Hi,
Is anyone familiar with the Rocky Mountain School For The Gifted in Boulder, CO and have any opinions to share? We are planning to go visit it soon to check it out. It *sounds* good, but we are new to schooling and are not familiar with the usual promotional rhetoric as seen in Val's funny and enlightening post.

My concern is that although my DD5 is starting K this fall, academically she is probably ready to start 2nd grade (higher in reading). She is fairly reserved and a perfectionist, so I don't think a grade skip would be a good fit right now even if we could somehow talk the school into it. All that being said, however, I don't want to put her in a school that is so advanced that she would be considered 'behind', if you know what I mean.

Thoughts and comments appreciated!
Dawn

I did not see them state a minimum score on their website, so they probably have a loose definition of the term "gifted". 138 is a good score and I don't think you have any problems keeping up.
Good luck!
K will be a new adventure for both of you!

Hi Floridama, Thanks for the response! Hopefully the school isn't full of those kind of parents for which having a gifted kid is a status symbol. I am rather nervous about K, but it is exciting too. I'm trying to get all my ducks in a row so we know our options in case we run into trouble at our currently enrolled school. I wish I had had her tested earlier. If I had, then I would be more confident of our school choice.

--Dawn

RMSGC usually requires an IQ of 125+, so 138 should not put your child at the bottom of the grouping. We've never had a kid there, just attended some of the their community education events. The commute and the tuition are out of our league.

Cricket, thanks for the reply! If they start at 125, then we should be fine. Do you have an impression of how good they really are from the events? Any positive or negative comments? Its hard to make decisions when all you have is the hype. We don't live in boulder, but my DH works down the road, so it is doable. I'm hoping we can get a financial aid package.

--Dawn

Not really, unfortunately. The enrollment coordinator does seem to understand the difference btwn gifted and high achiever at least and I liked her a lot when I spoke with her.
My understanding is that they offer up to 50% off of the tuition -- so tuition could be as low as around $7K/year. They do utilize some outside firm to determine who they offer aid to and how much.

Thanks for the feedback, Cricket! I really appreciate it! It will be interesting to visit the school.

--Dawn

Sdrothco, we do have some experience with the school, and live in Broomfield. Year before last we had a horrendous public preschool experience with our son, then 3, and were looking for a better PreK option. We applied to RMSG's Explorers program. He was accepted but we needed full day and the school ended up cancelling their full day program due to lack of enrollment. It was a last minute decision (June) that left us scrambling to find another full day option. We were a little bummed but still considered them this year as our son is now going into K. We did a school visit this spring and thought things went really well but in the meantime started considering other options as we found that there was a new gifted charter school opening in our district, which would of course be free. Anyway, the enrollment coordinator never called us back after our visit day, which I think is a little odd. I don't know if it was a money thing or not (he was accepted last year which seems even stranger). We don't have big bucks to throw around but I didn't get the impression upon visiting that they are that kind of school. As a matter of fact, I felt very comfortable there and the director seems really down to earth. The classes are super small, though, so I wonder how the school is doing. Do you know how many children will be in the K class? I don't think a WPPSI of 138 would be a problem there at all. When I called she told me that they work with the whole range of gifted kids. Your child's academic performance seems high enough that she would struggle in public school without a lot of accomodations.

They were having some significant financial problems and had sent out info that they might be closing last school year. Something came through at the last minute that allowed them to remain open although I don't know what. The financial aid is part of their plan to keep the school financially viable -- they figured that it made more sense to have classes more full with some kids paying less than have smaller classes full of kids who could pay the full tuition. The classes are very small, though, as you mention.

The financial troubles would be a good thing to keep in mind. It would be very frustrating to get all set to go there and have it fall through at the last minute as happened to Mom2boys. Perhaps, though, the troubles will provide an opportunity to get a lower tuition rate. The full price is just *so* high, I'm not sure how we could make it work. The small classes are probably a good thing since the kids are supposed to get individualized learning.

Mom2boys, are you referring to the Westgate charter school? I had heard a bit about it but I never looked into it much since it is out of our district. Do you know if they are accepting out of district kids?

Do either of you know of other well regarded schools for GT kids? Our district's GT school is Hackberry Elementary (jeffco), but I have heard poor reviews of the non GT part of the school (its not a great area) which make me nervous about sending my sensitive DD there. We don't have any GT-only charters in our district. I have heard great things about Alexander Dawson, but its tuition is even more ridiculous than RMS. We also looked at Peak 2 Peak, but didn't get in since we are out of district. I'm also not sure about their gifted program since we had not tested DD at that point. Stargate is wait listing their in district kids, so out of district is again out of luck.

This whole ordeal has been frustrating. It should not be this hard to find an appropriate education for a child. It seems you either have to have *a lot* of money, or live in the right district and get lucky to win the school lottery. We have actually been considering moving just to get to a better district.

We currently have DD enrolled in a parochial school, but again had not had her tested when we enrolled and have not approached them yet about accommodations. I'm not even sure what to ask them for. I don't want to grade skip her; I really want her to have the half day for play time. But I have no idea how they could provide appropriate work in a K classroom...

We looked at Dawson a few year back b/c they, too, have some financial aid, but it would have been quite a commute for us (we're north a ways). Also, I was unimpressed with a few things: I don't like Everyday Math and neither do dds, which is what they use; the guy who gave us a tour told me that all of the kids wound up in the same spot academically by the end of the school year b/c they did such a good job of getting everyone above grade level which seemed very improbable to me; and they seemed to just have a lot of extra worksheets in the room for kids who were ahead with the assumption that the brighter kids would be the faster workers and they could just give them extra work -- that isn't the case for my kids who work differently not just faster and don't appreciate extra work.

We have no GT programming at all where we live except for some minimal pull-out classes starting in 4th in most of the local schools and in class grouping which isn't much help when you are the only kid in the class who falls at a certain point in terms of ability. We did wind up grade skipping our oldest to middle school this past year and have been happier with the acceleration options in middle school. I have been jealous of the GT charters and programs in the Denver area, but if you can't get in, I guess that they aren't doing what you all need!

We are in Adams 12, and will be going to Westgate for K. We feel very lucky, as we got into both Stargate and Westgate so we had choices. I personally felt like Westgate will be a much better choice for our DS, who is an "out-of-the-box" type kid. Stargate was very snooty and bugged me a lot. I am a teacher in BVSD (and therefore get enrollment preference) but never even considered Peak 2 Peak as I also believe it would not be a great fit for DS. I really hope Westgate will turn out. There are only supposed to be 14 kids in the K class and only 2 are girls! I think Westgate will be accepting out of district students and in district students may not even get preference. I know at first grade class size will increase to 24, so there is a chance your DD might get in next year. For K they are now full with a long waiting list.

Cricket, I am sure that Alexander Dawson does quite a lot of cherry picking of students, so they would probably be very bright overall. But, as you said, it seems doubtful that they would all be at the same level at the end of the year. To me, that indicates that either their students are very homogeneous or the gifted ones aren't being given enough opportunities to grow. And heaping more work on gives no incentive for completing work faster. I know my DD would object to 'more of the same'. Well now I don't feel so badly that I don't have $17K a year for school.

We are not in Denver either. It seems there are many more choices down there.

Mom2boys, I will definitely have to look further at Westgate! It would be a bit of a drive, but doable. It sounds like they need more girls. Do you have any insight as to how they are choosing the children? Is it first come first served on the wait list, or are they looking for the higher IQs, etc?

Since you are a teacher, you will have much better insight into what would be good school choices than we would. We are sadly lacking in knowledge there. Maybe I am gullible, but I always seem to be swayed by the fancy presentations. Could you please share your thoughts of peak 2 peak and why it wouldn't be a good fit for your DS? Also, are there any other good GT schools in the BVSD? We have considered moving up there, assuming (perhaps erroneously) that the higher socioeconomic level of the area would translate into more GT friendly schools.

How do you learn about the good GT schools of an area when no one you know is even considering them? Its the old problem of "you don't know what you don't know".

Thanks!
Dawn

I'm just giving this thread a little bump in case anyone out there might be willing to share more advice.

We were there for 8 years with both of our sons. The school is a disaster right now---I believe there are maybe 10 - if that students enrolled for the fall. Our first few years at the school were wonderful, since then, the school has been going downhill. The website is not accurate, at all. We spent the past year under threats of closure with the school spending out notices they were closing mid year. Parents are very unhappy with the education there, thus the reason why the school is a disaster. This year the school started with maybe 75 students, by the end of the year, there were about 37 left. All disgruntled parents with the education. Not sure if they are even opening in the fall.

Hi Mnsell, Thanks so much for your response! That sounds like a huge mess! What a bummer! Their website made them sound pretty good.

Can you suggest any other schools in the denver metro area to consider?

It really depends what you are looking for - I can only answer accurately from our experience as opposed to hearsay about other schools.
Our oldest (starting college in August) was VERY difficult to place - went to Stargate for 4 years....Stargate is an ACCERATED school, NOT a GIFTED school. RMS was our savior school for 4 years. High School was a disaster - tried 2 different ones and then he ended up failing out (he already had a high school curriculum at RMS) and took his GED last year. Failed out of high school, but aced the GED....

Our youngest....every different creature....more well rounded, extremely social, loves sports and VERY adaptable. He went to RMS for grades 1-5 and will start at Dawson for 6th grade this fall which seems like a good fit for him.

Other good schools...lots of former RMS parents are homeschooling, many are trying the public middle schools this year in Boulder County. For elementary some are going to Niwot Elem., BCSIS, Boulder Country Day. For middle, many RMS kids are going to Summit, Manhatten Middle, Boulder Country Day.
Hope this helps.....

Mnsell, That does help, thank you! I am new to the gifted world, and I'm not sure I understand your distinction about Stargate being an accelerated school, not gifted. Could you please elaborate? Do you mean that it is not individualized enough? Or friendly to kids falling outside the moderately gifted range? I do know some parents who were trying to get their kids in there for status reasons rather than real gifted educational needs.

Have you heard any feedback at all about Peak 2 Peak?

Thanks,
Dawn

I have some students at Peak 2 Peak and at Hulstrom. I've heard good things about both, but cannot speak from my own experience. I've also heard mixed about Aspen Creek and good things about Friends, Ricks and Logan School.
Stargate being an accelerated school....With up to 26 kids in a class and 1 teacher, it is very difficult to individualize instruction and have individual learning plans. Stargate, like most of the public schools in CO, almost exclusively teaches to the all important CSAP exams. The time element alone, does not allow for any differentied curriculum, challenge and creativity that many of these gifted kids need. Also, Stargate has a difficult time holding on to directors - most don't stay for longer than a year...I think they are on their 14th one.....
What both of my sons were taught at RMS (except this past year) was amazing! Much depends upon the teacher. I was once told by an educator....a school is only as good as its teachers and director.

Apparently there is a law that says the public schools can no longer discriminate - and they are not allowed to admit students by test scores and must use a lottery system for ANYONE who wants to go there. I know this is the issue with Westgate - it was designed for twice exceptional, BUT anyone can go there. It is now a lottery system. Not sure what Stargate is currently doing in regard to this law.
Let me know if I can help in any other way.

PS. Most importantly for the younger grades, the smaller classes of a private school I feel are very benefical. You are treated as a person and not as a number. Dawson seems to do this very well - making each kid (and family) feel special as did RMS - but that's what you pay the big bucks for......

Wow, I'm really sorry to hear that things have gone so downhill at RMS. I can't imagine how they are going to stay open if they only have approx. 10 students!

Mnsell, thanks for the feedback on the schools. I have also heard good things about Hulstrom, but unfortunately they do not accept out of district students. I liked Peak 2 Peak's parents info session, but now that I know more about gifted needs I could ask more pertinent questions. I was impressed that they had 6 reading ability groups in their K class. None of the other schools I looked at offered that. I'm still hoping that Mom2Boys will chime in with her thoughts on that school.

I had not heard about this school discrimination law. I thought that Stargate and Westgate both looked at IQ for entry. If they can't do that, then it won't be long until they are no longer high ability schools.

Cricket, Yes, I'm pretty sad to hear that too. I was really hopeful about that school. At this point, I really don't know where to turn to for schooling. I did see that they have job openings listed on their website, so maybe they are still trying to make it work. They are looking for a new Education Director. If they find someone really good they'll have a shot at turning it around, but they'll have to make some changes quickly.

Hi, I'm another parent from RMS. I had two children there-my son attended for 5 years and my daughter for three years. I concur with everything that mnsell has posted...RMS has serious financial issues and I'm not sure what would happen with any deposits received in the event that they do not open.

I have heard the same things about Stargate from multiple sources. While you need to have a child tested as part of the enrollment process, there is no IQ limit established--bc that would be discriminatory. Their evaluation process, in my experience, was nebulous/ethereal--nothing concrete--as the applications are reviewed by a parent board using subjective criteria. Siblings are given a preference. Thus, a gifted student would be enrolled as well as a non-gifted sibling. I have a friend that was a substitute teacher there and stated that there were some children that really struggled as a result. I had my son tested by a psychologist that Stargate recommended. He scored a fs 145, but hit many ceilings, I never had him tested using the SB, but understand that his IQ is probably higher. When I specifically asked if that was an acceptable range for Stargate student, she replied that it was higher than most students at Stargate. Additionally, I know of at least one boy who is probably profoundly gifted that was in district that was not accepted. They strive to maintain a 50-50 gender ratio for the classes, regardless of gender breakdown of the applications they receive (they receive many more apps for perspective male students than female students)--thus, it's easier to get a daughter enrolled than a son.

Westgate is an option that a lot of ex-RMS students were looking into-there were out of district students that were able to enroll *this year*. However, that's just because it was the first year. I'm thinking that 2nd year and beyond it will just be more and more difficult to enroll if you are out of district. Still, I'm not so sure given the non-discrimination policy in effect, that it would truly be able to serve gifted students for the same reasons that Stargate's hands are tied.

There are charter schools in Longmont, if you are that far north. Flagstaff Academy has received excellent reviews and I think I saw that 3 of their students scored the highest in some state science fair (3 out of 5 students who placed in this science competition were from Flagstaff). I also received a survey recently that suggests that parents are moving forward with the paperwork required for *another* charter school in the St. Vrain Valley SD-which would specifically address the needs of gifted children. That school would not open this year, but for 2010-2011 school year...so, there is hope.

Lafayette Elementary was a school that many parents were looking into and/or enrolling their gifted children. The principal there, Dr. Holly Hultgren, has a background in gifted education (Ed. D. School Administration and Gifted Education � University of Denver, CO). From the school's web site, "Dr. Hultgren has recently been named the 2008 Colorado National Distinguished Principal of the Year. "

In any event, there's another option to look into on the No end of town.

http://www.bvsd.org/schools/Lafayette/staff/Pages/principal.aspx

hi everyone- RMS is officially not reopening. Got the call a few days ago. We are new to the gifted world as well and were hoping for a placement for our 4.5 year old daughter. BVSD is kind of a nightmarish process for early placement, especially so close to the start of the next school year as she is a year off for K. We looked at Peak to Peak and Flagstaff options but they are a lottery and also have age cut off dates.

We have finally decided this week after touring so many to places to enroll her at Broomfield Academy. Their director also has a background in gifted education. It is an accelerated and creative program with individualized learning plans. Although they also have an accelerated preschool after the K teacher met with her they think kindergarten is the most appropriate placement. It is not gifted per se but students won't hit a ceiling and you can also set goals that are not academic. They are a member of the National Association for Gifted Children and this school was as close to the recommendations as we could get from her testing in Denver and the Gifted Development Center did have it on the list! I'll let you know how it goes!

Kmd, thanks for the school suggestions. Longmont area is probably too far north for us unless we move (which we are sort of considering). Do you have any idea where I could get more info on the proposed charter school? Lafayette would be doable, so I will look into that school more, thanks!

Does anyone know where the non-discrimination policy is in effect? Is it just Adams-12?

Branwen, that is wonderful that you found a good placement for your DD! I have heard good things about Broomfield Academy, but for some reason I always thought it was a daycare/preschool only? I see now that I was mistaken, and I will look into it. It is very close to me, so that would be great if it turned out to work for us.

A friend who used to teach just recommended some schools to me:
- Bear Creek in boulder, it focuses on math, music and science.
- Mesa in boulder.
- Community Montessori in boulder, provides one on one instruction.

I have not heard how they do with GT kids, but she thought they would be pretty good since the families in the area are very math and science oriented (math PhD's, engineers, etc). My friend doesn't know where my DD is at with academics though, and I don't feel comfortable telling her, so her recommendations are not specific to the LOG that we are dealing with. Does anyone have any knowledge of these schools?

Thanks!!!

Hi Sdrothco- Broomfield Academy is having an open house on August 6, 2009, 9 AM and 5 PM.

A Bear Creek kindergarten teacher's assistant works for us part time. It is one of the best elementary schools in BVSD. She thought our DD could try to open enroll there but she warned me that the class size is still quite large 25+ which has been a problem at DD's current Montessori school. She also said that she thinks the 'smart ones' don't get the attention they need. They do pull out options though. Anyway, it will be on our list for open enrollment next year. This is so challenging! Truly!

Branwen, thanks for the feedback on Bear Creek. Sounds like it might be an option if we were to move to BVSD.

I've been poking around on the Broomfield Academy's website, and it sounds quite interesting. I noticed that they said students were accepted based on tests, but they are pretty vague. Is there an IQ requirement? I'm going to try to make it to the open house, but its a crazy busy day for us so I don't know if I'll be able to. Am I correct in assuming they only have full day K? Maybe I could move her there for 1st... The IEP's sound fantastic!

Hi Sdrothco,

No formal testing or IQ requirement, although we had this done already so we offered it to them- they want anything they can get their hands for the ILP. They do have your child meet 1 on 1 with the teacher whose class they anticipate them being in for about an hour to see if it is a good fit. I do believe that both K classes are full day. They explained to us that evaluations are more important for grades 1-6 for matching with the accelerated model, so I think fit becomes more of an issue the older the kid is...

Thanks Branwen! I'm going to go have a tour with the principal on friday. My only option would have been to take all 3 kids to the open house alone, and that would have been far too insane.

I'm worried about the full day K thing...I really, really want half day K for my DD, mostly because I just want more time with her. They said I could put down a deposit to hold a place for her for 1st grade though, so I will at least consider that.

The administrator initially misunderstood me when I was speaking with her and thought I wanted to skip DD into 1st and said they could assess her and if it was a good fit they would do it. It kind of got me wondering...? Maybe I'm just insane trying to keep her in K? I really wanted her to have the play time, you know? But she's reading 4th grade books and does 1st grade math easily. I have no idea how she could begin to fit in to her traditional K class we have lined up, even *with* separate reading groups. But then I swing back to thinking "she's not *all that*, you know"...and a 3 hour class is mostly about play anyway, right? Sigh. This stuff is driving me nuts...

So I'm crossing my fingers that it will look like a good fit at least for 1st if not for K.

How about doing the half-day K and then skipping 1st to enter 2nd the following year? That way she still gets the shorter day and play aspect while she is still young but then skips some of the repetitive "learn to read fluently" stuff and flash cards that can happen in 1st grade.

Thanks Cricket! I hadn't even considered that! It's an interesting idea, and it makes a lot of sense. I'll have to look into this deeper. Honestly, I hadn't thought very much about skipping her since my brother was skipped and won't consider skipping his own gifted DD due to his negative experience. On the other hand, I'm not sure he has really considered what it would have been like to repeat a year's worth of subject matter...we moved and the schools were very different in their levels.

I guess I should get that book from the library that debunks all the grade acceleration myths...

We did not grade skip our son. His birthday is the end of September so he was one of the oldest in the class. Our son has always had social issues....even standing out at RMS. He always wanted to fit in so badly, he grew tired of achieving, always being the best at everything and he mostly wanted to be liked by everyone. He burnt out at 8th grade ..and tried very hard to fail, which he did. High School was a disaster. Our son "chose" by himself to leave high school early, so it was his choice that he "grade skip." We tired, the schools tried, it was just that he is "so out there" the top 99th percentile. He HATES to hear that. Having a gifted kid like him was a curse to say the least. He's almost 19 and by being out of high school early, he has make much progress this past year (friendships, college classes). He is moving to Chicago to attend a performing arts college...and I actually feel good about it and think it will work out well.

Got off track there...so back to the grade skipping topic....

Also, if you check standerized testing scores, starting K and 1st there is usually a huge difference in where the kids are, but the studies show that by grade 4 (at least at RMS) or grade 5, they are all reading well enough...the later readers do tend to catch up so that you can have a much more "balanced classroom" at the upper elementary grades. It's better for the "gifted kids" to branch out horizontally, rather than pushing them ahead to be the best reader, math student, etc. It's not such a great thing socially to be so far ahead.
So, hope you all can learn from our experiences!

Hi mnsell, thank you for sharing your experience. It sounds like school was a rough ride for your son. High school is so hard anyway with so much drama and pressure to fit in, that any difference is terribly magnified during those years. I hope he finds his way at college. In many ways its such a better environment than high school.

Its been a long, crazy busy day, so I'm trying to sort out the thoughts to take away from your post...please forgive my denseness. Was your son trying to achieve in those earlier years, or did he always do well without trying because he was so gifted? Do you think things would have been better or made worse with an early grade skip? The huge difference in kids' abilities in the early years makes me wonder if early is better than later. Looking back, is there anything you would do differently or suggest I do?

If you don't mind my asking, is he in the 99th percentile, or the "top of the" 99th percentile? I only ask because my DD is in the 99th, but not the "top of the" 99th, so I am wondering whether it would differ for her? There's such a large difference between the two parts of the same percentile...my DD is gifted, but not PG.

I agree its not great socially to be so far ahead. She's such an avid reader though, that I can't see her slowing down much. She is capable in math, but has less interest so she is not as far ahead in that. We're doing a lot of science (which she loves) and starting history because they are both subjects that aren't covered for a while in school so they won't make her as ahead. My biggest worry is the sheer boredom of sitting around 'learning' things she already knows for long periods of time. I don't want her to lose her spark.

We aren't really an achievement oriented family as much as a 'big picture' family...what does she need to maintain her love of learning and end up in a 'happy place' after graduating (doing something she finds fulfilling and makes her happy). She has always been different than her peers though, and a bit socially challenged. You should see her in her playgroup...square peg, round hole comes to mind. She has improved a ton over the last few years of intensive socialization we've done with her, and I'm feeling fairly at peace with it. I'd be happy to keep her in her normal grade if I can find a way to keep it interesting for her.

My 5 year-old daughter attended Broomfield Academy's summer Kindergarten Prep class this year and loved it. The ILP was perfect for her and she was able to focus on 'the right things' for her. Small school, caring staff, teachers well trained in GT and associated skills.

Madsdad, Thanks for the review! Its good to hear from a parent who has experience with a school. Were there any things you didn't like about the school? It sounds truly fantastic, but it will hurt a bit coming up with the tuition. I do understand that that level of individual attention costs a lot of money. I'm looking forward to seeing it!

To me this just sounds like more of the "all kids catch up by the third grade" that a lot of us on this board hear all the time. My son is and has always has been a very advanced reader. The other kids didn't catch up to him in the 3rd, the 4th, the 5th - they still don't read what he reads.

And as for the "pushing", that word alone has been the topic of many a post here. When you have a child with, for example, an intense desire to understand trigonometry - a topic you know nothing about - and that child asks to be driven to the library to check out a text book on the subject because he just has to know... who is pushing whom?

And as for branching out horizontally, who says that is best for a gifted child? How far horizontally can one go in, say, arithmetic? At some point, for some kids, the only way to go is up. And that is the best thing for them. Being the youngest in a class brings it's own challenges, but so does being grossly underplaced with a bunch of children with whom the only thing you share is a birthday. There have been many studies to show that gifted children who have been accelerated fare much better on tests of emotional well being than those left behind. Accelerating a child to the proper level means that they are not always the best at everything, and that they will learn the value of hardwork and they won't "always be out there" in class.




To me, this sounds like a definitive argument TO gradeskip a child. You post that your son, after "gradeskipping" himself, has finally found his way, whereas before, when he was held in age/grade lockstep, he was miserable.

We accelerated our son to avoid the very problems that your son went through. He's still ahead of everyone, but the spotlight shining on him is not as bright as it would have been if he was sitting in the 6th grade. He fits in better with highschool aged kids that he ever did with kids his own age.

Having a child outside the norm is not easy. I wouldn't call it a curse, but it does have its difficulties. And every child's path will probably differ from someone else's. I'm glad that your son has finally found his place and is happy.

I compared the tuition with other area private schools. Broomfield Academy was $400/month less than Rocky Mountain School and $800/month less than one other large private school in the area. Yes, it is a lot of money at $1000/month, but appears to be in line with other area private schools, and less than other GT/ILP schools. What I liked: the quality of the teaching staff, their knowledge and experience with GT and ILP's, the large playground area, that all of the staff knew my child, the language instruction, teaching garden, that my daughter enjoyed it more than her previous school and wanted to be there (even in the summer). What I didn't like: it was a longer drive for me. My daughter often wanted to stay a bit after and play on the swings, which put me into a little heavier traffic on the way home.

Hi Madsdad, thanks for the feedback! If the only negative comment you have is that the commute is longer, then it must be pretty great! That your DD wanted to be there even in the summer is another big point in its favor. I like how you looked at the tuition as a relative comparison. Maybe that will help us get over the sticker shock.

Hi sdrothco,

Are you moving ahead then with Broomfield? If so I do hope to see you later this week. Send me a private message if you want to meet up.

Based on what you have mentioned about your DD 1st sounds like an appropriate fit. I was nervous because now my DD will be a year ahead going into K and making a choice like this is staging for a year skip all the way through. All I know is that looking at the other K's, even in private schools, reading is not an expectation, and that was not going to work for us. She writes and invents her own words! This last year at Montessori was a regression and I am starting to understand more and more that challenge and stimulation is intimately linked with a HG child's social and emotional well being. She is already starting to hide her talents, and she was in a multi-age classroom! So all of this combined with my gut I do think skipping is the right thing for my DD. It was a major philosophical shift for me because I had read the book The Hurried Child and was totally freaked out about rushing and pushing my kid. I have come to understand that those philosophies and gifted stuff are not opposing. Part of the shift was also that I also know my limits as a parent. While both my DH and I have lots of gifted traits personally, when she comes to me out of desperation wanting to learn something that we don't have a particular background in, I worry that at a certain point we won't be able to accommodate her needs holistically...anyway, the skipping thing is always on my mind and we'll see how this year goes!

Hi, I am new here so I hope you don't if I chime in. First, I am so sorry for parents at RMSG. What a loss to the community. Good luck to those families.

I have heard only wonderful things about Broomfield Academy. I was a little taken aback by the appearance of the school and lack of facilities and resources.

My daughter attended Boulder Country Day School for three years. This school does not accommodate bright children. She was placed at a corner desk and expected to teach herself. The school lacks in so many areas, History, Geography, Science, Writing. I felt that the school was more concerned with appearances and fancy assemblies. The school day is wasted with too many Specials classes and events (Music, Art, Choir, French, Assemblies every Friday) and not enough core work. My daughter only had 21 days of math in an entire school year. Appalling!!!!

My daughter now attends Flagstaff Academy, which is evolving into a top school for bright children. I see from the website docs, although I am not 100 percent sure about this, that all children grades 1-8 will attend math first thing in the morning. This will enable kids above grade level to attend appropriate math classes. Last year the ability grouping appeared to be limited to each grade. Flagstaff's Middle School appears to be struggling, with low CSAP scores in the 5th and 7th grades. The CSAP scores in Writing were moderate not high across all grade levels.

Dawson has an excellent reputation for Middle School and High School. However, the school does not seem to win many awards, if that matters.

Peak to Peak (K-12) and Summit (6-8) are by far the best schools in the area. However, there are thousands of students on the waiting lists for both schools. I heard that 1400 students applied for 22 spots last year. To get in, one parent would need to be employed there, as they give preference to teachers.

Superior Elementary has the highest CSAP scores in the area and does an excellent job with gifted children. I know a boy who remained in his grade for homeroom but was allowed to attend high school (YES!) for math and language.

Hope this helps. Your input has certainly helped me.

Hi Branwen, I doubt that we'll be moving ahead with Broomfield Academy for this year. I was surprised that they were starting school so soon as my DD's current school doesn't start until the 24th. It didn't leave much time think about switching. I think the biggest problem we have is the tuition...it's a lot of money for us. I didn't discuss accelerating my DD with the principal, but I probably should have. We ran out of time since she was needed for some summer camp duties while I was there. I was sad to see that their pool was unavailable until they make upgrades in it. I did like the school, and I liked the principal...she really seems to 'get it'. She said that each class was 50-90% gifted students, and that is very attractive to me. It would be nice for DD to be around other gifties.

I'm still fairly set on the idea of having her do half days for this coming school year though. She occasionally throws out random comments like "I love Wednesdays because I don't have art class and I get to stay with you." She loves her art class, but she also loves time at home. (She's taking art this summer twice a week.) The principal mentioned that if I was set on half days, we could enroll her in junior K and she could subject accelerate math and reading. But given her age and how accelerated she is already I think that would be an even poorer fit than standard K at the school we currently have her enrolled in. We will continue to look at BA and see if we can make it work for 1st next year. Maybe by that time she will need 2nd, I don't know.

My understanding is that if you start K early, it really eases the whole acceleration issue because she will be following the normal progression and not be moving away from friends and she won't miss anything either. Of course, you might still need to accelerate her later on anyways, but that's a whole 'nother can of worms. If I had known that early K was even an option, I would have pursued that. I just wasn't aware that people could even do that. She was definitely ready for K last year. It sounds to me like you've made a well-considered decision. I hope that it works out great for your DD! I think you have stacked the deck for her success by choosing BA...the small classes will help her adjust quickly with so much individual attention.

Coconut, Welcome! I appreciate your insight on the area schools! I can't believe your DD only had 21 days of math in an entire school year at boulder country day!! You're right, that is appalling. Unfortunately, Flagstaff is too far for us to seriously consider, though I have heard good things about it. I liked what I saw at Peak 2 peak, but I haven't looked at it from a GT perspective yet. We were 200 on the wait list for K, so about a snowball's chance in you know where to get in there unless we move to BVSD. I have heard some negatives about it, but nothing concrete, so it is still on my list. I will look into Superior elementary, thanks for the tip!

Does anyone out there have any knowledge of gifted friendly schools in northern Jefferson county? Our PS gifted program is at Hackberry Elementary, but I have heard really mixed reviews of it.

Since you do not have time to enroll in a new school, why don't you sign her up for private math tutoring once a week? The reading and language arts can be done at home with activity books from Barnes and Noble. You can even order TAG activity books or buy activity books several grades higher. You can purchase Core Knowledge "What Every First Grader (Second Grader, Third Grader, etc.) Should Know" books and accompanying handbooks, for History, Science, Literature, Composers, Fine Artists, etc. These books are easy for kids to read to themselves.
Good Luck!

Also, other excellent excellent schools in BVSD:
Bear Creek Elementary
Southern Hills Middle (win lots of Math awards)
Fairview High (No. 2 in Colorado after P to P)
Horizons Charter
Manhatten Middle

Hi Coconut, I hadn't thought of doing tutoring, I will have to look into that! I was planning to do some 'afterschooling' type activities with reading, math, history and science. She's really not into workbooks anymore...I think she burned herself out on them a year ago. Not sure how I'll handle that with math. I will try letting her read "what every First Grader needs to know" since I have that out from the library now. She seems to go for those big compendium type books, so maybe she will like it.

Thanks so much for the schools to look at! Hopefully we will get something good lined up for next year.

Still hoping someone out there knows about gifted options in Jeffco schools? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller?

Hi all! I'm a first grade teacher in BVSD, and since the first day of school was today, I have not been online in a while. The last few weeks have been hectic. We got the e-mail that RMS was closing also. I'm so sorry for all of you who had children there. That must be so traumatic.

My son started Westgate this week. We went through the whole Stargate/Westgate application process. Honestly, I'm not looking for the most top notch, high pressure education for my five year old (I'm really laughing as I write this). I just want him to be happy. He is quirky and stands out. He had a hard time in preschool and I would like for him to want to go to school rather than whine and say, "What's the point?"

We definitely had a negative impression about Stargate. As someone else mentioned, I wanted to be sure that my son's needs were met. He scored 149 on the WPPSI and is just a little "out there" in personality and intensity. They told us that their school is designed for a child with an IQ of around 130--enough said. Even though my son got in, we turned them down.

Westgate, while it cannot exclude based on IQ, is claiming to meet individual children's needs, which is more than I heard at Stargate. I guess I firmly believe that a school's philosophy and its teachers can make all the difference, regardless of the students it has in its classrooms. I teach in a VERY diverse school in BVSD. It is not best for all kids (my oldest son is not going there, but my other two may), but I had a PG student in my class last year and have his brother (who skipped K) in my class this year. And their parents have been very happy. I think knowing your child's personality and what type of environment would suit him/her best is more important than the selective (or not so selective) criteria of the school. That is why I did not think Peak to Peak would be a good fit for my son. I think there is too much pressure. I've heard that the teachers put tremendous pressure on the students, and I think my son would cave in that environment. A friend of mine interviewed there and said that during her observations and trial teaching assignment the students were afraid to speak up and seemed totally traumatized. She was shocked. My son is a perfectionist, and I think he would always think he wasn't good enough. He needs nurturing, encouraging teachers to bring out his highest potential. At least that's my opinion now--he's just 5.

I will let you all know how things go at Westgate. Since my son has only been there 4 days, it is hard to tell. Good luck as you all get settled into the school year!

Coconut - I'm pretty surprised by your comments about Boulder Country Day - we've been there for 6 years and I can definitely say that my daughter doesn't do 21 days of math (were you in the preschool perhaps?) I'd say in general it operates at a grade level above the better public schools in the area for their normal curriculum in elementary school and easily accommodates SOME differentiation with the 16 students in class. It's by no means perfect. My daughter was about 5 grade levels higher in reading when we joined, and while they did differentiate - it wasn't great (it certainly didn't help that I frankly didn't want her grade skipped or with kids that much older for a reading group) They have had an easier time with math, where she's only 2ish grade levels higher. I would also say that as you progress through the school, there is MORE differentiation. The middle school is fantastic and they're operating at an incredibly high level. Most of the students I know that have gone on to the IB programs at Niwot and Fairview claim that high school is EASIER than middle school.

They do have a lot of emphasis on specials - french, art, music and latin. I think it's great. But if you are looking for the three Rs and little else, it's a horrible fit. I was attracted to the diverse curriculum, but I understand people are all looking for something different.

Hi Debbie 1996 - I did have a very bad experience with BCD. And to be fair, it is possible my daughter did more then 21 days of Math. I am just working off what she brought home from school, not much. I have heard good things about the Middle School Math program. The new Math teacher is impressive.

BCD is probably a good school. But, I would not recommend the school for advanced/gifted children because the school does not have the resources and does not accommodate for advanced/gifted kids.

Gifted kids need stimulation in addition to challenging course work. BCD does not ability group or allow students to move up a grade level for Math or Reading. BCD uses boring work books and flash cards, no projects. Even the Art and Music classes are boring (i.e. recorder lessons).

Also, I disagree that BCD is grade levels ahead. First the IOWA test is not an accurate measurement of grade level competency and it cannot be used as a tool to compare BVSD schools since they don't take the IOWA test. Second it does not even make sense that BCD is ahead when you look at the daily schedule. BCD students go to school fewer days per year and fewer hours per day. Plus BCD students miss half a day every Friday for assemblies and hours during the week rehearsing for those assemblies. There is one teacher for Science and Technology who is expected to split her time among 400 kids, so they barely have any Science. I don't consider a ton (and there is a lot of it) of Art, Music, Choir, Reading Buddies, Library diversity in curriculum. Although I do love the French and Latin.

I have observed that young children flourish using the Core Knowledge curriculum. I love the way the CK system all works together. For example, last year my first grader learned about the early American Colonies, American Revolution and Lewis and Clark in her History class. So in Art, the teacher taught them to distinguish between the art of the Plains and Nomadic Native Americans. And he taught the class in a full size teepee! They made Native American shields and instruments in Art class, which were displayed in a fantastic art exhibit. The History and the Art all tied together. It was so fun and so stimulating the kids absorbed every bit of it and were inspired to learn so much more.

I don't know much about middle school and whether the CK curriculum is rigorous enough to meet their needs. These days middle schoolers are working at such a high level. I would guess that the BCD IB program in middle school is quite good.

We are new to Boulder and have loved this post for it's wealth of information. As it's now 4 months later, I'm wondering if anyone has any updated information on where RMS kids have gone in Boulder County and what schools are working, and which are not. I'm also wondering where larger groups of those kids have been grouped together. Any 4-month-later insight on any of the schools discussed would be so helpful as well.