. I let the parents handle the situation but if they are not around or ignore it then I will step in.

I do not let kids or even adults get away with rude behavior.

I once put a 6 year old kid in the crack of a tree who was misbehaving at a get together - he was hitting other kids and would not stop. I did it right in front of his dad. I let him bawl until he agreed to not do it again. That dad has gotten a lot better and his son is pretty good now.

Its amazing what some parents will let their kids get away with. Some parents need an example - others will never get it.

EVERY kid I ever fostered had enormous issues with boundaries. They always came around - its so easy to set them.

My mom always used the "if so and so jumped off the Brooklyn Bridge, would you follow?" I say the same as you and let them know how other people also love that they are so well behaved.

Manners are kind of a pet peeve of mine, I correct other peoples kids all the time. That and proper English. Can't help it, it just pops out!

Well...It's not so much that they want to behave badly; it's that they think other people should have to behave well. Since I agree with my kids, I don't generally pull out the Brooklyn Bridge. I save it for things that I think my kids are being dumb about.

[quote=Kriston}

Well...It's not so much that they want to behave badly; it's that they think other people should have to behave well. Since I agree with my kids, I don't generally pull out the Brooklyn Bridge. I save it for things that I think my kids are being dumb about.[/quote]

At a recent birthday party at a yogurt shop, kids were playing tag INSIDE the restaurant! I was appalled and refused to let my DS play. He was totally bummed and sat there pouting. He asked how come he couldn't play and I responded "Because I am a much meaner mommy." He murmured under his breath "You're not meaner, they're going to break something...." But he's still 5 and wanted to play tag!

We take him with us everywhere because he's 'well-trained' and I try to remind him of that. On a cruise last year, he thoroughly enjoyed sitting through 7 courses of dinner with us. I reminded him every night that it was a special treat because he has such nice manners. This is not to say that at home he doesn't lose it! But pointing out the special stuff they are allowed to do because they have good behavior seems to make it easier when I have to be the hammer!

I just want to point out that some children do have a harder time learning to act appropriately in public. Kids on the autism spectrum, for instance, will often appear rude, though it is not intentional. Please don't bash the parents and assume that they are being neglectful. Of course, if they are in the room and don't stop bad behavior, that IS cause for concern.

Exactly, Lorel. That's why I said that there's often stuff we don't know, and that I take care not to advise parents or to embarrass kids.

There's definitely a way to approach this with sensitivity and yet not to allow bad behavior to go unnoted.

Part of it, I think has to do with our own response--bad manners from a child doesn't mean that we adults get to respond with bad manners. Trying to make someone look bad or feel bad is never good manners!