Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Feels like an outsider

Lori, this is a scary statement and I encourage you to take it seriously. Going to see a therapist or counselor is nothing like going to see a doctor for scoliosis or medical tests. I would really encourage you to pursue getting him some support. It is NORMAL for people going through major medical stuff involving stress and pain to go and see a therapist. Of course it doesn't feel like it will help initially, that feeling that nothing can help is part of depression. That doesn't actually mean that it won't work. Bit by bit it does help, quite a lot for a lot of people.

Ellipse,

I understand what you are saying about your DD feeling like an outsider - we felt that way most of the time we were there.
Have you checked for someone at the college for her to talk to? I know there used to be someone there that would have been helpful, but who knows if they are still there now.
Good luck with her latest problems, I'm sorry I have no advice. If I think of a name for you I'll send you a pm.

Kerry

Very well said, passthepotatoes.

Ellipses, I read your post earlier and have been thinking about it all day. Not sure that I have anything of value to contribute, but it just really brought me back to my own struggles at that age. I always felt like an outsider for a variety of reasons, in addition to my own giftedness, I never fully fit into a single social category or group. I think it is great that you are trying to help your daughter through this AND that she is comfortable enough to share her feelings with you. I hid my own feelings of loneliness from my parents.

My own children are much younger than yours, so I don't know what it is like to parent a child through this, but here are a few things that I have thought about regarding my own experiences, maybe they would help.
--I read some research recently that said that kids feel like they need to have alot of friends, but in fact, 1 or 2 really good friends are really what helps teens through this, mental health wise. This was definitely true for me, I developed one very close friendship and a couple more fairly close friends and that really made a world of difference. So maybe you could help your daughter foster one or two close friendships rather than focusing on the being part of a larger group or crowd. Maybe someone in one of the activities she participates in? Chances are there is someone else feeling like an outsider too who might welcome a new friendship. If she were younger I would say, call the parent up and set up a playdate if she's too shy to do so herself, but I don't know what would be appropriate intervention at 14. But maybe you could find some way to encourage a new friendship though.

--I remember when I was a junior in high school an adult said to me, "Enjoy high school, it is the best time of your life!" and even at 17 I remember pitying this person. If HS is the best time of your life, that is just sad. HS was NOT the best time of my life (and I would imagine it isn't for alot of people). Things do get better! And, in light of my recent 20 year HS reunion, IMO those who seem to be on top in hs are not necessarily the ones who seem to be the most successful, happiest, etc. later in life.

--I think a pp mentioned something like this, but if the therapist doesn't help, perhaps an adult mentor would. Someone who is happy and successful now, but also struggled in HS?

Don't know if any of this is helpful to you, but I just wanted to say, I remember that feeling and it CAN be survived. Big hugs to your dd!

Depression and normal teenage angst are often hard to differentiate, even for a parent living with a child day in and day out. If a child is expressing feelings of worthlessness, it is worth it to pursue help. And if one therapist doesn't or didn't help, it doesn't mean another won't. And if it is clinical depression, medication supervised by a doctor might be the answer.

Just don't ignore the little warning bells. Sometimes this is all a child is willing to send off, and sometimes kids do drastic, permanent things in a state of depression, so the consequences of ignoring the signs are too high for everyone,

Depression is actually a normal side-effect of chronic pain/chronic medical conditions. The brain really isn't made to deal with chronic pain.

I can't speak to how effective therapy is, but I do know that reactive depression is pretty standard in my chronic pain cases.

It must be very frustrating for a boy that age to be "trapped" like that with his medical issues and I can see that he'd think college would seem like an eternity at 13. Do they have a social worker or counselor where he goes for his treatments? If I have a question about my daughter I usually start with her OT since she's gotten to know her well and is interested in helping with the whole package, including the self esteem.

Before I had a child I remember listening to older people saying, "what are all these kids so depressed about, they have so much...why are they so unhappy..." and seeing Oprah shows with teens talking about how depressed or stressed they were when the world seemed layed out at their feet and it was hard to understand.

But now with a child in school and really hearing so many stories, I don't know what the reason is but plenty of kids are really and truely depressed and stressed. A boy classmate of my daughter's said he was going to "pass away tomorrow" and my daughter asked him what he meant, and he said he was going to jump off a building. This is an 8 year old. When you mention it to the teacher though they seem to think it's probably just some sort of joke or teasing. Maybe some teachers take these things more seriously than others. Same with parents of kids that age if you try to tell them. I don't know if it's part the child being upset about something in their life at the moment and part them hearing about suicide from the news, and putting it together and not knowing what it really means or not, but it's better to err on taking it seriously whether taking immediate action or setting up appointments and letting your child see clearly that you're in their corner and are trying.

Ellipses,

Check your pms. My dd13 may be at the same camp this summer and she's having a hard year socially this year as well. She, too, is a 9th grader and, while she thinks that the other kids at her school are all nice, she is lacking in rapport with most of them and is very lonely.

I've also wondered if some of her difficulties are due to the emotional changes that come with being a teen. I do also think that some of it is the difficulty in finding other HG peers. The kids she is looking for are found in small quantities in life, but they are there somewhere. I'm really pushing my dd to get involved in mock trial and other extracurriculars at school next year to see if she meets more like souls there. She's also thinking of starting a club to raise $ for spay and neuter clinics for animals in developing nations. We were in Costa Rica last summer, which was the first big vacation our family has ever taken. It took a while to pay it off, but it was very worth it and sparked dd's interest in working to improve the conditions of the animals we saw there.

Another issue my dd has run into is that she is being raised in a family with different religious and political beliefs than many of her peers. While she does know some kids who are very bright at her school and who seem nice, she's having a hard time getting past things like class discussions in pre-AP bio where a lot of the kids say that evolution conflicts with their religious beliefs and they don't believe in it. Dh and I were both raised Catholic, but he is atheist now and I lean toward Buddhism. Dds haven't been raised in a particularly religious home. I have also been vegan for 23 yrs and dds have been vegetarian their entire lives. Dd13 has recently become vegan as well.

She has a lot that makes her different and that is hard as a teen. I think that HG kids, like our girls, have a hard enough time finding peers, but when you add in other things (shyness, different beliefs, etc.), it can be even that much harder. We've told dd that she needs to stick it out next year and are trying to give her to tools to work toward making the school experience better and to work on self advocacy, but if she is still this unhappy by the end of her sophomore year, we may have to consider something else.

I talked to my adult daughter who remembers not fitting in and feeling shy around other kids, especially after changing schools. The new school had a lot of kids in it who had a lot more money to spend on clothes than she did. The other girls could afford to do a lot more things like cheerleading classes and vacations. My daughter, who learned to read in preschool, had done very well in school until we moved and at the new school none of this mattered. She was an outsider. A smart girl without the right clothes and the right friends was a nobody at this school. She got really depressed because she was bored and had to stay home a lot because we couldn't afford to do much. This lasted about a year. That was one very long year for her, but then she found a friend. Her new friend didn't have money either, but they had things in common. They were both smart and attractive. They started shopping together and it was like they developed their own style with their limited budgets. They looked better than the girls with money. The rich girls were copying their style. My daughter learned how to do the things cheerleaders learned in classes in our front yard until we could afford the classes and she didn't take very many before she tried out for cheerleader the next year and made it. She became very social. School was not important any more. Being in the top social group was. Fifteen years later she and her best friend are still not married because they have too much fun traveling and enjoying life. They only date guys who are wealthy. Most of their friends are married to doctors. My daughter is dating a millionaire. None of this seemed possible the year she was an outsider. I am the outsider when I visit her world. I don't wear the right clothes or the right hairstyle. I am just her mom and I am happy for her.

My daughter talks to her little brother every day about her life experiences and he does the same. He tells her things that he does not tell me. She doesn't think he needs to see a therapist. She thinks he is handling the brace as well as anyone possibly could. It hurts. He can't do much in it. What could a therapist do to make this any better for him? He knows he won't have to wear the brace forever, probably just another year or two (until he stops growing) and after that he will be able to do more. She talks to him about all the fun things he will be able to do when he no longer has to wear the brace. I think this is what gives him hope that his life will get better. She says he is a lot like her and that he would be very social if he had a chance. He does not have that chance here. She thinks living in a small town with nothing to do and not having a friend with common interests is his biggest problem and that he will be fine when he can move away from here. She says the town we live in is depressing.

Lori,
It is great your daughter weathered being an outsider for a year and came out happily dating millionaires. I don't know that I would assume that your son's experience will be the same. From your posts it sounds like your son has some particular challenges that she does not including: scoliosis, migraines, physical disabilities that will not go away when the scoliosis brace comes off, challenges with skills like handwriting that impact on his ability to access appropriate educational experiences, being less accepted by some family due to his interests, intense fears of medical procedures, chronic pain, having experienced the death of people he's close to, and being an "outsider" for a lot longer than a year. That is a very, very long list and a small fraction of that would be justification to pursue therapy.

I wouldn't expect therapy to be like a magic wand eliminating all problems in his life. I would expect it to be a place he could safely process some of what is happening to him and learn anxiety relieving strategies that may help him move from a place of feeling like he "can't stand to go on like this for so long." There is quite a bit of research suggesting a improvements in patients with chronic pain who get cognitive behavioral therapy.

I really hope you will get him some help.