Hello,

I am new to this gifted children world. My kid just had the test. The score is:
VC 150
PR 147
WM 138
PS 136
FSIQ 153
I see a few posts talking about GAI instead of FSIQ. What is it? How do know my kid's GAI? The psycologist recommends us to apply DS YS. Do you know where we can take the required achievement test? Thanks a lot!

Welcome! How old is your child? We used the Explore for our 3rd grader.
Here are a few talent search programs that administer the test.

http://www.education.uiowa.edu/html/belinblank/TalentSearch/Explore/Default.aspx
http://www.cmu.edu/cmites/ests.html
http://www.ctd.northwestern.edu/numats/

Those are fantastic scores. Congratulations!

Thanks, LDmom! Have you applied DYS? Do you think that my child has a chance? Is it worthwhile to try?

My child is going to the 3rd grade in fall. It seems that Explore starts from 3rd grade. Is there any disadvantage of taking Explore test before the child actually starts the 3rd grade.

The GAI is the General Ability Index. I cannot pretend to know more than that as I've only recently been researching all of this so I will leave you with this link till someone more knowledgeable replies. Goodluck!

http://www.pearsonassessments.com/N...DA-05888C7CC082/0/80720_WISCIV_Hr_r4.pdf

Do I think your child has a chance? Absolutely!

Yes, we used the Explore results + portfolio option for our son. I did have him take a WiscIV after I sent our application (for back-up) but they accepted him without my having to submit the IQ results.

My guy took the Explore privately through Belin Blank, where they sent the test booklet to a proctor of my choice (our homeschool charter teacher). I chose the February test date so if you like you can wait till then, when your child will actually already be in 3rd grade. I've heard that you can also choose to have your child tested earlier if you are using Belin Blank. However, since your child is younger, they may request for some kind of further info before sending you the packet. I sent them my son's results from another above-grade-level test and they sent almost immediate acknowledgement that they were willing to have him take the Explore.

LDmom, how did you prepare your kid for the achievement test like Explore.Is there any books or et that I can use? Thanks!

Hi Xiangbaobao,

Welcome! Do apply to DS YS - if the Explore test is anywhere near as 'unusually strong' as the IQ it won't take long for the admissions committee to say 'yes.'

To find test prep books for Explore, or any other achievement test - go to Amazon.com (or your favorite bookstore site) and search
name of test "test prep" , in this example:

"explore test prep"

I checked, there are several - I've never seen any great difference between one test prep book and another.

As for GAI, I don't think it's going to be useful in your situation. Some kids have profiles like this:

VC 150
PR 147
WM 124
PS 70
FSIQ - huh?

It's hard for a family in that situation to show a school that their child has special educational needs without an 'IQ number' to throw around, so the GAI is helpful as an alternate IQ number in those situations.

If you were talking to that parent of that imaginary friend, it would be clear to you by observation that the child who is having such a great time with your kid is more similar than not your child, and that the overall picture of this imaginary child's IQ is 'a broad spread' - but inside the education system, you find more and more people who feel uncomfortable without a 'bottom line number.'

I hope that helps.

No significant disadvantage to taking the Explore before he's actually in 3rd grade, unless you happen to be in a school system where is going to learning 8th grade level material this year - which is statistically more rare than your son - I estimate.

How is school going for your son? Most of the gifted kids I've met are very lovable and fun, but many of them have been kind of stressful to parent. I'm hoping yours has been a relaxed, easygoing, good natured kind of kid, but if not, this forum is a pretty good place to get some ideas and reassurance as long as you keep anonymity in mind.

Love and More Love,
Grinity

I just want to point out that when testing for these purposes, it's probably not a good idea to spend a lot of time preparing for the test. If you want to get a good idea of where your child' achievement really is, then don't prepare for the test, other than to familiarize the child with the types of questions, etc...

Besides, I doubt that your child will need much preparation!

By the way, the ACT website has sample test questions for each section of the Explore. I had my DD try each of the samples (and I timed her). That was the extent of our preparation.

Good luck! And DO apply to DYS. It's worth doing.

NJMom, Yes. I agree with you. I just want the child know what the test question looks like and get familiar with the test framework. Sample questions would be good enough. I will check out ACT website. Thanks!

Grinity,

Thank for GAI explanation!

Unfortunately my child has not happy in his school starting from public Kindergarten. Being bored is the all-time complain. Even though his MAP score is very high, due to his relative low CogAT score and classroom observation, the school decides to exclude him from 3rd grade accelerated math program. Socially he is lonely and has no friend in the past school year in his classroom. He gets so frustrated because he really wants to have friends. Outside of the school we don�t see any social problem. So we talked with the teacher. She blames all the fault on my child being mean. We are very frustrated too because he doesn't do well enough in his classroom project either. I know that he is underachieved. We feel that he is not learning much at school because he seems to lose the interest. Being excluded from the gifted math is the trigger for us to have him tested. The IQ came out much higher than our expectation. We told the psychologist what is going on in his school. He believes that these are all due to fact that he is too bored. And he recommends that we shall put him in the gifted school because the public school just can't offer what he needs considering his high IQ. Sadly the public school even don't believe he is gifted.

We have been in the mud for years puzzling what is wrong with my child. Now the psychologist evaluation seems to be able to explain a lot of things that have happened on him. As we just step into this new world, we still don't know what is the best thing to do for him. How much shall we rely on the judgement from the psychologist or public school teachers?

Anyway, we really appreciated from all the comments from the parents here. Thanks a lot!

Xiangbaobao

I'm sorry that your son is having such a hard time. My younger dd's scores were not quite as high as your ds' and she has much lower WMI and PSI thus making the FSIQ lower than the GAI by quite a bit, but some of what you are experiencing sounds a lot like her situation.

She, too, didn't perform nearly as well on the CogAT as the WISC and we were told by both the school counselor and her classroom teacher that WISC scores above the 99th percentile were due to "good guessing." Her classroom performance wasn't poor, but she wasn't a super high achiever and her MAPS scores fluctuated up and down wildly. The times they were high were also attributed to good guessing by the school. She, too, wasn't gifted in their estimation and she, too, wasn't doing well emotionally. She was lonely and her self image was poor.

Have you tried pushing for acceleration at a higher level than the school? I wound up kicking my requests (demands) up to the district GT coordinator. She also didn't feel that IQ scores were equivalent to the CogAT and felt that the CogAT was a better indicator of who was gifted but was willing to convene a committee including pyschologists to review dd's scores. The district policy now allows for IQ to be considered in lieu of CogAT and dd was subject accelerated in math last year and has passed the two district tests required to continue with that acceleration in middle school next year.

I would be doing a few things in your instance:

1) Apply to DYS. I'd expect that he has an excellent shot of getting in.
2) Push for acceleration and inclusion in GT programming at a higher level than the school. Ask for a meeting with the GT coordinator from the district.
3) Look at other schooling options if that doesn't work.

Good luck!

Looking at this situation, I would actually vote FOR some test prep (which I didn't even do for my own kid!). It looks like this child has been "held back" by his schooling situation, as I can't see that he has received any acceleration at all from your post. I'm absolutely floored that they don't have him assigned to the gifted class; it's the classic example of schools missing the most gifted children. Have you been doing any homeschooling, or after-schooling?

I'm sure he could slam dunk that test intellectually, but in general you can't solve a math problem if you've never seen it done. He will probably only need to see it once. Give him the example test, and see what he gets wrong, and teach him that topic.

Life of Fred might be a fun way to show him the math. But I'd wager that giving him any textbook might ignite that intellect, and off he'd go! Khan Academy or Alcumus (pre-algebra) might also be good choices.

Just my humble opinion. Also, I'd wager that learning some new and harder math will make him very very happy.

Good for you for getting the testing done!! My guess is the next 6-12 months will be eye-opening for you as you read more and more about giftedness.

Definitely check out the ACT website. But keep in mind that those sample questions were easier for my son (and I expect a bunch of other kids) than the actual Explore. We used an 8th grade test booklet (I did what Grinity suggests and searched Amazon). Had son take a few math and science samples there to familiarize him with the expectations and see if he was comfortable and could finish the tests on time. He did fine in the samples but he couldn't finish the math portion in the real Explore on time. However, his math result was just above the 3rd grade cutoff that DYS requires (phew) and he did well enough in the other subtests.

I'm so sorry your son is having a hard time in school. We homeschooled his PreK year and then I felt he would benefit from some social opps by attending private K. He was picked on by a teacher aide for being sloppy with cutting and gluing etc and made fun of in front of other kids. He didn't talk back or complain much to us and instead drew his misery into himself. He became a shadow of his usual self. We couldn't figure it out because there was no teacher communication with us despite my asking to talk to them and writing them notes everyday and slipping them into his homework binder. We were paying big$ too. So we took him out in a few weeks and the change was wonderful. He only told us what really happened 2 years later.

We have homeschooled for a total of 5 years now. I am able to give you some ideas if you have questions on that. Please feel free to Private Message me offlist. In case you're unsure how to do that, click on my user name and choose Send PM. When I reply, there will be a flashing envelope on your navigation bar to say there's a message waiting for you. Take care!

Thanks for all of your response! Your comment truly makes my tears coming out.

There was a period of time when I literally felt helpless about what to do with him. The teachers said that he was mean to other kids. They said that he pretends himself at a higher intelligence level than his peers. Therefore it pushes other kids away and causes him having no friends. Sometimes they said that he doesn�t put forth his effort in his class work. Another time they said that he is lack of problem solving and critical thinking capability therefore he can�t be further challenged. At certain point, I almost lost faith in him and got confused myself. I was so bad to be very critical on him due to all these negative comments/complains from his school teachers. I had thought that Gold shall shine everywhere. If he doesn't shine, then he is not a Gold. As he doesn't shine in his class, I even doubted myself if he is gifted at all. The school teacher keep telling me that he is just above the average and I was wrong to push him to the accelerated math program. On one hand side, I know that he is smart based on how well he plays piano and how well he plays chess. And he doesn�t have social problem when he is with his competitive peers in chess and other activities outside of school. Until the psychologist�s evaluation came out are we able to connect all the dots and put the puzzle together. After the test I start read online to understand his difficulty, I start to realize that the child can NOT thrive if he is not in the right environment for him. I felt that I was so wrong for not understanding him and punishing him for every complain coming from school. A couple of nights ago I talked to him and told him that I am so sorry for what I have done due to inexperience in parenting him. I could not help myself from crying in front of him for all the guilt in my heart. He came over and hugged me. He said:� Mom, you don�t have to cry, you don�t!�

have you read any books on parenting gifted children? I found that some of the explanations were great and gave me a better understanding for how my dd worked and what I could do differently to preserve, support and properly discipline without squashing his ethusiasm & spirit...

No, I have not read this book. But I will definitely check it out. Thanks!

That was about exactly what we were told with our younger dd as well. She was above average but not gifted and it was going to be "interesting" for me having one highly gifted child and one who was "high" but not gifted. My youngest actually tested higher on IQ than her sister when she was tested in 2nd grade.

It is hard not to struggle with feeling like one of those pushy parents and it is easy to question oneself especially with a child who doesn't fit in the box of what seems obviously gifted (super high achieving child). My oldest is the stereotypical gifted kid who would take an idiot to overlook how advanced she is. I've come to realize, though, that not all gifted kids look like that and that not all kids who are great students are gifted.

Hugs to you. I have this experience too. I harbor a lot of guilt for not understanding his asynchrony issues when he was younger. After my initial ummm, shall we say, "extreme parenting error phase"?, I started talking to him often about what I'm feeling and why and what he thinks and how we can work together when something seems confusing/too hard/too easy for him. He's my little, old soul.

This is a hard time for you and like others have, I suggest reading whatever you can, keeping in mind that some books will speak to you better than others. To take with a pinch of salt what doesn't seem right and hang on to the speaks-straight-to-the-heart books for dear life. Here are some resources that have helped me (books may be available at your library):

http://www.hoagiesgifted.org/ - tons of articles for you to read. Great stuff here!
http://www.davidsongifted.org/db/browse_by_topic_articles.aspx - a number of helpful articles on parenting, asynchronus development, acceleration etc
High IQ Kids - http://www.amazon.com/High-IQ-Kids-Collected-Information/dp/1575422611/
Miraca Gross' study inspired me to accelerate my son in our homeschool despite my worries about "gaps in learning" - http://www.amazon.com/Exceptionally-Gifted-Children-Miraca-Gross/dp/0415314917/

There are many more...just search "gifted kids" or similar on Amazon.com (or your favorite online store).

Xiangbaobao- I just want to send you a virtual "hug".

What a difficult, confusing, hard time you've had. It seems to me that you will be an strong advocate for your child now. You are right, he needs a better "fit" environment to thrive. Exactly what that will be, that's a little trickier

Along with the gifted books suggested, I would also suggest you use the search "bar" here on the Davidson Database. The database is full of the information and wisdom of years of "gifted" conversations. Just remember that your child is really unusually gifted.