I met a pushy mom.

Her almost two year old HAS SIGHT WORDS. And LIKES BOOKS. And does all kinds of things. And she hasn't a clue how he learned any of it.

Although he clearly had been trained on some things, and didn't seem like a dull sparrow or anything... um. Well. DS (<1yr) does very nearly everything she described him as doing (not sight words ). The kid may well be gifted, he's two and has a world of time in which to blossom, but he ain't gonna get anywhere with it if he hears THAT wall to wall.

I was... floored. I can see why people are scared of running into someone who does THAT.

Just needed to say it out... erm... quiet...
I'm never saying anything anywhere but here again! Just in case!

What was the context in which she was saying all of this, I wonder? Was she just talking to you, or was she announcing it to a roomful of parents?

Perhaps you haven't added enough info here, but isn't it possible her child is gifted? Maybe she is boasting which rubbed you the wrong way but as a gifted community, I feel we need to stand together and support each other. How many of us complain that we get treated as pushy parents and learn quickly to keep our mouths shut, but wish our society wouldn't treat us this way. Could this woman just not have gotten the memo? Again, it is very possible that she is a pushy mom, but with what you wrote, I don't really see evidence of it. Pushing or not ... a child under the age of two knowing sight words is impressive. However, as I typed that I remember that infomericial for My baby can read or something. If this mom is one of those ... than you have a valid point.

Katelyn'sMom, I felt the same way as what you posted. When I first read the post it brough back immediate bad memories of when I first realized that my child was a little different. I tried sharing with other moms I knew in hopes of finding someone to connect with and see if I could find others who went through the same daily ins and outs that my DH and I were going through..I felt like we were on an iceburg floating around in this huge sea all alone. When I would finally jump in and share when other moms were talking/sharing about their kids, I would get the "look" and I quickly learned not to talk about my child in front of other moms anymore.
But if she really is a pushy mom, then it could be really annoying.

She was broadcasting for over an hour, during a program where most of the other parents were genuinely worried that their kids were behind. She stayed late to continue. I did talk to the kid, and yeah, he may well be gifted. I noticed that he was doing some much more complex things with me than the ones his mother was talking about and that she was shutting him down when he did them.

If she had once seemed to notice his presence beyond shoveling food into him, and asking him to do tricks, I might have felt better about it.

(the sight-words were titles of favorite books, which doesn't seem really out there to me... is that really seeing a word, or is it recognizing the spine of a book?)

Aww, well that is sad, then. Let's just hope she was having a socially inappropriate moment and doesn't treat him like that all of the time.

I think "wall to wall" is your key phrase there... and I know someone I'd like to lock her in a room with.

It's not about the kid at all.... and it's nothing like appropriate sharing in a group with others. It's about a parent who has no other possible topic of conversation, doesn't let anyone get a word in edgewise, and latches on to one or two bits of "proof" and will not let go. And what's weird is that in the cases I've known (I think I've met more than my fair share...) the things they latch on to are really much less interesting than the real kid. It's like they've checked off a "standard gifted kid" checklist, found their couple bits of "proof" and nevermind that they have this actual kid with actual talents that would make much better conversation.

I often have some trouble finding stuff to talk about with other parents. If I'm in a group where people tend to be competitive and judgmental, the combination of using a minority parenting style and having a kid who was crazy precocious and now is just showing very odd development means every topic is full of landmines. It can be hard to get off a topic once it's broken (yeah, you saw him walking at 7 mos. Yeah, he's doing it about the same as he was then. No, not really any different. Yeah, about 2-3 times a week. No, not really any more stable. Yep. Just the same. Really. The same.)

I haven't found a good solution yet. And I'm a talkative sort, so I WANT to talk. Lately I've been kinda making friends with a few individuals in a group who take a more "Oh, he does that, eh? Interesting..." kind of approach to life. And then we spend a lot of time whispering in corners, which annoys the staff (the staff are easily annoyed, I got in trouble for reading a book to DS in a reading program the other day. Apparently he's not supposed to be interested in books that long yet, and reading the actual words is to complex for him, "developmentally speaking," so instead, I should sing a short jingle three times and only show him a few pages. Even if he's the one turning pages, and begging me to keep reading with those cute little eyes of his. And the look I got when they pressed me to NAME the bedtime story we "use...")

And sometimes I just talk to the kids and ignore the parents. It's surprisingly easy to make a joke like "Well, tom/dick/harry, I think your mom expects me to talk to HER, now why would I do a thing like that when I've got such a lovely little boy to talk to..." and get away with it!

Anyway, I really am kinda scared of doing something like that by accident, especially in groups where the standard conversation begins with "how old is ___" and proceeds through the milestone chart from there... And I'm deeply afraid of missing the boat on DSs interests. I think that's just me, because I was having nightmares about not understanding what he needed before he was born. I'm pretty sure I can avoid some of the bigger things she was doing, but in some groups it's really hard not to have the same conversation over and over and over, and often it wasn't constructive the first time.

DS demands a lot of stimulation, and to get it I take him to programs and things. I think the programs tend to draw nervous moms. The staffs tend to encourage it, and get really frustrated with me because I'm not lapping up their every suggestion. I don't have a good solution to that, either.

<sigh>

See, everything anyone notices is really just a reflection on what's goin' on inside their heads...

Oh dear, this is both incomprehensible and rambly. Maybe I'll just shut up now!

True. I've often noticed that the things that annoy me most in other people are things I do myself.

Yes, we are super sensitive to those around us when we ourselves tend to go in that direction. As I said in the first post ... as parents with gifted children, we should support each other. I suspect you noticed the looks from the other parents and if you are like me, put yourself in her shoes which just made it worse. I, too, have had similar issues with a group of moms. My DD's dance class last year had some possible gifted girls in it, especially one where her older brother was accepted into the gifted program for kindergarten. The mom was very careful on how she approached it, especially with one mom whose son is possibly on the spectrum and was considering holding him back from starting kindergarten the next year, but her argument was that he wasn't reading yet. Perhaps her saving face approach to the other reasons she was considering it (not that having a child on the spectrum is a bad thing but I think to the mom it was unthinkable). This set the stage for some interesting conversation and with the mom of the gifted child basically boasting about her son reading before he entered kindergarten but he was not in the norm. I really didn't mind her information and wasn't offended by it but sat up when I heard the same mom argue the famous 'they all even out by 3rd grade'. I just saw it as a major put down to her own child. When I out and out asked her if she really believed that, she changed her tune and admitted that she didn't.

Talking about a gifted child in the social setting can be difficult and for the most part I stay away from it. I have come to realize that it isn't important that the other mothers know that my child is gifted. It really is important that I accept it and do everything in my power to encourage her to learn and not lose her spark. I don't even discuss it with her teachers because I feel like I'm boasting. Still a problem I need to get over and a sign that I have been burned a few times in the past and just don't want to deal with it. This said ... last week I talked to DDs teacher for an update on her progress and discovered that she is doing really well and progressing across the board. (She is in a Spanish Immersion program.) While talking to her teacher, I gave her some background on DD which didn't shock her. She has told me on numerous occasions that DD is a very smart little girl. But it felt good to tell her a little bit about DD which might explain why she is able to do what she sees her do in class but also to allow the teacher to challenge her even more. We like the school and find there is challenge in the fact that it is taught in Spanish but I know what they are working on which equates to kindergarten level work for public schools is still not much of a challenge for DD. She is 3 1/2 and equal to second grade. I am doing my part at home, providing her with more challenging work and I hope that with the Spanish fulfills her. Right now she seems happy and loves school. So maybe we are doing something right.

Everything about DS is so contradictory. It's hard to figure out. He doesn't respond to things the way other kids do, it takes a lot of working through the wherefores in order to actually solve things. So, on the one hand, I'm looking for advice. Things have not been all rosy, and it IS more than I can sort out alone. But on the other hand, sometimes asking the question winds up revealing something I didn't realize was unusual....

Eg: He's SOOOOOO sticky. You can't just give him another toy to get him not to play with the scissors. That stopped working before the verb "to give" really applied. You can't just hide something he shouldn't have. So far, it seems we just have to deal with the tantrum and tell him why you're doing what you're doing. But that means a lot of tantrums, and looooooooong ones. I'd love to have another solution... When he was about 6 mos old I got told kids that young don't have tantrums, and to change his diaper. Well. Suffice it to say he's ECd now, and he _is_ less miserable, but he still has just as many tantrums.

Sometimes I think people are telling jokes, and it turns out they were serious... it's hard to come back from that... people really notice it. (Like the thing about giving a baby a toy while you read a book so that they'll sit still and listen -- which doesn't seem like it's really got anything to do with the book, anyway... so I still don't get it)

<sigh> I've never been good at fitting in, and this phase of life is *not* easier!

<sigh>

did I mention <sigh>?

Veering off topic, but I do get the toy thing. Some kids just need something else to do to allow them to settle enough to listen. It's like people who knit while they listen to a lecture or watch TV.

My daughter Hanni, not yet two, will hand me a picture book to read to her, and then pick up another one to "read" herself. I finally figured out she really does want me to read the first one, but she can't just sit there and do nothing! (Eventually she does settle down and focus on the book I'm reading.)

Anyway, I do get your main point, about other people's advice sometimes being way out of whack for your child.

Veering off topic is probably good in this case

DS does all kinds of ridiculous things while listening to books -- and he's made it clear he's listening! Giving him a toy, though, is likely to just make him annoyed -- it's not the one he wants, it won't do X at the right time, etc. At BEST, giving him a toy and then reading a book at him results in him attempting to jam the toy in your mouth to see if you can still read that way! (Now, letting him PICK a toy, that has some potential...)

I think it's the beginning that's different: Case 1) Kid wants to read, so you read. Whether the kid is playing with a toy, climbing up the drapes, or attempting to remove his diaper and place it on your head, the book is part of the game. Case 2) Kid does not want to read, but you think it's good for him. Whether you find a way to make him sit still or read it to him while he cries and rages and struggles, the book is not helpful.

We never tried to get DS to like books... but we were lucky, he just did, so when he got to be about 6 mos, and everyone expected him to like books, he already did. It seems like a majority of parents in my area are getting a lot of pressure to make sure their kid loves books by 6 mos, and most of the kids... well... don't. At least not in a sit-still-listen-and-point kinda way. And I think it's at least a bit circular. We didn't force him, so he saw the good parts. If we'd been withholding the bedtime nursing session until he sat through a book (not uncommon here), I'm not sure he'd have been focusing on the same aspects. We didn't even start doing bedtime stories until he was about 4 months old, which is something one has to be quiet about here. Average age to begin reading bedtime stories is between -2 mos and shortly after birth.

Actually I think "pushing" (as opposed to the "pushy" of the subject line), is endemic here. It's considered very bad if you don't read counting books and sing the alphabet song regularly by the time the baby is 6 mos old. Typically, by a year, kids are being taught numbers in at least three languages (not joking, in the library program we go to, we sing "One two three four five five five" in... count 'em 8-12 languages each week.)

It's very wonky, and I think it makes life particularly difficult for any one with a minimally compliant child. Kids that don't suffer boredom gladly are guaranteed not to like it. As I've mentioned before, DS really needs the stimulation of different places and people, and the structure of programs, but it's hard finding ones that aren't boring. Especially right now, when he's kinda between stages. Not welcome in the toddler programs, but not really suited to the baby ones. And it's gettning WORSE. He just keeps growing out of things. Thank goodness for summer!

blarg.

Wow ... I thought my area was competitive and one upping attitude ... looks like you have us beat. The 8-12 languages to count is definitely an extreme.

And I completely understand the reading to a young child and them liking it and demanding it. My DD was obsessed with books. She was talking in sentences by 6 months and mostly to ask questions as she went through book after book. They say you should stick with one or two books at that age so as not to confuse them. Haha ... yeah, right! She wouldn't have tolerated it. It was clear that she was building her vocabulary and with every 'What's this?' and 'What's that?' she would add a new word to her list. By the time she was a year old she had so many words I stopped counting.

I fully believe in reading to children to help build a love of books, but some kids are just naturally going to go that direction and not need such an effort put forth. DD was the kid that all other toys could go away; so long as she had/has her books she is happy.

I've been meaning to post on this but have been so busy lately! Anyways. About that mom. I don't know.. I try and give people the benefit of the doubt. Maybe she felt comfortable enough in that group to say these things? Maybe she's just clueless about what's acceptable to say and what's not? Although, that's a shame that she didn't seem to notice her kid like you said, it might have been a one time deal. It doesn't sound like you know her very well so there could've been something external to this meeting that caused her to act that one. I guess, I'm just saying this to add a different point of view. I'm not saying your wrong or anything.

I've had a few times so far where people have approached me about their kids being potentially gifted. If people find out what I do for a living they assume I was gifted growing up and that DD probably is too (ok, not wrong assumptions in this case) and I think they might just feel more comfortable "coming out" about it. Maybe it was a similar situation?

It does sound like you live in a very crazy area with everyone pushing early academics. I can relate. Here it is NUTS and sometimes I feel like I should be signing up DD for a billion different classes, etc. However, we can't afford any of that. It made winter pretty tough being stuck at home all day and especially with DD not sleeping much at all anymore but we just got creative. We really looked around for good indoor activities, tried out a bunch of different playgroups, etc. Now that the weather is better we're at the playground at least twice per day.

We try and follow DD's lead as much as possible so ditto for the books. She's also one that will want me reading a book to her while she may be reading her own books. Or other times we have 5 books out at once and she'll keep switching in between them. She also went through a phase where she didn't want to read as much too and we just waited it out. I don't like hearing about parents forcing stuff like that at such a young age. However, I guess it's their right...

Oh my.

That is just so wrong.

Everyone knows babies are sooo much more patient when they're tired and hungry.

Naaaaahhhhhhh..... EVERYONE knows babies need good sleep "hygiene" and a "clear bedtime routine."

Actually, the way I said it might be too strong. I think people do it in the same way as I sometimes withhold nursing until we're through the check-out line at the grocery store. It just seems totally unnecessary for a bedtime story.

(Ps: I enjoy a forum where I regularly give too _little_ detail, because people actually bother to read. It makes me giggle and think, both of which are good things :))