Well... Given what I've read on here before, I guess I shouldn't be surprised. We went to a "meet the teacher" at the school recently, and we were very disappointed to find out that DS5's kindergarten teacher still had NO CLUE that DS is getting to be quite a proficient little reader. And her first reaction when she witnessed him reading for all of us? She suggested he could be a helper.

I understand that it's challenging for teachers to meet all of their students' needs. And I understand that he'll be ready for grade 1 no problem. And luckily for DS5, he's not a kid who will be bothered by any of this - the play-based learning will just be play to him and he'll merrily go on with his day. And I guess, it's just fine that he won't be accelerated because he won't be bored (at least not yet).

So why can't I help but want a bit more for him? Thing is, we haven't had him tested yet, and he may not be gifted. But even if he isn't gifted, he is still definitely not going to learn much in kindergarten (he's got the math thing down as well, his social skills are great, etc.). Should that be ok? I really don't know.

Hi RRD -- I am assuming your son is in SK? Does he have the same teachers this year that he had last year in JK? Also, what size class does he have?

In my experience, this is still pretty early in the lifetime of a Kindergarten class. I am willing to bet that the teachers are really just trying make sure students know routines and rules more than anything else at this point. They probably don't know your son can read because it really isn't part of the curriculum, particularly so early in the school year.

Our son's Kindergarten teachers started a reading program for SKs (and some advanced JKs) around December last year and it was an effective way for them to keep tabs on how the class was doing. Maybe you could ask your son's teachers if they have anything like that planned for later on in the school year?

One morning on the way to school last year my DS and I were discussing ancient Rome and, in particular, we were discussing the fact that some children were not given an education. I told him he should feel lucky that he can go to school and learn something new every day. Without missing a beat, he responded that he did feel so lucky and explained that he "learns something new every day and then goes and tells [his] teachers about it". He has so many interests outside of school that we try to foster (like Ancient Rome...). But I feel that he learned a lot at school as well -- like how to get along with others and how to look after his belongings at lunch time etc. He was also very lucky that his teachers did, in fact, give him an opportunity to speak to them about his outside interests.

I hope your son's teachers will become equally interested in listening to his stories and encouraging him to read at whatever level he wants, as the year progresses.

Been there... For my son K was only half day. What I did in this situation was decided not to sweat it since DS was learning other softer skills such as social skills & EF skills. As long as the class is play based and he doesn't seem bored I wouldn't worry too much this year & just after school him more challenging material if you can.

For my son 2nd grade is where the boredom really set in and became a problem.

DS (kid who has tested HG+) had a lovely time in half-day K, even though he was on the older side...but I think it was mostly because he loved the new routine and being in class with kids his age. Even though it was apparent to him that he had already learned most everything academic they were teaching him by the first month, he enjoyed himself. Though there seemed to be near-universal agreement that the novelty would have worn off if we didn't make some pretty major changes for the following year.

HJA: Yes, he does happen to have the same teachers as last year. Actually come to think of it, that makes it even more frustrating to me that they still haven't noticed that he's reading. He was starting to read quite well already toward the end of JK, and they still haven't noticed.

bluemagic and George C: I think he'll eventually be in the same boat as your DC (and many more like them). Ultimately, even if he doesn't get bored this year, he'll get bored at some point. And that's when the real problems could begin.

But even more than that, it seems unfair to a child to have them sitting on the sidelines until they finally get to learn something in the classroom. And at the rate this kid seeks out enrichment at home, that could be a while. I guess there are many parents out there who would say that's a nice problem to have.

I'm in a similar situation. DD5 is in K and hasn't yet been tested; even if she doesn't test gifted, she's ahead and she also learns quickly.

We're also in a play-based classroom. The big difference I see is that the teachers *seem* to be willing to listen to me on differentiation; time will tell, though, because we're waiting until parent-teacher conferences in October to discuss. My plan is to go ahead and establish early on that she needs differentiation, even though I don't anticipate an issue in K (similar thing - it's play-based and DD just enjoys being with friends -- also, she's not zooming ahead in learning that much these days, compared to her rate of development when she was a baby/toddler). That way, the discussion has started for whenever it does become an issue, whether that's 1st or 2nd grade.

My main worry is that DD is only about 1.5 grades ahead right now in reading/math, so that might not seem like an urgent issue to the school. But she learns fast, so once school becomes more traditional, she's going to get very annoyed with all the repetition.

Our school seems to have some experience with G/MG kids, and I don't think she's going to test higher than that. So I think we'll be okay as long as we're armed with MAP scores (they just finished testing last week) as well as when she tests on the WPPSI, which will be within the month. Their gifted program is only a 30 min/week pullout for K, but at least they do identify that early and I can have the G&T teacher as a resource. I plan to ask if she can do a Singapore math workbook while the kids are on their 'math stations'. Where she is in the workbook is behind what she actually knows (it's like basic subtraction; at home she's doing two and three digit addition as well as basic multiplication) so she can work independently without needing too much help. Luckily, she *likes* workbooks -- she just has stopped wanting to do it at home and has asked to do it at school.

As for reading, she reads in a "bull in china shop" style -- that is, more whole language/sight words than an understanding of how to 'sound it out.' I've noticed the teacher is asking her to write a few sentences during "journal time" about what she's drawn that day (most kids, including her, draw, not write), and that's really what she needs. She doesn't have much practice writing/spelling, and I also think during reading the teacher is giving her harder words and having her sound it out more.

So, your mileage may vary; if your DS is more advanced than my DD, you might have bigger issues later on. I'm hopeful in our case. As many have noted on the board, schools generally can deal with G/MG kids okay; it's the HG+ kids that throw them for a loop. Even if pigs fly and she actually tests HG+, my experience with her seems to suggest she'll be fine in a regular classroom as long I establish that differentiation is absolutely necessary. I do think it'll be more and more necessary as the curriculum gets traditional, because knowing her, she'll start picking things up much faster than she is now.

Yes, that would be frustrating. I was thinking maybe they were just getting to know him, but if they have already had a year then you'd think they would have picked up on the fact that he can read. Hmmmm... Perhaps this will require a follow-up meeting with them in which you can politely ask them what they plan to do to help him advance his skills. As much as I think the play-based curriculum is a decent introduction to school, I also think children should be encouraged to actually learn something while they are at school. Maybe you can ask the teachers if you can send in a book bin of interesting materials that you son can use throughout the school day (and that would be available to others as well)?

Good luck!

You may have read this elsewhere on the forums, and it's important to know that differentiation is a buzzword which only means something is different: the advanced students may be required to twiddle their thumbs, mark time, march in place, tread water, or other catch phrases which indicate busy work with no real intellectual challenge or moving forward with measurable academic learning gains.

With "differentiation" the pupil's school experience is somehow different, but this term is sufficiently nebulous as to what is "different" for the student's educational experience. Too often the difference may be in work-products expected (differentiated task demands), possibly including more stringent grading criteria, rather than a qualitatively different instructional level and pacing.

In general, gifted kids and advanced learners need and may benefit from "differentiated instruction", not "differentiated task demands".

As tedious as it may be, I encourage parents to look beyond buzzwords and learn the 5Ws of any gifted program or offering, in order to understand what their child will experience (and proactively assess it's potential positive or detrimental effects).

I'm comforted by this Hoagies page:

That's just a bit bizarre to me. How could they not notice he's a reader? Surely he's not the only one at age 5 reading. I still remember the day my then three-year-old's teacher called me in and asked if I knew he could read.

He's now five and also not going to learn a ton this year. But he very happily skips off to school and participates fully. I get your worries, and I have them too, but we're looking at things one year at time. If he's happy and making progress in weaker areas (like writing) without slipping or getting lazy, we'll keep the status quo up.

So I don't have a solution, but I do have a happy five-year-old who isn't going to see much new academically but will also have school time to build a weather airplane with radio antenna to let everyone know when bad weather is coming.

I hope your little boy enjoys as much as mine does.

HJA and RRD are both under the same curriculum that my DD went through so I can guess at the answer to this one. The curriculum is all play based and child driven. When DD was in JK/SK the main reading was done with parent volunteers out in the hall. I could tell you what level every kid in the class was at since I was one of those parents. It was all wrote down in a binder so the teacher also knew but it wasn't something that they personally experienced and it wasn't an emphasis of the program.

DD8 actually liked it and we were super lucky in that she had amazing teachers and ECE's those years AND she was in a class with a few other bright (possibly gifted?) kids. I wouldn't say that she learned any math, reading or writing but she did learn a lot of other things and generally enjoyed it. Even with great social skills going in there were so many new people and situations that were new and challenging.

We did lots of stuff outside of school as well. She eventually hit a wall at school but I don't have any regrets for JK and SK for her. DS on the other hand went through before the full-day stuff came in and if I knew then what I know now we would have done things differently. In the end, we all survived and we probably wouldn't be where we are today without those experiences so it is what it is. We did the best we could at the time given the information that we had.

Thank you for this, indigo. I am indeed using differentiation as a shorthand,but the idea of measurable academic learning gains and benchmarks is the language I need.

I know we're only in Kindergarten, but I'm trying to find a way to express to the teacher during parent-teacher conferences that I'm still worried about what my daughter is or is not learning in K. I'm a huge believer in play-based classrooms (esp because of social skills, etc), but we've already done a year at the same school of PK where she did get that great introduction to how school works. I didn't sweat it during PK, but I'm watching her in K and thinking..man, something's off. The idea of benchmarks and goals is what it is.

Case in point: I volunteered today during their language arts unit. They do centers, where there are definitely *opportunities* for differentiated learning. Some of the kids chose to make little books where they drew a picture and wrote about their pictures. A lot of those kids couldn't even write their letters correctly but they were working so hard to create something and I could see their little brains turning and I could see them growing.

DD5, being the creative one, chose the play-doh station, as she does consistently. Now, the play-doh station hits K benchmarks: they have to make letters with the play-doh, which is a great boon to the kids who still don't have familiarity with the letter shapes. But DD knows her letters. She's known them since she was 18 months old. There was *value* in what she was doing -- creative, social, expressive -- but there was no language arts value. Now, part of my job was to go around to the different stations and make sure the kids stayed on task. So at the whiteboards, they shouldn't just be drawing; they needed to be writing. So although there is social, creative, expressive value to drawing, they needed to actively be engaged in something that had language arts value.

Well, for DD, even though she was staying on task, it doesn't mean anything. There is no educational boon to her making letters with play-doh. It hit Kindergarten benchmarks, but not DD's benchmarks, whatever they are. The opportunity to differentiate was there -- she could have been working on writing a book (and writing/spelling is something she could use a lot of work on). There she could have challenged herself, but she's only 5, and she's not the same as some of the PG kids on here. She thinks like a 5 year old, so play-doh it was.

So what do I do there? How do I explain to the teacher, without sounding like a pushy mom, that I'm disappointed that although the opportunity is there, the strong encouragement for her to try harder isn't there? How do you single a kid out in a play-based classroom and say, "no, this station isn't for you. You need to work on xyz skills instead"? You really can't. I can, when I'm volunteering there, to steer her in that direction,but the parent volunteers the other days of the week aren't going to do that.

And that's language arts, where I think she's not really that ahead. What about math? At the most, the classroom could have her add and subtract dice (she of course, instead chooses to do the magnatiles..which again, yes, there is a creative and expressive value, but the kid isn't learning math that way). But even if she did the dice, my DD who knows basic multiplication wouldn't be challenging herself. How the heck do you do that in K?

I think sadly the answer is to let it go, and wait until it becomes an issue in a more traditional classroom. But I don't like that because that's addressing a problem once you have one, not being proactive. I get the sense that most of you, even with PG kids, just "let it go" during K. Is that what I have to do (since she is, obviously, happy)? She's happy, but she's not in a growth mindset, and I hate that.

JBD, you've expressed this so well.

IMO, there is great value to a child in making choices, as this is an integral part of "owning" their education and their lives... having internal locus of control.

I'm a big believer in "talking about our day" whether over dinner, while riding in the car, having an after-school snack or any other time.

An easy starting point with young children is "Let's talk about our day!" I'd probably ask DD how she liked having mom as the volunteer helper... see if she has any tips or comparisons with what other parents do when they are the helper... see how she felt about having you there on this day (or in general). Thank her for any input, showing you value her perspective. I'd mention that you were proud of her, as she seemed happy with her choices, her friends/classmates, her project, etc. I'd probably ask what she thought about the station and activity she chose, and how she felt about them as well. I'd get around to asking about other stations... whether she's ever tried them, which ones she's tried, what she thought about them, how she felt about them. Depending upon her answers, I'd consider inquiring whether the same kids tend to go to the same stations routinely, and/or whether a group of kids tend to go together to a station... and who seems to decide. Between each question I'd express a lot of affirmation and validation for her, her observations, viewpoints, and choices. If she seems interested and it might help keep the conversation balanced (so she does not feel grilled) possibly share a little bit about how kindergarten has changed since you were that age as well as what you thought and how you felt about different opportunities you had in kindergarten.

IMO, building a rapport with your child and understanding that they are independent thinkers... learning how they think and finding out what is going into a child's decision-making throughout the years is very, very important. This can be your early-warning system for any troubles on the horizon (whether academic, social, motivational, etc).

During these conversations, you might find that your child would enjoy writing a book at home (but not in front of others)... or that your child would like play dough at home and then would prefer to write a book in school... or that your child tends to move with one or more particular children (or avoid one or more particular children), or peacefully/passively let everyone else choose first and then go to the station which has space. My point is, there are endless possibilities and it may be highly insightful to learn from her perspective how she is making her decisions in school, and who she is choosing to be in that environment.

Take your time, move slowly to ensure you are always supporting your child's pace and not pushing. Keep solidly in touch with your child, and be prepared to be amazed with both the intellectual growth spurts and the plateauing.

Just my 2 cents.

That's scary, Portia. Especially since we are in the middle of the advocating business.

This is pretty much exactly what I'm doing with DS5 in his K year, particularly the bolded portion. He attends K for half-days and naps/is homeschooled in the after school hours. My goal is for him to be challenged and excited about one thing he learns every day at home, and we generally exceed that target. School is gravy.

Kindergarten, for our family, is an opportunity for DS to learn the "school" schema and adapt his social skills to be effective at getting his social needs met with others in a resource- and time-limited setting. My goal for this year is for him to finish K with a handful of friends, a stronger immune system (haha!), and the confidence to be a more independent learner next year in a structured classroom that challenges him at least somewhat.

For our home-based learning, I set appropriate academic goals for DS. I've effectively continued our homeschool approach. It doesn't take a lot of time on task; half an hour of shared reading a day in chapter books he enjoys, an hour of math a week, 10 minutes of handwriting every second day, sporadic practise keyboarding). The rest is extension based on interest--programming a robot, almost-daily science experiments, designing and building all sorts of devices, museum trips, etc.

The more I see of DS' approach to learning, the more I believe that half days in a play-based program is a tolerable compromise. He enjoys some traditional kindergarten activities, like practising handwriting, and his natural competitiveness means he's motivated to improve this lagging skill. Great. It's not in any way meeting his academic needs, but as long as the program doesn't condescend to teach him *anything*, it's a playgroup, and will suffice.

I should add that having DS in kindergarten has had one nice additional benefit--excellent cooperation with homeschooling. He now knows what the alternative is, and is aware of what a good deal he has, so his motivation to cooperate with home-based learning is high. Win!

So update on my end(I'm not the OP but also expressed kindergarten concerns on this thread):

As a recap, DD is in a public kindergarten that is very play-based, child-led (Reggio Emilia-based). She attended PreK there as well. I had her parent-teacher conference today and was pretty nervous about discussing math differentiation. I felt okay on reading/language arts because over the weeks of the classroom as a parent volunteer and realized the teacher is focusing mostly on phonemic awareness and writing, which are two of DD's weaknesses. DD is very good at sight words and has been reading them since 2.5, but never quite learned the other pillars of literacy. Unlike a lot of "academic" kindergartens, this school doesn't have the kids memorizing words or really forcing reading at all and instead works on sounds and the building blocks of literacy.

I know I was concerned about her choosing play-dough centers, etc, but indigo's response really calmed me down, and I also saw that the teacher was indeed asking the kids to do more writing the weeks went on.

DD's MAP scores had her at 158 for reading, which puts her at a 91st percentile for an incoming kindergartner. The teacher's goals for her are to have her writing paragraphs and really mastering phonics by the end of the year. I'm glad for the "paragraphs" goal because it really seems she's wanting to challenge my daughter, in a class where the other kids might not even know how to write their letters correctly.

Math MAP scores had her at 174, which is 99th percentile, (and would be about a 84th percentile for an incoming 1st grader). Her teacher's goals were having her able to count by 2s, 5s, and 10s...which she can already do! She was surprised to hear that and surprised to hear that since her test, which was taken about a month ago, she's been moving on toward 2 digit addition and subtraction with regrouping. So I think that kind of opened her eyes to the fact that DD will need some extra differentiation in the future.

I was very clear that DD loves kindergarten so I don't want to mess with what she's already doing, even if she's not really learning that much. I did ask that her math centers have options to work on number sense and problem solving, as DD isn't a very abstract math thinker and those are the skills she needs work on. It seems her math centers (which I haven't observed) do have those as skills to learn so that's good to hear.

Also, I told the teacher my main concern was 1st grade in beyond. I didn't want DD sitting in a class next year learning how to add and subtract over the course of 6 months when she mastered that long ago. It seems the Reggio Emilia/play based ed continues up to third grade (when public school testing starts to ruin everything), so I won't have much to worry about. In addition, she said she will make sure she's placed in a specific first grade class next year where the teacher would have no problem moving her into 2nd grade math. And she'll have me meet with that teacher this year so we can figure out what the 1st grade expectations are, so we can make sure DD checks all those boxes and can easily move a grade up in math (ex: I only now just taught her about "fact families", because we just learned that was a thing that 1st graders need to know).

Sorry about the novel, but I'm just glad we're all on the same page. If she hadn't offered a meeting with the first grade teacher, I might have still been frustrated about math (given the easy goals given for her by the teacher), but that offer gives me a lot of peace of mind.

I think this school would still have no idea how to deal with an HG+ kid, but it seems to be a pretty good deal for a G/MG type kid (if she's even gifted). So glad it's the free neighborhood school and not the wonderful but expensive Reggio Emilia school 20 minutes away (that my husband went to and loved).

This is my main concern as well! Ultimately, I don't even want to ask for differentiation this year when it's play-based and he's still enjoying himself and behaving well. Because after all, the more he learns this year, the more he'll have to sit still next year waiting for the others in the class to learn what he already knows. DS6 is in grade 2 this year and it's a bit of a disaster because of it.

Is it bad that I don't want DS5 to learn too fast this year, because I feel like it will do more harm than good? I know that a growth mindset is important, but he has that in spades because it just comes naturally to him. I figure he can just join the other kids at some point along the way, whenever the material catches up to him. That's more or less what I did. Mind you it only happened when I got to university, but it worked out fine anyway. School was just a place where I went to socialize until I hit university. Though maybe I would've achieved greater things if I'd been motivated all along? Who knows. Funny anecdote - apparently, Stephen Hawking only started feeling challenged once he started on his PhD at Cambridge. And no, I'm not suggesting that I'm anywhere near in the same stratosphere as Stephen Hawking!!!!! It's just a funny anecdote about him that the boys and I learned last night when reading one of the Getting to Know the World's Greatest Inventors and Scientists books. Love those books. Ok, major digression at this point...

In any case, I think we'll just enjoy this year for DS5 because he's having a great time. And he seems to be "self-differentiating" on his own anyway. For Canadian Thanksgiving, each child had to draw a picture of something for which they were grateful. Most of the other kids scribbled pictures and maybe managed to scribble a word or two. DS5 drew a picture of one of our cats and wrote across most of the page - "I'm thankful for our cat because he's the king of the neighborhood and he guards our house." He has been coming home with books he makes during class, and some of them are pretty great stories. He also seems to be able to read everything he comes across. I think he's ready for chapter books, and I'm not sure how he learned to read that quickly. This is so vastly different than for DS6, who still needs to work fairly hard at it.