Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums General Discussion Psychologist "diagnosis" - no school will work

I agree with the other posters that supposing no school will work for a 3 year-old is pretty suspect. I have seen so many posts like this over the years and I think generally, testers and psychologists do a serious disservice by making such claims for much older kids, let alone 3 yo. I had such advice given to me and it freaked me out and as I learned way more about PG kids, I came to recognize that it was quite short-sighted.

I like jack'smom response about structure. Pretty much the point of early education is teaching children to follow rules and make transitions between what they want to do and what needs to be done next and learning to interact in groups. 3 yo are not usually good at such things and part of growing up is mastering enough self-control to interact well with others. These are things anyone needs to learn eventually to function in the real world unless they have some very, very unusual situation where everyone caters to their every desire. I don't know anyone like that. A more structured situation may actually work better and your son may adapt as necessary.

In large gatherings of PG parents, I've seen an astonishing array of choices made and educational situations from college at super early ages to lock-step education in a regular classroom have worked wonderfully for very, very smart kids. I don't think IQ precludes any particular educational option and the interaction of IQ, available options, personality, teacher, other activities, etc., matter a great deal. Some PG kids can daydream and create poetry in their heads while bored in a regular school and some go nuts. Some kids find great outlets for their energy and talent that aren't related to school and school becomes secondary to high level sports training or music or whatever. Some PG kids get along great with their age peers and some prefer other ages depending on emotional maturity. Some local areas have great school options for really smart kids and some areas have nothing worthwhile. It's pretty hard to predict those things for a 3 yo and seeing how things unfold over time might be more useful than scary predictions made by someone who met a kid for an hour.

I too think three years old is way waaaay too early for anyone (parent or professional) to be making dire predictions about what will and won't work in a child's life. You've tried one preschool so far - it happened to be Montessori but even Montessori's come in many different flavors and the staff who run them can be extremely influential in the experience children will have there. I also think it's too early for a psych to know for sure with limited testing that a child is PG. If *you* see signs in your child that you feel indicate PG, then yes, your child probably is - but I wouldn't trust that from one session with one psychologist.

I especially think 3 is way way way too early to forward-predict behavioral challenges. I do absolutely believe that for kids who truly have behavioral challenges they can and do show up at and before 3. But I've also known a lot of 3 year olds (including my own kids lol) who have behavioral challenges that are situation-dependent sometimes, other times they are simply because the child is 3. You've done exactly what I would have done in this situation re the behaviors - pull him out of this school and try another school after a break. As time goes on, keep watching. If the challenges with behaviors stop suddenly you'll know it was situational re this school; if they continue then do your best to observe them and understand what sets them off, and then move forward to figure out how to help your ds to cope.

I also think it's important to try to remember that it's not easy to tease out what is giftedness vs something else and sometimes it's easy for us as parents to say "oh, he does ___ but that's because he's gifted/bored/not challenged/etc." Sometimes that is the case, but sometimes our kids are acting out due to other reasons too, so it's important to keep an open mind and really observe what's going on so if there *are* other challenges you recognize them early on.

Best wishes,

polarbear

Difficult isn't the same thing as "no school will work" for your DS. Yes, it likely will be difficult. I will even go so far as to agree that "no school is likely to work for him" WITHOUT ACCOMMODATIONS. Here is where you come in as parents. You will be advocates and you will work with the schools to try to meet your kiddo's needs. Difficult? Yes. Impossible? No. And depending on where you live, there may be options in different school settings. And homeschooling is a lovely option, if you can swing it.

We were told the same thing by our DS's tester. We were also told that at some point our DS would need to skip a grade, even if he was in a program for GT kids. And it proved to be quite true. We worked with our local school the spring before kindergarten to get help getting a teacher who wanted him and who was good at differentiation. We worked again with the local schools to get a grade skip. Things probably would have been OK for a little longer, but it was still a lot of work advocating in our local district. Then we discovered an opening in a school for HG kids. With DS's grade skip, the accelerated program was perfect, and it's been great so far. The best part is that I haven't had to advocate for more yet, so it's been a nice little rest.

Others here have different paths, but the similar story of "it will be difficult for your kid to fit in". I would say that is true only if you do not do anything to advocate for appropriate materials for your kiddo. Do not despair! Even though it's hard to hear, it will be OK.

Just wanted to share my son's story in the hopes of encouraging you.
My DS went to pre-k at 3 yo and it was much like you described, disinterest in age-peers, hitting, kicking at times. My boy disliked the 'arts/crafts' bit, he was bored by it and has always wanted activities with a tangible purpose/job or complex pretend play. He actually was disorganized and frustrated seeming at times. His behavior perplexed the teachers and frustrated everyone, including my son.

Fast forward to NOW...he entered his 2nd year of pre-k this past fall, and somehow something had just 'jelled' for him neuro or behavior-wise. He has control over his hands, emotions, he waits and attends, his teachers are amazed at his high level of empathy, and I am relieved.

So, there is the hope that some of your LO's current school issues may disappear or lessen as your LO matures. I had a wise friend who is a Pre-K director in another state and the parent of 3 gifted girls remind me that although my LO is gifted, he is STILL only 3 yo emotionally, and he just couldn't hold all of his pre-k angst together last year.

In addition, my LO has some psychomotor OE, he is incredibly intense, I now realize he is also very sensitive, but he just didn't show/verbalize things as well at 3. He is an only child who was in a quiet home, and then thrust into a class with 8 other kids, and he was possibly affected by more sensory stim than he was used to! ALSO, during the summer in between both years, I made it a point to get him a sitter with some kids older and younger so he would work out more social rules- he has always preferred adults, but he needed to learn how to be with kids, IYKWIM??

Anyway, I just wanted to throw my experiences out there in case anyone can glean something useful.

Bottom line- maybe your LO just needs more time to grow into his big cognitive skills, and ? if asynchronous dev is what was the problem for my bright active sweet boy?

PS- he's doing great now, the teachers LOVE having him in class and find him a 'non-issue'. Last year he was THAT kid and head on tackler. Go figure!

Keep your eyes on the prize, don't give up, and wish us luck in full-day kindergarten next year!!!

PPS- Montessori wouldn't have worked well for him, he's just too individual and thrives with structure/framework...

I love you guys!! Thanks for all the great responses.

I'm so sorry for my terrible and misleading title for this thread. I wanted to have the title be "probably" no school will work, or something similar... but I ran into the issue of character limits! So it was a terrible choice of titles that I landed on, and making it sound like the psych was far more harsh and definitive than what she was in her statements.

Oh, and polarbear... just to touch on something you mentioned. This is actually my son's second preschool. So the new one we are starting in the fall will be his third.

I don't know if I think DS is PG. I really don't. Our DD seems to be obviously going that way. I've read the Ruf's book on levels of giftedness, and DS definitely fits the descriptions of level 5 kids - meeting or exceeding the milestones indicated in that book for other level 5 kids. But I really don't feel I (or anyone) can say how gifted he is at this point. He's still just way too young. I'm sure many people who are greater experts than me would disagree, but from what I understand I don't feel even an IQ test would be definitive at this age. He's certainly highly gifted, but it is way too early to say much more IMHO --- and I'd say the same for any kid his age.

This is SO Wolf! I wouldn't be at all surprised to have heard myself say exactly the same thing about him.

Wolf skipped K and is subject accelerated in most areas on top of that. He didn't miss skipping K since it's really not much more than preK and he'd attended preK for a while.

Bear is the the OP reminds me of the most though. When he was three there was no way I could imagine sending him to preK or school ever really due to the tantrums, single mindedness, irritation with peers, etc. Now he has been at the local special ed preschool once a week for an hour or two for about four months and has had two years of growth. He is a totally different kid. Several of the issues he had just months ago are nearly gone. It's not due to the school either, at least not in my mind. It's physical growth and skills.

No need to apologize. The truth is, when the psychologist told us normal schools probably wouldn't work for our DS, what I heard at the time was "no school will work".

Mr W is in the same boat right now. We'll give him a year or two of homeschool and then see. Things change!

It depends on the school. Really. I have a child like what you described and it does make it harder. I think it could work though if we found a school that would even be willing to work with us. We have 1, yes 1 option where we live. Seriously there is one school within 800 air miles. And they are adamantly opposed to trying anything...even though they know that the standard won't work for her. In a closed meeting (I had an insider tell me this) they all decided we should homeschool and that it would be easier on them and so they when pushed won't budge on anything. But we have an odd situation here. We can't explore others schools or other methods. I do know some schools will radically accelerate or will compact curriculum and be inventive for a child. I went to one of those...but now we live thousands of miles from that school LOL. So all this is to say it is true he might always have a problem in school, but you may also be able to find a fit somewhere with persistence and a little luck.