Looking for some ideas here.

DD14 has been entertaining the idea of participating in Rush Week next summer when she is (barely) 15yo.

Now, I don't really know if she'll even be permitted to do so, number one, and number two, DH and I both have some very, very serious reservations about the Greek system which are based in our first-hand observations over some forty years (and at no less than five public institutions, ranging from 10% to 95% Greek).

I personally think that the Greek system is bad, bad news-- and probably even WORSE news for a very young college student like my DD.

I can't think that she'd actually like it anyway, and she certainly would have a great deal of trouble living in a sorority house given her hard-core food restrictions and her age (um, six YEARS 'underage' for alcohol, and a solid three years for 'age of consent' in our state).

So I'm not sure that I see the point of all of it, either way.

But I am willing to be convinced if others here see a value in sorority life and membership that I'm perhaps missing.

My experience suggests that sorority sisters tend to be clustered around the mean of the institution's scores and ability, and that they tend to (at co-ed institutions) value femininity and sports, but also skew wildly toward "Barbie" culture-- emphasis on physical appearance, conformity with gender norms and view sexuality as worth, etc.

What am I missing?

No. Emphatically.

I call shenanigans!

Well, that could mean a lot of things, Jon... on the entire system? Rush week in particular??

Or just on the idea that I might be open to the idea... (hmm-- think I stated emphatically that I'm going to require convincing)

Some background here-- this is an interest of DD's primarily because of one older young woman that my DD knows (and admires) through a club sport on this campus. She is a sorority member, and has encouraged DD to "check it out," as did a young woman in the lab where she interned last summer. DH isn't quite as dead-set against it as I am, knowing one of the two young women in question.

Neither of those individuals was aware that my DD wasn't 17-18yo, though. I know that because one of them was recently STUNNED to realize that DD is only 14.

Or that your DD is deliberately winding you up.

My immediate response is to agree completely with you HowlerKarma, however, I quickly realized my experience with any sorority is zilch and my thought pattern is based completely on fraternities, not sororities, so my thoughts have limited validity on the subject.

Generally speaking, for the gifted students I know, a fraternity / sorority is far too much of a distraction, causes drama, and doesn't contribute toward the ultimate goal of college in any form.

I'd suggest talking with your daughter about the issue and about her preconceived ideas on the topic. Keep in mind though that a desire to participate in rush week doesn't equate necessarily to wanting to be in a sorority. Our eldest DS wanted to participate in rush week as well, he did so and that's when he found out that the Greek system wasn't something he wanted a part of. Perhaps the wise thing her to do is let her participate in rush week and talk with her at length about her experience doing so.

I think the majority of incoming students want to experience rush week, if for no other reason that to meet people and most people want to be wanted by "popular" college groups. That doesn't mean though that they'll sign up on a long term basis for it.

I think it's important to discuss what groups with positive focus are available on campus, there are a lot of them and I'm certain that numerous cater to her particular passions. She's looking to expand her world, no doubt she's been ready for that for many years, help her to do so wisely. She may be going off to college, however, that doesn't mean we stop being parents that help to guide wise decision making.

That was my first thought, yeah-- so I dug a little harder, (as Old Dad suggests) and figured out that she's looking for a built in social group, one that is service-oriented and serious about scholarship...

well, I have my doubts about the latter, let's just say (based on experience), and I'm not sure that she's going to get much of either of the other two, either, given what I understand of Greek life and given her innate differences from the majority of sorority girls.

I'll just add this here, since it's one of the most cogent bits I've seen recently on the subject:

http://www.theatlantic.com/features/archive/2014/02/the-dark-power-of-fraternities/357580/

Much of that applies as much to sororities as fraternities, at least on co-ed campuses, I'm sorry to say.

My cynical observation about sororities is that they exist mainly to provide "dates" (or date-rape targets, anyway) to fraternity row. From the sorority side, they seem to exist mostly to provide better housing and food, and 'staff' to princess types whilst they seek MRS. degrees.

Like I said, I'm willing to be convinced that this isn't so, but it's not been my observation.

DH is much more open to this than I am.

Which is weird-- because he is the one who is all squicky about her even going OUT with a classmate that she knows well and who is well aware of how old SHE is...

My feeling is that the question "Should I do rush week and pledge a sorority?" needs to be answered as follows;

Sure, honey! Let's get you a tramp-stamp and some plastic surgery for graduation, while we're at it.



[Sorry if my views on this are offensive to anyone who is or has been a part of Greek life-- I've admitted that my experience and opinions are anecdotal, and as such, may well be idiosyncratic or non-representative. It's why I asked.]

To me, the primary problem here is her chronological age.

Also, your DH is experiencing some sort of significant cognitive dissonance.

No matter how you personally feel about it, your daughter is going to be away from you and your influence is going to be greatly limited. I'd suggest using the time well teaching her how to make wise decisions on her own rather than attempting to mandate specifics about her college experience.

The colleges, in a fit of delusion or some sort of failure to understand human nature, completely abolished in loco parenetis.

This was a bad idea.

Granted, the entire idea that you should segregate people by age for their youth is probably equally dumb.

Personally, I'd have extreme reservations about it, given both the age thing, the allergy thing, and the overall culture of frats and sororities. That said, maybe she can check it out cautiously with the responsible friend from the lab at her side. Your DD has a good head on her shoulders and it's possible to likely that she'll want to get away without turning her back on the place.

College kids aren't exactly known for being tidy and careful about leaving food lying around, so it might be a good idea for her to quiz her friend about the amount of food left around the place (also might be enough to put her off joining).

Also, there's a difference between being a member of the group and living in a sorority house (I wouldn't go for that, BTW --- no way, not at all). Well, I'm assuming that not all the members live in the house?

Rush week: the sorority sisters would have to understand that forcing your daughter to do many or most of the inane things that get done during rush week and beyond can land them in jail and with a big civil judgment that will make their student loans look trivial.

They may treat her differently because of her age (meaning, anything from "sorry, you have to be 18 to join" to "we'll let you in without hazing but you can't come to the parties until you're 17 or 18.")

What are her expectations of Greek life? Can you help her manage her expectations, tempering them with reality? Are there any Greek organizations which may be a better "fit" than others? Other than Greek life, are there options for incoming freshmen in the Honors program to meet each other? Is there an event specifically for Presidential Scholars?

Based upon discussion threads on this forum, you may be missing a recollection of several previous posts about topics ranging from flexing kiddo's environment to accommodate asynchrony, to kiddo's preference for socializing with younger kids, to kiddo's boyfriends/girlfriend. You may be also be missing consistency, posting extremes of praising kiddo's maturity Versus concern about kiddo's potential decisions as a college student. Not criticizing, many parents have been there.

The decision may ultimately be about kiddo taking responsibility for herself and her ability to choose wisely, ensuring she has found a clear way to navigate out of a situation before getting herself into it. The decision may be equally about protecting your child, protecting the older students she may come in contact with, and protecting the institution which has admitted/enrolled her.

Personal proclivities aside, how would kiddo ensure no contact with peanut in the Greek life? Although you touched on this in posing your question, this may be an important topic with which to open a conversation with your kiddo.

Speaking from experience, I think greek life is VERY different if its public vs. private university and if it's 10% vs. 95%. What type of school does your daughter attend?

The bf did sound a *bit* wackadoo, so I'm willing to give the benefit of the doubt on that one given my own wackadoo experience (non-bf/gf related).

I have a friend who was in a co-ed fraternity that was completely service-oriented. From her descriptions it sounds like it was a really great community of awesome young people. I'm pretty sure they didn't have a frat house. Perhaps your DD could bypass the whole princess-and-jock scene and go for something like that?

Is there something else that DD wants you to agree with that you otherwise wouldn't, so that winding you up about sororities will leave you so relieved at dodging that bullet that you don't think too heavily about the next thing?

I have no experience with fraternities or sororities. I would consider the single-sex nature of sorority housing a plus for my daughter. A recent study, cited below and discussed at

http://www.psmag.com/navigation/boo...-likely-graduate-time-greek-women-75861/
Fraternity, Sorority Members More Likely to Graduate on Time
BY TOM JACOBS
Pacific Standard
March 04, 2014

finds mostly positive effects for sororities.

http://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S2214804314000147
The impact of Greek organization membership on collegiate outcomes: Evidence from a National Survey
P. Wesley Routon, Jay K. Walker
Journal of Behavioral and Experimental Economics
Volume 49, April 2014, Pages 63–70
Abstract
Using a longitudinal survey of college students from over 400 institutions and a propensity score weighting framework, we examine the impacts of college fraternity and sorority membership on academic outcomes and general facets of the college experience. Our results suggest a mixed academic effect for males and a positive academic effect for females. For both genders, we find evidence that membership increases the likelihood of graduating on time and graduate school aspirations. For males, however, there appears to be a small, negative impact on grades. For both genders, we find that Greek membership increases the frequency of alcohol and cigarette consumption and decreases religious convictions and religious service attendance. Lastly, Greek organization members are more likely to participate in student government, perform volunteer work, and begin their careers immediately following graduation.

Other research has found that fraternity members are more likely to attain leadership positions:

http://www.theatlantic.com/educatio...nts-were-in-college-fraternities/283997/
18 U.S. Presidents Were in College Fraternities
Do frats create future leaders, or simply attract them?
MARIA KONNIKOVA
The Atlantic
FEB 21 2014

At Harvard, "Record Number of Women Rush Sororities" http://www.thecrimson.com/article/2014/2/12/record-women-sororities-rush/ , suggesting to me that sorority membership is compatible with academic seriousness.

I have sorority experience and I can say it was not at all what I expected. I know not everyone and every college is the same, but I soon found out I'm definitely NOT the sorority type.

The social things were sort of fun, but a waste of time and came with "rules" of what you could and couldn't do while having this so called fun. The "service oriented" things were mostly subpar like teeter-tottering all day and night to raise money for a charity. The money raised was minimal and it was all more for show than anything else.

I got into trouble for not going to meetings and other gatherings - there was always something and I didn't have the time. I wasn't at college to talk about which frat we were allowed to associate with and which girl (of legal age) was seen carrying a beer around a bar. Not that your DD would have to deal with this, but it was a rule - you could sit at a table with a beer, but you couldn't walk around with a beer in your hand.

I didn't make any real connections other than my "Big Sis" who graduated summa cum laude the year I pledged. She was joining the Peace Corps prior to continuing her education. Most of the girls that seemed great, fun, and intelligent during rush week I found out were really just hoping to date a guy on the football team since our team was top ranked at that time.

I dropped it (or whatever the technical term is) after 1 year and got a HUGE speech about how I could never be a Greek ever again. I was okay with that!

Yeah-- make no mistake, I'm wise to turning this one into a power struggle, knowing my daughter. I'll bite my tongue so hard it bleeds if that is what it takes here. Since she's attending the local institution, and will be a 15yo managing a life-threatening and very volatile disabling medical condition, she won't be living away from home in any event-- at least not the first two or three years. She knows this and is okay with it.

I'm merely wondering if there is something that I'm not seeing-- if so, then I'm willing to learn and revise my rhetoric/tone with my DD accordingly.

---------------------------

Also-- indigo, please realize that this is a PG kiddo and that there are a LOT of layers of consideration that aren't about being PG or asynchronous, even-- stuff that I don't always post here (see note above about disability issue). Secondly, some of the posts alluded to are years in the past. {Side note: it's been my experience elsewhere that many parents of younger kids find such an 'arc' of posting to be VERY helpful as a kind of roadmap for themselves... I've been the recipient of that kind of help here and elsewhere, ergo-- I pay it forward.}

I first began reading here when my DD was about nine years old, and posting when she was just 11 and (at the time) in existential/school-precipitated crisis. Most of the things that I've posted over the years have been speculative-- hunting ideas to deal with a particular thorny problem, or seeking alternative perspectives. Not drama. Similarly, not looking for drama here, either-- more trying to find out if there is something that I've not already considered.

So far, it seems not.

This is a flagship public university, and the campus is not overwhelmingly Greek-- she will be in the honors cohort, which is about 1/30th the size of the larger university in which it is housed. Unclear what the rate of Greek participation is within that smaller cohort, but I'm guessing it's not that high. There is definitely a party-culture here surrounding the Greek houses off-campus, and police incidents are definitely not rare. Mostly that seems to involve frats, though, not the sororities-- but-- it's also hard to tease apart, and as is typical for a campus like this, I strongly suspect that a lot of what goes on never makes the public police blotter at all.


My biggest concern re: Greek culture here is that it is also rape culture. This is a campus which is not that dissimilar to the one that I attended for grad school (but with slightly lower Greek participation) and the sorority girls that I encountered there while TA-ing and teaching... make me want to throw my body between that system and my DD, quite frankly-- and would, even if she were 18. THAT campus has made the news quite regularly, and Greek row has, on occasion involved riot squads and letters to alums offering apologies for the horrible publicity.

This ain't Mount Holyoke, let's just say.

There are certainly some positive aspects to sorority membership for many women. However, I think you are correct that the drawbacks/risks for a very young college student (and I suspect that her age might be a concern for those making rush decisions) who has a severe food allergy at a campus that has seen rape cases linked to their Greek system are reason to argue against membership.

Does the system require living in the house? If so, she would run into an issue in her second year, not being of legal age to live alone, it seems.

I would echo what others have suggested, that a service-based (non-Panhellenic) or professional sorority might be a better fit that would provide many of the same benefits. I believe there are now a few STEM-related professional sororities, one or more of which may be at her campus. Check out http://www.professionalfraternity.org/... although there are others that don't belong to this umbrella group.

LOL. Not that I'm aware of. It's possible that this was aimed at Dad, actually.



I really appreciate the info, everyone. This is helping me to know how to respond to my DD. I was feeling as though I wasn't handling this well-- or that maybe I wasn't being "fair" about it, given my bias.

You're absolutely being "fair" about it based on your experience, however, the problem isn't in your view but that of your daughter. The older she gets the less likely you'll be able to force your experience and opinion upon her and the more she's going to have to learn for herself, the trick them is to help her learning come with the least pain.

Once my boys hit about 15, we started having more and more discussions about calculated risk, personal responsibility, and ramification of actions as thought patterns when decision making. Those topics have been key in my eldest son's current mindset much more so than I'd ever dreamed they would be.

Only one of my friends kids/daughter friends has joined a sorority/frat. This young woman is at a a top ranked school with a high percentage of students in a sorority. I can't go into all the details. Mom didn't want her daughter to join, but she rushed and got into a sorority anyway. (Money is not an issue.) She is a gifted and hardworking student who is majoring in math, but taking pre-med classes. It's not going well partly she isn't willing to commit enough time to sorority activities. The one example is she signed up to live in the sorority house but was one of the last to be able to pick a room and got stuck in a quad.

I would certainly discourage her. But it's hard to make ones teenagers to everything you want. Perhaps suggesting that she really research all the aspects of the sororities. How many hours commitment are expected, at what times. What happens when you miss activities. How expensive is it? What other activities does she want to do? Clubs, volunteering?

It's quite possible that she won't be allowed because she is too young.

What about the unknown unknowns?

The sorority/fraternity experience isn't a one-size-fits-all experience any more than one gifted person is a carbon-copy of another - so what applies to your dd's particular university's sorority setup might be completely typical of what your expectation is, or it could be 180 degrees different.

I graduated from a STEM school, and I'm also a member of a sorority. My sorority is a national sorority which I suspect anyone who knows sororities would recognize the name of. My experience being in a sorority in college was *fantastic* ... and fwiw... my mother didn't want me to join for most of the reasons you mentioned:


Those things simply weren't (aren't) true of either my chapter or of most of the chapters nationwide of my sorority. At some schools yes, (primarily the big "party" schools)... but my guess is that's not where your dd is going. If you met me in real life you'd find me a person who is as far away from "Barbie" culture as possibly can exist

This is what my sorority experience was like, and what I value from it:

Service - my sorority has a national charity angle that all chapters were required to participate in. Left to my own devices looking for something to be of service in, it's not a cause I would have chosen on my own - but the service I did for it made me very appreciative to have had the opportunity - it was just one more small thing that helped open my eyes to the larger world around me.

Mentors - there were adult alumni volunteers who acted as mentors for our chapter - they were an important presence in our chapter during college in that they provided a bit of "mom" presence and perspective during a time in our lives when most of our real life moms were far removed in location and time. Some of the alums were also much younger than our own moms, but still provided that grounded perspective that an adult who is out of college can provide to a college student who's in turmoil over relationships or neglecting a class or whatever. And they did pay attention to our grades

Mentors again - through the adults who were local and participated in our chapter to the adults mentioned again and again in our alumni magazine (which we started receiving the minute we signed on), we were aware of the strong women with strong values and strong careers who were a part of our sorority. The focus wasn't even remotely on a Barbie culture, it was about becoming an accomplished woman who made a contribution to the world.

Connections - I honestly haven't used these in many ways, but those same mentors provided connections for some of our members as they left college and moved into their careers.

Friendships - I wouldn't have joined a sorority if I didn't feel a kinship with the women in it. There is an essence to each group on campus - something that makes one group feel more comfortable than another to any given student. I didn't find *all* my people there, but I did have very close friends in my sorority.

Roberts Rules of Order - a bit tongue-in-cheek lol! But seriously, I was not in student council or anything like that in high school. Sorority meetings were run with Roberts Rules, there were sorority officers etc - it was a mini-glance at learning how life in organizations work, and outside of that, in the bigger picture, good experience in learning how to work with a group of diverse personalities to accomplish common goals. Because truthfully, very little time in our meetings was spent on anything remotely close to Barbie-stuff - we had service projects to plan, events to coordinate etc. I served on our campus' Panhellenic board - again, it was all about service, helping out on campus, had nothing to do with parties.

The other things I'd take into account when thinking this through - you may decide that you won't let your dd participate in rush or join a sorority - and that's ok. One thing that hasn't even been mentioned here is $ - sororities and fraternities come with annual fees, and usually have one or two formal events through the year that also cost $. But even if you ultimately say "no" to joining or participating in rush, it's probably not going to be the end of your dd wanting to participate in sorority/fraternity events. Parties etc are open to the public - at least many of them are. And there, as with anything in college life, I think that ultimately Old Dad's advice is spot-on. You've raised your dd to understand and respect your family's values. She's developed her own moral compass and sense of ethics through your parenting and through her own maturing as she's discovered the world. This is where her inner self begins to really be "out there" on her own. She'll make some miss-steps along the way and she'll most likely run head-on into some people who are less than terrific along the way, but she's got a great head on her shoulders, and she'll be fine

At least, that's what we, as parents, have to trust as our children move on into adulthood. And moving on into college, no matter what your chronological age, is a step into adulthood.

Best wishes,

polarbear

ps - don't know if this helps at all... but fwiw... as you know, we chose not to grade-accelerate our ds, partly for reasons such as this type of decision, mostly because I wanted to selfishly postpone his leaving home until I absolutely had to be up for it age-wise So.... this summer he's going to an "away" camp for the first time in his life (he's been to week-long overnight camps before locally... but this one is really "away"). He has a really nice cohort of friends, and they all seem still to be... very mature, yet very young in another sense. Back when I was his age.. oh gosh.. kids were having all kinds of sex and doing all kinds of drugs etc at my middle school... even in elementary school. That doesn't seem to be happening with my kids friends at all. So far so good with that. Then I read some of the students' experiences with this camp my ds is going to and, um, I just about freaked because there was mention of some kids having sex, etc. Yikes! My ds is still my very young ds (in MY brain lol)... and I was thinking - what happens when I send him there? Will he just go crazy thanks to the sheltered life he's lived so far? Will he forget all about the reason *I'm* sending him (for what he gets to learn lol) and instead bring back the memory of sex, drugs and rock-n-roll? Fortunately my dh, always the level-headed mellow person in the family.. chose to head off my panic attack by... mentioning that next year in high school he'll most likely be surrounded by other kids thinking about all that stuff, so we might as well send him off to summer camp to be exposed to it early Again, major mom freak-out lol! Friends have reassured me that their children from similarly sheltered and non-eventful childhoods did, indeed, go on to high school and summer camps and not go crazy when confronted with their first wild party etc. So just offering that up to let you know - what you're feeling is unique in that your dd's situation is unique, but it's also very normal in many ways to. And probably not the first time you'll be wondering should I or shouldn't I let her do this - but if she's off to college, it's most likely better to let her try it out rather than to put the harness on and say no right at the first mention of it. If it's truly a "Barbie culture" sorority I'm sure your dd isn't going to be interested anyway

ps - fwiw, going through formal rush isn't the only way to join a sorority. Most campus' have an "informal" rush that follows formal rush which is in place for the purpose of filling spots not filled during formal rush, still with campus rules, but all held individually and not including attendance at a bunch of parties at multiple chapters. Chapters can usually also add members at any time during the year too - if they have openings. So if your dd doesn't go through freshman rush, that doesn't mean she'll never have a chance to join a sorority.

This is about the time we should be talking about 15 year-olds and their associated risk-seeking behaviors that are correlated with significant changes in their brain structures.

I'm thinking that you may have stepped in if your sons had approached you saying, "Hey, there's a big beach party for teens being thrown by some group called NAMBLA, I think I'm going to check it out."

Trust me when I say that such discussions have been a major feature of parenting my particular child all along-- she's NEVER been very compliant with "because I said so" or authoritarian pronouncements from on-high.

We "forbid" pretty much nothing-- we may discourage things, and offer reasons why we "can't support that decision," for example.

ETA: Of course, she's never asked to go to a Pedo-event, either... we'd respond about the way Dude envisions, on that score. We HAVE talked to her (she initiated the conversation) re: food and beverage always being under your own control, never accepting an OPEN beverage from anyone (sealed bottled water/sodas or unopened cans only)... so it's not like this isn't something she is aware of. But I have been in that party scene, and I know how things can go down when it's chaotic.

PB, it's good to hear your experience and MegMeg's.

I think that is what is in my DD's head, anyway-- from talking with her it is, anyway. I suspect that the reality of the local Greek scene may not measure up, but that's for her to find out, I suppose. I could also have her talk to some faculty who are family friends, I guess.

That way the info is less suspect than if it comes directly from Mom and Dad.

I'm not sure how LOG comes to bear on this post? Your DC is very high-achieving! She is supported by a parent with education credentials, possibly affording additional opportunities which other students may not have. Without IQ testing or formal identification, "she's almost certainly PG-- everyone else seems to think so, at any rate, so we're okay calling it that too."

Thread began less than a year ago.

Bottom line is: You know your own child best, and what challenges she is or is not ready to navigate. You know best the opportunities offered on your kiddo's campus for Honors College freshmen and Presidential Scholar recipients, as well as whether any of the Greek offerings may be a good "fit". The rest of us have only your posts on which to base advice: each campus is different, our own anecdotes may not apply. In using the forum as a sounding board, I think your own posts provide the best insight.

You're right, I would have, however, if one has a son / daughter in college "stepping in" is rarely workable....which is why the discussions I described are necessary, to help them make wise decisions on their own.

I work at a large state flagship. If either of my kids goes to college here and joins a frat/sorority, it will be over my dead body, or at least without my financial support. I can't think of a plus side to the Greek system.

My main reason for posting is that there may be alternatives to consider. Our campus also has an honors dorm and a women-in-STEM dorm, both of which seem to have a number of desirable qualities. I don't whether a "social membership" at these dorms is possible for students living off campus, but something like this might be worth looking into as an alternative to the Greeks.

Agreed!

The plus side is that it's better than complete social isolation and gives some semblance of structure and belonging to a group.

This presumes a certain level of emotional maturity and coping skills in the first place.

Well, yes, this is part of what responsible parenting is, helping your child to develop such qualities.

You should have posted this 8 days ago.

The child in question here is still 15 and would be living at home, so "stepping in" remains a viable option. Parental rights/responsibilities end at 18, not graduation.

Just another view of fraternities/sororities. I attended an Ivy. At the time there were a few co-ed fraternities. Most of these were big time geek magnets (I was - and am - a proud geek. These particular fraternities were way geekier than me.)

But I agree with your assessment of sororities HK. All of the sororities (save for the religious ones) were about all the things you stated in your original post - at least from my point of view. I loathed them as an undergraduate.

I suspect that the number will eventually be moved over 18.

At this point, you have a number of additional issues, such as colleges taking parental income income into account, insurance, inability to rent a car prior to age 21, etc.

It's a fuzzy time, which is why stripping all of in loco parenetis out was a bad idea in the first place.

I have never liked sororities, and my eldest knows that. However, she decided to join a sorority at school. She has a job four hours a week that pays pretty well for doing very little($16/hr), so she is covering all of the dues.

Since she is now 18 (17 when the school year started) and she is paying for the sorority, it is her call. However, if she was 15, I might think about it differently. The sorority she joined has a fairly high minimum GPA to avoid being put on probation (think it is 3.4), and it seems to be consistently the highest GPA sorority on campus, so I think the kids are probably okay. She already had to appeal a fine (and won) because she didn't attend some sort of sorority event because she was busy doing some other activity. I think her sport conflicts with an upcoming sorority event - we'll see how that goes.

Agreed, however colleges do not collaborate or partner with parents, therefore a child on campus has some autonomy.

I went to school a year early at 17 (just turned) and I was never treated any different to any 18 year old freshman. The school only cared when evaluating me for admission. And since in my state K cutoff used to be in Dec, in the fall there are many 17 year old freshman. My own daughter started university across country before she turned 18. Universities collaborate with the student, not the parents. My daughters school was very clear about that at parent orientation.

Parental responsibilities never end in my mind anyway, perhaps others more easily dismiss them. Parents aren't always around to step in, even at 15, if you think otherwise you live in a different world than I. The goal as a parent of course is to raise your children to think on their own.

I'll agree with that, colleges seem to think it's their job to separate parent / child. The idea being that the child is 18 and legally responsible for their own decisions. At least that's the reason they give you, personally I can't help but wonder if the real reason is because they can manipulate and run all over an 18 year old and it's a lot easier to deal with than an adult.

While I can appreciate that thought pattern, they're still freaking KIDS who's portion of the brain that deals with reasoning isn't fully developed. The fact that they're willing to graduate colleges with 100k of debt with a degree they can't do a damn thing with alone tells you their reasoning isn't fully developed