Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Parenting and Advocacy IQ tests

We have had another meeting with the school about accelerating DS (10 1/2, 5th grade, gifted program, but still not challenged.) The Director of curriculum said he would not even consider accelerating a student unless he had an IQ score of 150-160 or higher. He was using DS score on the InView of 134, as his IQ, saying he's just not that bright, lot's of kids just like him in regular curriculum and gifted program, blah, blah, blah.

The InView (group cognitive achievement test) has a hard test ceiling of 141. DS may be 134 or may be higher.
We have convinced the school principle to pay for an individual IQ test BUT, as I have been reading and speaking to our private psychologist about the new WISC, the scores are coming back lower in gifted populations and it has a ceiling of about 135 on the subtests.
So even if he had an IQ above 150, the test won't show it. Psychologist says the SB5 doesn't go much higher and the schools don't generally use it as much anyway and they definitely won't use the old SB L-M.

So this test is not going to get us anywhere at school. What test have your kids taken that are even showing their IQs to be higher than the ceiling?
Where is the Curriculum Director getting his numbers? He says they have only accelerated 2 kids in 10 years, and their IQs were over 160, but on what test?
I feel like he has put up this standard because there is no way any kid, let alone my kid, will be able to show proof that they have reached it.
I'm pretty sure DS would be in the 130-150 considering where his dad and I tested back on the old tests (1970s) and that kids usually range within 10 points of the parents. From the RUF scale he is a III or maybe almost a IV.
He wouldn't even consider any other standard. We brought the Iowa acceleration manual, and other relevant books and documents to the table. He didn't want to look at any of them. He just kept repeating that unless the child is profoundly gifted, they couldn't be sure he would continue to do well through High School. Ugh.

Hi Bees-

The old SBLM goes over 160, but that's very rarely used these days. Check out this hoagies table for how different tests compare.

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/wisc_vs_sb_l-m.htm

Has your son had achievement testing? A Woodcock-Johnson type ach test might give you and the teachers a better idea of exactly what your son has mastered and what grade level he is operating on in various subject areas. This information is more concrete and specific and may be more useful in advocacy situations.

It's ridiculous to say that only a PG kid can benefit from acceleration. Most PG kids are multiple years ahead of age/grade level across the board. A one year skip won't do much to challenge a kid who is 3+ years ahead, will it? A highly gifted kid might be "only" 2 years ahead in every subject, does that mean she won't benefit from a skip?

Have you seen the Templeton report on acceleration? Check it out here:
http://www.nationdeceived.org/

You might want to browse the site and acquaint your school officials with it as well.

best wishes-

Thebees,

Ask your Curriculum Director which test/s the two accelerated students took which yielded these scores. Then you can discuss the issue of apples and oranges with him.

I find it interesting that your district has a higher standard for a single grade skip than required for admission to the Davidson Academy!

My son�s CSI for 5th grade was 135 which is at the 99th percentile, as I assume 134 may be. He qualified for the DYS program based on SB-IV results, which as you know, is no longer available.

Invite this director to explain himself.

Good luck!

Where do these schools come up with these arbitrary requirements? I don't get it!

((gasping for air from laughing so hard))
((tears - both kinds, in corner of eye!))

ok - so we can agree that we are both dealing with a different version of reality here. I see two possibilities -
A) They are using the test as a polite-ish door closer. The door is closed and you can jump through all the hoops they say they want and they arent' going to budge. If this is true, the logical thing to do is find another school situation.
B) Perhaps there really is a chance for a skip here. Here the big question is- how much of your time and energy can you invest in the possibility that this is the reality?
Both WISC and SB-V have special indexes that may give you scores that fit the bill. I'll post this much and send along that infor in the next batch. If you don't have the scores, plus the Wicked Witch of the West's Broom (Movie Joke) you can try pursuasion. Dale Carnigie's How to win Friends and Influence People is pretty interesting. Getting to Yes is also good, but a bit too "direct and honest" for my tastes in this situation. Afterall - this isn't a negotiation in that they have all the say, it's more like "landing a big account." Last but important, there's the totally subtle "friends in high places" approach. Ask everyone you know if they can introduce you to anyone who may have influence with your blocker.

Disclaimer: I know a lot about this as I've been through it all, for months and years - and I did not succeed in the public school system. You can do everything right and still lose this one. But It does work some of the time, and has great benifits.
Love and More Love,
Trinity

SBV has a SB-LM equivalency, called, i think, extended IQ scores, which goes up to 225 - here's the link:http://www.assess.nelson.com/pdf/sb5-asb3.pdf
This article is written by Dr. Deb Ruf.

WISC IV has the General Abilities Index, which I think takes out some of the scores that are less related to intelligence and tend to depress the score for some gifted kids. (Anyone who can clarify, please do!)
http://harcourtassessment.com/NR/rd...76D-D6048BD67ED7/0/WISCIVTechReport4.pdf

Here's an little tanget that may be useful - a pagelong that sells the use of the SB-V for gifted kids and talks about their nature a bit: http://nswagtc.org.au/info/articles/Smith_Stanford%20Binet%205.PDF

I hope this helps. I sure would hate to participate in the "bait and switch" that I belief that the school may be engaged in. OTOH, if your private psychologist looks at the Ruf article and likes it, you may be on your way to an accurate IQ score that serves your purpose.

Best Wishes,
Trinity

It is so nice to talk to people who actually research and read for information and think rationally. Could you all please go work for my school district? It is so frustrating to have the decision makers (or would that be the deciders? oof) not use logic or even get the correct facts before laying down their opinion as law.
The first thing the private psychologist asked after hearing what happened..."well, do you have a good attorney?" But a long drawn out battle isn't going to help DS. I guess we'll get the testing and then figure out our next move.