Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Age or Ability Specific Forums Pre-school Plays by her own rules

We just had a preschool parent-teacher conference for dd4.5 yesterday. Their number one goal for her, for the year, is to learn to play with others when she doesn't choose the game or set all the rules. *sigh*

The preschool is awesome, the teachers are perceptive, and they're right. This seems to be a common problem. What have you done to teach social compromise and to encourage following instead of just leading?
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For background - our region is enriched for bright and gifted folks, and this is the language-immersion option at the fancy preschool, so extra enriched. I have encountered one boy in her class that I would pick as gifted - but he's the quiet tower-building sort, not the exuberant learn about everything and then act it out with extra fairies sort. Her teachers seem blown away by the breadth and depth of her knowledge and interests so I guess she must be unusual. They want her speech evaluated because she's having trouble making herself understood - but they admit that she was trying to communicate 'amphibian' and it wasn't clear whether the other kids couldn't understand her pronunciation, or just didn't know what an amphibian was...

I assume this is her classmates are her age?

The amphibian speech is what she hears from the other kids. Or she has a hearing issue.

As for sharing. Mr W had this issue, too, when he was in with age peers as he would run all over them. Now in with kids 1-2 years older, its not a problem. If he gets pushy, they push right back. LOL.

If they are "blown away" then that is a sign that you might consider some changes.

Yes, the classmates are her age. She was trying to explain about amphibians and they weren't getting it.

So, a change of cohort would help, since there would be ideas she was interested in that she didn't come up with? At the moment, if no one wants to play her game, she plays alone.

If the teachers suggested having her speech evaluated I'm guessing there have been other concerns outside of the amphibian incident? Does your dd join in with the other children ever when there is a game she didn't choose?

If it was me, and the teachers were recommending an evaluate, I'd consider it. There mght not be anything at all that comes out of it, but if there is something your dd is challenged with, you'll regret it if you put it off now and find out there really is a challenge later.

Best wishes,

polarbear

Yeah, we will probably evaluate- there are extra complications because her ped retired, so we have to find a new one before we can get a referral. But as soon as we can we'll get in, maybe Jan or Feb.

As I understand, she doesn't join games that she can't manipulate, and leaves within a few minutes of losing control of the group's direction.

Meh, what is wrong with it? My mom told me I hated playing with other kids in preschool when they wouldn't follow the rules of the game. I know I purposely avoided games that I thought were boring or that were being played "wrong" and I didn't suffer for it. I wanted to do it my way and I was more than happy to do that alone or with one other friend who didn't mind following.

I think I was more willing to go along if I was hanging around older children, but I rarely did that. I remember looking up to the two girls on the block who were a few years older than me.

I was just thinking about this yesterday, though. My sister pointed it out. I was "bossy" in grade school and now all the people who hated my bossiness in school are constantly asking for my advice about anything close to or in my area of expertise.

Bossy in grade school isn't all that unusual of a phase that any kid might go through, just as being anxious over starting kindergarten or refusing to eat anything with a crust on it or having to sleep with a night light on or being shy when you have to talk to an adult are all typical kid behavior. However, if a teacher such as the preschool teachers here, who spend their days with young children, are seeing something that they feel warrants an evaluation, I think it's important to listen. Our oldest ds is so danged obviously intelligent that we spent several years discounting teacher feedback on things they were seeing as being perfectionism or shyness etc. Eventually he couldn't cope anymore, we were forced into an eval and we found out he had a learning disability. When our oldest dd was in her first preschool we were always being called in to talk about behavioral concerns and at one point the head of the school recommended a hearing evaluation based on dd's behavior. Instead of listening carefully to what was said, trying to get to the root of it, we made the assumption that it was a personality clash with a teacher and we dealt with the situation by switching preschools. DD's behavior *did* improve once she was in an entirely different setting - but then a few years later, in early elementary, she was struggling like crazy to learn to read, and we ultimately found out she had a severe vision challenge. It wasn't what the first preschool staff guessed it to be, but they were spot on that *something* wasn't typical with her behavior.

polarbear

As usual I agree with Polarbear. While my dd did not have any social issues there were certainly other areas of concern that I wish we had jumped on earlier. People had difficulty understanding her speech. We were told it was likely because she was using such advanced vocabulary that people didn't expect it from her so they were taken aback and noticed that instead of listening to what she was saying. This combined with using words her mouth wasn't really developmentally ready to say so they came out unclear. Now in first grade she has started working with the speech therapist. By now, though, it has combined with some of her other ld issues so things like sounding out words is harder. She writes words phonetically correctly for how she is pronouncing them but is often pronouncing them all wrong. A bit of speech therapy at 3 or 4 might have reduced her issues now.

As for the not playing along with other kids if she can't be in control - it reminds me of my nephew who recently turned 21. He always was that way and his parents just thought he had "a difficult personality" and were sure that they were smarter than the teachers. I have assumed he is likely somewhere on the autism spectrum but can't understand how it was never caught - maybe his parents just didn't want to hear it when the issue was raised. Anyway, despite being absolutely brilliant he dropped out of high school and was unable to complete class after class at the local community college after receiving a GED. He simply CAN'T get himself to do things the way other's want. It is his way or no way. So now this brilliant young man is living in his father's basement - no school, no job. He has decided to devote himself to creating a web comic for the next 5 years because no one will try to tell him what to do. I saw him over Christmas and he complained several times about how much he wished he could have even 1 friend... So it may be no problem at all as islandofapples says or it could be an indicator of potential problems down the road. Personally I would take the preschool's input very seriously on this one.

JMHO...

What Polarbear and Pemberley said. There is a real difference between "bossy" in a typical way and "unable to depart from own mental script for how things should be." The latter can become a serious problem, and is better addressed than not. Often it's only a professional who can distinguish them at this age, but a teacher tipoff is not to be ignored IMO.

DeeDee

I have a slightly different take. DS hard a hard time in Pre-k, the other kids didn't know what he was talking about and he preferred talking to the adults or reading. He also would try to get kids to play his games, he said that the other kids ideas to play were boring - and they were for him. Initially I took the teacher's perspective very seriously that he needed to learn to socialize better and that he needed to adapt. Until i realized this was actually about changing him to make him fit in better. Then I stopped thinking the teacher knew what she was talking about. She had no experience with his intellectual growth and capacity and he didnt even show it all. So from her persective he needed social tutoring. Yet all the problems she noticed disappeared when he played with older kids. Wth his age mates, DS eventually started making up his own games within the other kids games - they would be playing tag - he was capturing evil villains and bringing them to jail on another planet. I think learning how to get along, and play cooperatively is a good thing, but not recognizing that increased knowledge and ability makes play different is not fair to the kid.

I realized the difference when he went to camp where the counselors, also Pre-k teachers, and those teachers helped him to invite the kids into his world and his ideas. The teachers could help her negotiate with her age mates, but she might also simply need more than they can give. There are so many stories here of girls especially turning off their skills or even regressing to fit in - if they don't do that, they likely come off as bossy.

DeHe