We have been eagerly awaiting DS3's placement offer for next year, at the only official preschool in our area. At the Psych's suggestion, DS has been on the waitlist for this preschool since his evaluation over a year ago. Until recently (when we pulled him out), DS had been attending the only alternative program, run by the child care centre. So, yesterday the preschool paperwork arrived...

And the offer is for 1 day/week of their 1st stage program. I thought it must have been a typo, as DS should be in 2nd stage for 2010 given that he will start fulltime K in 2011. I subsequently rang the Director to correct the 'error' and was told in no uncertain terms that as the youngest applicant, my DS is not a priority for placement in 2010. Somewhat baffled, I advised her that this was not for early entrance as DS makes the birthday cutoff for normal entrance. She replied with a guarantee that DS will be offered the more intensive 2nd stage in 2011. I said that there must have been a misunderstanding - in 2011 DS will enter fulltime K, not repeat preschool. Her response to this ended my confusion - "We'll see about that. Our recommendations for K placement are HIGHLY regarded by the Principals of the two local schools." So, before my son even starts Preschool, it's been decided that he should be held back from K. In a way, I can almost see it playing out as self-fulfilling prophecy - young, wriggly and intelligent DS heads off to K without the Preschool's backing, and limited exposure to classroom structure... destined for failure???

Preschool here is not compulsory, and I do not believe for a second that the Director or the 2 school Principals can stop my son entering K when he is legally entitled to. The question is whether the Stage 2 Preschool placement is worth fighting for. DH wants to meet with the Director (and possibly show her DS's IQ report) as he feels DS should have the opportunity to be in class with the children he'll start K with the following year. My issue with this is that the school staff are spouses of DH's colleagues and the children in question, their offspring. It's a small town so any waves we make could be potential tsunamis, so to speak. I have no idea whether the program (1st or 2nd stage) will provide DS with anything other than the chance to socialize, but it is all we've got now.

Any thoughts on whether this is an issue worth fighting?

Hey, if he goes for two years, they'll make more money...

Is there really that much difference between stages 1 and 2? What about a trial of stage 1 and if space opens in stage 2 he moves up? Skip stage 2 and go straight to K?

Wow, I'm sorry to hear this, TMJ. Red flags are going up all over the place, aren't they?! It's such a shame when preschools take the blanket stance that boys should be held back in starting K, especially if they have summer birthdays. Is this the case with your DS? It's especially a shame when they don't even know your child and how great he is! While it's easy to say that preschool isn't that important for children, it does have the advantage of providing a school experience, and I know that K programs would generally like kids to have gone to preschool for this reason alone. And I know it's especially tough in small towns where everyone knows everyone's business. Are there any other programs, perhaps in a nearby town, that would be more accepting of your son and maybe a little less frought with small-town politics? It might be worth a commute of some sort just to get what your son needs. Also, is your son involved in any sort of organized actiity, anything from Sunday school to sports to music? Has your son previously been in daycare that may have already provided him the sorts of experiences that preschool offers? To me, since academics aren't a concern at all, preschool is just about the child learning to separate from you, learning to listen to another authority figure, and learning to problem solve with other kids. If your DS can get this somewhere else, perhaps that would be the better option?

Cathy A - The only real difference between the stages is the contact hours (stage 2 is double that of the 1st) and 1st stage kids aren't automatically included in the 'transition to K' for the last term (where the preschoolers spend a few hours/week actually in their future K classroom).

mnmom23 - Thanks for your understanding. I guess it's the 'late but before the birthday cutoff' issue that has me most disheartened. I was honestly hoping that after all this waiting, he'd just go to preschool, enjoy the more stimulating environment than is offered at the child care centre, then off to K. My boy has stood at our front window, watching older kids walk to school everyday and begging me to let him go with them, for so long now. The children that we know and have playdates with (that are DSs age) have all been stage 1 this year, and preschool said no vacancies for DS. Now, next year DS still won't be in the same class as them. It's so hard to try and keep explaining why he can't be with his friends because quite frankly, I don't know why! We are very geographically isolated (it's at least a 4 hour drive each way to the nearest town with a school) but on the upside, when he turns 4 there are some sporting groups around here he can join. I'm not concerned about the 'academics' of preschool either, more the 'school experience' you speak of. He's had a lot of practice with open-ended, play-based learning so 'structured learning' would be the new experience in preschool for him.

I'm guessing we should just accept their initial placement offer and see what happens from there. Who knows, maybe by some stroke of good fortune, it'll all sort itself out by the start of school in January!

The cynic in me is wondering if the preschool staff members are engineering things so that your son won't be in direct competition with their kids.

Hi,

We're in a similar sounding town. Hard to know how to proceed. I know in our area our preschool director is a "I know best" type with less education than get-go and would respond negatively to IQ ratings. Can your DH ask around to see if there are any colleagues with late birthday kids currently in elementary/middle school who were not held back a year? Not a judgemental question if its, "everyone does that now? Is there anyone who didn't?" They may be a resource as to how to handle preschool.

You can also call your local elementary schools and get an idea about local age of entry, percent of entering students with preschool, etc. The principal would be a good person to ask if a year of lower level at this preschool would be helpful or would pre-K be really preferable.

In some small towns the percentage going to preschool is nowhere near what it is in urban areas, so you might have less concern that he would be starting at a disadvantage if preschool in general doesn't work out for any reason.

Have you observed at the preschool? Either with DS ("so he can see what it's like") or without. Observing is a great way to spend idle time with the teachers, questions to them might be what is the youngest age they've had, were there specific problems, do the two levels do some things together, have any past students switched levels, etc, some inside info.

If still needed then a relaxed meeting with the director last, in our little rural town the best types of things to say would be: "So I wanted to touch base with you because I called up Amanda the principal at X school to see what would happen if DS couldn't attend preschool. And actually she did say she would welcome my DS at 5 which is a big relief to me because that fits with what our family has always done, both our families believe in kids going ahead with formal schooling as soon as possible (family tradition trumps all else here) ... my fault for not talking to you about that situation ahead, I had no idea how its the norm now to not do that... hate to have DS miss pre-K.. it'll be so hard for him to go straight to K...please help... solutions... teacher Y says one time a student registered in pre-K ended up spending his days with the lower level, what about the opposite arrangement? What about... "

Always worth a try, as long as its a relaxed what-are-our-options oriented meeting it shouldn't make waves.

Polly

Have you asked the psych who recommended he get into this school what their opinion is on the subject? I agree with what the others are saying, but the psych might have something of their own to say to the school...

Funnily enough, DH actually wondered the same thing. I guess I would like to think that being the responsible adults we all are, nobody would seriously go out of their way to orchestrate that - with 4/5 year olds no less! Would they?

Polly - You've given me a lot to think about, actually, and I love the way you worded the dialogue for the meeting. I asked back when we registered for the preschool if DS and I would be able to sit in for a little while. The Director looked at me as if I'd suddenly grown two heads. She basically said they have an orientation session on the first day, and that's all everybody gets (the apparent bonus of being the only preschool for 4 hours in every direction). I also attended a Kindergarten info session for the private school. As soon as I said that I was not enquiring for K next year but the following year, the Principal asked me why I felt I needed to attend 'so early'. I politely said that we were simply investigating our options and he walked off! Consequently, I felt alienated enough by this stage not to follow up with the public school info session. I might send DH off to both schools to ask the pertinent questions you highlighted, as it has just occurred to me that this may be about K class sizes. Based on my calculations, if all children doing 2nd stage preschool attend one or the other school for K - the K classes are then full (as per their publicized quota). Interesting thought.

Wyldkat- DS has another appointment with the Psych next week so it will definitely be raised then. I'm very interested to know what she thinks of it all.

I'm seeing red flags, too.

What do you mean it's "the only official preschool" in your area? Meaning there are daycare centers but no preschool programs? Or something else?

This is the only preschool, period. It is privately operated but under the auspices of the state government. There is also only one child care centre in town, so by virtue of the fact that some families need child care fulltime until school age, there is an alternative program offered there for kids up to 6 years. The latter is where DS had been attending until recently.

To be frank, my instincts tell me that this has all been way harder than it should've been and I feel like just keeping DS home. However, the reason we've tried so hard to get him in (despite his young age) still remains - he is so lonely, it's heart-breaking. Partly this is a result of our family situation (we've got no family here or friends that are more than casual acquaintances) but it's also DS personality as well. He makes the most of his playdates and has fun, but mostly he just wants to share his ideas with adults. Between DS and DD, both super-intense little 'sponges', DH and I aren't sure where to go with this. It's truly not about getting the kids into school asap (FWIW, looking at the end of K goals for the schools here, DS is long gone and DD22mths has probably mastered 70% of them.) Seeing DS has made a social connection of some sort with these kids, we really wanted him to have the chance to foster that, you know?

More thinking for us to do, I guess

Wow.... Red flags all over. I would definitly not be comfortable putting my child in that situation, but understanding it is really the only option for a preschoool, I understand the soul searching. We live in a small toen with only 1 preschool. We have chosen not to put DD in, and also not to put her in K here. Unless we move somewhere else before then, she will be 5.5 when she starts, and yet she has already mastered 95% of the end of year skills, at 32 months.... It definitly is hard for DD to find playmates though. However we did join a homeschool co-op that had a preschool group. I thought she might make some friends there, however she was really boared with the kids ages 2-3 so that didn't really work. She got frusterated that they id not understand the ideas she was attempting to explain to them. Here we also have a co-op preschool (not homeschool) just run by mom's. You might see if there is anything like that avilable. Ask our librarian if you haven't already done so. Maybe that is a way to get some more friends for him. Good luck

Maybe this would help your ds not feel so lonely? Any activities like this in your area?
Are you available during the day? Maybe you could host/sponsor a recurring activity.

Before I went back to to work full time I joined 3 other families and created a co-op. My ds went from 18 to 24 months and it was really great for him.

Anything in a neighoring town that wouldn't be too much of a hardship to drive to?

I see there's a lot of new threads to read, so I'll try and be brief wrapping this one up. We've decided that we'll accept the preschool offer as it is - if it's not a good fit for DS, we will pull him out. I'll still follow up with Psych to see if she has anything to add to the discussion, one way or the other.

The big decision that has really come from all of this is that I'm going to try and set up some sort of activity group. I figure once my children have their tonsils/adenoids out next month, we'll have less doctors to see and more free time to try and make this work. I'll put a notice up in town and take it from there. It's a little out of my comfort zone but we're already doing fun stuff here at home (we're making an erupting volcano at the moment) - there'd have to be at least a few kids in town that would find that interesting, you'd think. Anyway, we'll see how it goes. Wish us luck and thanks for all the input.

PS. DH did ask the other fathers at his work about their children's schooling - Most didn't know anything about it and 3 men couldn't remember their kid's birthdate - month or year! Mother's at the grocery store are no doubt a more reliable source of info on this topic

Hi again, TMJ! I think you've come up with a good solution for now of trying out the preschool in the class they've offerred while also setting up an activity group of your own. What about trying to schedule it with the kids who are technically his age but will be in the older group at the preschool, so that he will have time to play with these kids more? Just because he's not in their actual preschool class doesn't mean he can't play with them after school. Also, I forget what your original post said, but can't you just send him to K after one year of preschool even if the preschool doesn't recommend it since he does make the cutoff? If the elementary school is skeptical at first, they will surely see soon enough that it is the right move for him.

Good luck getting your activity group started -- and with the T&A surguries next month!