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    Joined: Jun 2012
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    Joined: Jun 2012
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    hello,

    you are all such experts, so I'm making my first post here. I've been reading about many kids who made the IQ cut off for DYS but missed on the achievement. My 6 year old DD just took her WISC IV and got a 157 GAI/150 FSIQ which meets the YS bar, but we have yet to do her Woodcock Johnson. She did take a MAP test in school last week and scored 208 on the math. The 99th percentile stopped at 196. I'm not sure if 12 pts. above that would equate to a 99.9 percentile in Broad Math or not. I'm just looking for something to give me some hope.

    DD's brother is a DYS, but he took his achievement test much later when he was almost 9 and had had more time to be exposed to things beyond his grade. My daughter is an a regular 1st grade class.

    Thanks for any insights on how MAP and/or WISC-IV scores might give some indication on her future WJ performance. I haven't rec'd the raw scores for the WISC yet, but I think she was pretty consistent among the different tests, probably highest on verbal reasoning but still strong on math. The WJ test is in a couple of weeks, and our tester said that kids usually score lower on the achievement than they did on the IQ.

    Thanks for any insights you may offer!

    Joined: Apr 2012
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    Welcome!

    Here's a website you may find helpful for MAP testing. You can select the RIT score (in your case between 201-210 on math) to get an idea of the level of questions your DD got up to.

    http://www.powayusd.com/projects/edtechcentral/lladder/Default.asp

    Is she newly 6 or closer to 7? I just Googled and found this chart: http://lmms.acps.schoolfusion.us/modules/groups/homepagefiles/cms/2361977/File/MAPSCORESPARENTS.pdf

    So it looks like your 1st grader performed on that test like a typical 4th grader. To me it seems she's ready to learn some math beyond her current grade level, so why not start doing some afterschooling?


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    Thank you, W'sMama. She will be 7 at the end of May, and she has recently started to have a tutor/mentor come and do math with her once a week. She also does IXL, skipping around in the different grades. She was able to complete an 8th grade unit last week. Finally, her school lets her go to 3rd grade math 2X a week for "enrichment". I don't know if she's really a math type, but for now she seems to have some proclivity for it, and I hope it's enough to get her a qualifying score for DYS. Not the end of the world, of course, if not, but she would enjoy going to the Summit with her brother. Thanks again for your reply and the links you sent!

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    Well remember you can apply for DYS with just the qualifying IQ scores plus a portfolio.

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    Mary Mom..
    That is awesome your dd gets to go to 3rd grade math.. even if only 2x a week! As far as MAP scores and correlation.. I cant tell you but I can say that ds last winter (in kinder at the time) Math MAP was 200 and his WIAT math came out as a mid third grader 99th percentile. His fall MAP (first grade was 223 in the 93rd percentile of 4th graders and receives nothing for enrichment. HIs WISC scores are 99.5th percentile at a 138

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    It seems a little unfair that they have to be performing several years above level, given that in a normal class-room they are given no opportunity to do so. Not everyone has the time, resources or skills to make up for the teaching they are not getting at school and even the brightest kids need some help. I am not in the US so it is an academic point but for the life of me I can't work out what the kids 2 - 3 years ahead are supposed to be able to do.

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    Looking at the 2011 MAP normative data for the U.S., a winter score of 208 is a little above the 99th percentile cutoff of 205 for first graders, is at the 96th percentile for second graders, and at the 77th percentile for third graders. The fall data shows that for first graders the 99th percentile is at 197. Are you in the U.S.? If so, are you looking at the 2011 winter norms?

    DS7 took the WJ-III at age 5 and had 99.9th scores across the board, but with the highest being math, with IIRC a broad math score of 159. He tested as pretty evenly/globally gifted on the SB-5 as well. His class was given the math MAP recently this winter, and his score there was 265. His reading scores over the last couple of years have also been high but subject to much more fluctuation based on apparent (lack of) focus or interest on particular days.

    I'd go ahead with the achievement testing if money isn't extremely tight, especially since you only need one qualifying score. If the numbers aren't what you need to get into DYS, throw together a portfolio or wait and test again--my personal opinion of the program is that it's most helpful later on anyway. Do your best to prepare her to do her best (pep talk, sleep, etc.) and don't worry. Good luck.

    ETA: One thing I remember from going over the math scores with the WJ-III tester is being startled by how simplistic the subject matter seemed. Of course, my son was only five at the time. I remember for example that he had refused to do any coin problems at all, and the tester mentioned in passing that that doing basic math with coins was a big part of the test. I suspect that what exactly is on the test is kept a loosely guarded secret for good reasons, but my point is that the MAP test may stress specific skill knowledge more, or at least in much different ways.


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