I thought I'd make this a separate thread from my intro, as it has more to do with my son's behavior, mostly in school. Basically, it's going downhill. E has been suspended three times since coming back from winter break; the third time was today. He's having better behavior in class, but now the problem seems to be during lunch and recess, and sometimes at home.

E has started hitting kids during recess, which obviously is unacceptable. When he gets called in to the principal's office, he starts acting really weird, almost infantile. He'll crawl under the table, run away if possible, refuse to talk (but will make shrieking noises sometimes). He does this at home sometimes, too, if we ask him to do something he doesn't want to do (homework, clean his room, etc). It's as if he's reverting to toddler stage, and it's just about impossible to talk with him or get him to do anything when he's like this. The plus-side for him is that he gets left alone, at least for a time, and doesn't have to face consequences.

The school is still working on his evaluation, but they should be finished within a few weeks. I had planned on waiting until it was finished to do anything, but two suspensions in less than a week is too many. We have an appointment with the ped tomorrow, and I'm hoping to get a rec for...a therapist perhaps? I'm not even sure, but I feel that it's gone too far. Wandering around the room and distracting classmates is one thing, hitting them and then turning into a toddler is another.

Has anyone else experienced this? Does anyone have any suggestions on how to turn it around? It's relatively new to us; I certainly don't remember it happening last year in first grade.

This is a good book for when you don't know what is going on with your kid.

http://www.amazon.com/gp/aw/d/0979498201/ref=redir_mdp_mobile

Hi,
So sorry you're having this problem--unfortunately (as usual) I don't have anything too helpful to add, but your son sounds a lot like my nephew who is 7 and the family's solution was to pull him out and homeschool. Actually he was doing more of the hitting stuff and overreacting to other kids' breaking the rules than the other things you describe (although he did that crawling under the table thing once or twice), but it seems pretty similar to me. I guess he just has trouble controlling his emotions when other people aren't following the rules, plus sometimes he really wants people to play a game a certain way and they aren't interested, and again he overreacts. He tests HG+ but hasn't (hadn't) really complained about the pace of the work, but then again he was in 1st grade so you might not expect that. They're going to try social skills group and also interacting with other homeschoolers for social skills practice and hope he grows out of it in a year or two--which they think he will, since my sister did (she says--I really can't remember). They had also gotten an independent evaluation from a (private) psychologist basically saying just that (that he would grow out of it, and making specific suggestions about how the school might help him--seating near the teacher, standing near the teacher in line, maybe special work if he was bored) but the vice-principal who was the point person was getting pressure from other parents (about the hitting, even though nobody was actually hurt) and the new school district psychologist said she didn't believe the independent report. It seems like maybe the school district can't just do that (legally), but anyway the upshot was the parents thought their efforts were better put into homeschooling since they have that option (rather than fighting the school district, etc.). This just happened so I don't have any useful information about what did or didn't work--sorry. But good luck, and please post if you figure anything out. A number of people with more experience suggested that the parents get him an IEP, in which case apparently he could not be kicked out for behavior corresponding to his disability. But I'm not sure how they would have addressed his disability--my sister was afraid they would isolate him and that that would have been even worse. Maybe you should see what happens with the report you're expecting, and what they suggest--although hopefully he doesn't get in more trouble in the meantime. Best of luck; I'm really sorry you're all having this problem.

I would say he's either figured out that this sort of behavior will get him the heck out of the classroom and school as a relief, or he's very, very stressed about something - chaos in the classroom, bullying...I guess lack of challenge could come out that way if he's at his wit's end.

If you haven't seen this before it's something new that's happening with him or a build-up I would think. If you're seeing it at home for the first time it's probably a spill-over from school but your DS is trying to tell you something. You'll have to work on, over time, getting him to articulate

I probably sound like a broken record but also consider diet/allergies which can affect behavior and a friend of mine's son has that PANADAS which not everyone believes but it's strep throat time and that's his very worst time. Is there strep throat in the classroom in our state the school has to send a note home per the health department but you probably would have had this issue in prior years, also the food (others might be able to talk about onset).

I'd go with rather extreme stress?

KJP, I just ordered the book (unfortunately our library doesn't carry it, but it looks worth a few bucks for a used copy). Thanks for the rec!

Yes, I would agree that he's figured out he can get out of school for misbehaving. At the least he gets sent home for the rest of the day, at "best" he gets suspended and gets to miss an entire day. Clever kid.

Extreme stress might be at least part of the answer. My husband believes he would have been classified as EG as a kid, so if our son is anything like him (and gosh knows they seem awfully similar!), I can see him being bored crazy in 2nd grade. He also has very few friends, so lunchtime/recess is probably not too fun. I desperately wish he would communicate better so we knew what, if anything, was bothering him.

Right now E is on a gluten-free diet. He was off for a few weeks at the beginning of January, but it seemed like his behavior at school got worse and worse, so we put him back on it. That resulted in an improvement in behavior, but now we're back to weird infantile stuff again. (Maybe he found my stash of Thin Mints in the freezer!)

Has your son previously had behavior issues or issues interacting with other kids his own age?

Here is something interesting.

If a child is placed in an ESE program they can't suspend him/her so much that it changes his/her placement and being home isn't the same placement as being in a classroom...more restrictive. Now if it has to do with guns or drugs there is some wiggle room to change placement imediately. But just hitting is different.

Now here is the funny part...if they THINK the child is in need of services the same rules apply. And by "being in the process" of getting an evaluation they obviously suspect that he MIGHT be in need of services. You need to go in and say that you know your child's rights and that the out of school suspensions need to stop and they need to do a Functional Behavioral Analysis and develop a Behavioral intervention plan (which might include time in a classroom with harder work).

Now if it were me, I wouldn't want my child given the label of Behavior Disordered or Emotionally Handicapped (unless he truly has some sort of serious mental illness, then it wouldn't bother me)...if he is just acting out because school makes him miserable then I really wouldn't want that label.

I would recommend you ask for a referral to have your son evaluated by a pediatric neuropsychologist and that, if possible, you find one who has some experience working with high IQ kids with disabilities. The sooner you have answers or at least indications as to the cause of the aggressive and inappropriate behaviors, the better you'll be able to help your son cope and adapt. And having him under the care of a medical professional can help you advocate for appropriate placement and accommodations at school.

Last year was a disaster for my son (not for the same issues you describe but for other behaviors that created problems with his teachers). There were continual visits to the principal, angry emails from teachers, etc., but now that there are appropriate accommodations in place as well as information provided to the teachers regarding his behaviors, it has been a much better year for the teachers and my son. They can recognize triggers, they can interpret behaviors as they apply to him and not the general public, and then act accordingly. It hasn't been perfect, and I've still had my share of phone calls, teacher visits, and calls from the principal, but it isn't almost daily.

I can tell you this is exactly what happened with my son. The school psychologist claimed my son made "great" eye contact and spoke openly with him the entire time he saw him, so there was no way he was on the autism spectrum, and he wanted to label him "Emotionally Disturbed". Kids who are labeled ED who don't make rapid progress in the classroom (in our area) are typically shunted off into a special classroom full of kids with the ED label... and that is the LAST place you want to place a sensitive and/or gifted kid, let me tell you!!!

We tabled that ARD meeting with the quickness and ended up changing schools after we got the neuropsych's eval (PDD-NOS, shocking!)

Totally agree with this. Until you know what's going on, you don't know how to solve it or even what educational placement is going to work the best.

Bzylzy also nails it with the idea that this is an escape behavior. Also hard to fix until you know what's going on. You can request that the school do a Functional Behavior Analysis to see when the blowups happen, what preceded them, what the triggers are likely to be. They need to take data if they want answers. It would not be a bad idea to request that the school do a complete educational evaluation, either; this starts the process for getting legal protections in place.

What you describe is not atypical of kids with autism spectrum disorders in the early elementary years; lunch and recess, which are less structured and highly social, do provide lots of extra stressors. Not saying this is necessarily ASD, just saying that you should be looking closely to see whether you can get good answers about your kid's profile.

DeeDee

Yes...my older child was not diagnosed with Asperger's until he was 8 years old. Classical autism is diagnosed earlier but PDD-NOS and Asperger's can be a later discovery.

Hi, I think I my story may be helpful. My son started acting similarly "weird" in kindergarten. It wasn't quite the same behavior as yours but it was, well, weird (for lack of a better word) behavior that made him look like he had a serious behavioral and/or psychological disorder. Now, I am not sure of your child's background but mine never acted so strangely before - he had never had strange tics, etc. He had always been a good kid, happy, *normal* But in kindie, for example, he became unable to swallow - I mean, pathologically so. To get rid of the salavia, instead of swallowing it, he would spit - not on people but he would spit into shirt sleeve and shirt (trying to be discreet and kind-of was until other kids were like "ew the front of shirt is all wet and looks like spit). It was so bad his entire shirt would be soaked within an hour. I had to get him a bunch of handkerchiefs. He told me he was afraid of disguisting thinsg going into him - he just couldn't help it. He did other things too - started spinning in circles, very oppositional, etc. ... really I mean just very very alarming behavior. Socially unacceptable behavior too. And he would completely freak out if his picture were taken - like cry uncontrollably. He did weird behavior that, now in retrospect we realize were attempts in some watys to be left alone - to get out of doing tasks that apparently were causing a great deal of stress and even he did not know why he felt so horrible he just felt compelled to act out at the stress of the task. He was also just having for lack of a better word a "breakdown." He was literally falling apart and he didn't even know why. He became unrecognizable.

People were throwing around autism spectrum disorder as possible answers. But, I knew in my heart something was stressing him and traumatizing him... I felt like a kid doesn't suddenly at 5 or 6 start acting like this. I felt like a kid who is truly has one of the spectrum disorders shows some pretty strong signs of that earlier. Without a trauma to the head, I couldn't imagine how he would suddenly start having such a condition.

There was another angle. During his kindie class, his entire class broke down into groups for reading and fine motor activities (every day for 20 minutes) The para-professional he was paired with for this he hated. HATED. She shamed him for his fine motor delays in front of the others in his group (didn't know about his hypotonia even though he had a 504 plan - apparently, you have to not only do a 504 plan but you need to put on a dog and pony show for every single teacher and aid your kid has because no one bothers to even look at them! but I digress..) and often entered into major power struggles with him where she seemed determined to "show him who is boss" The para was talked to about being more sensitive and supportive but they school wanted DS to stay in her group to teach him "how to work with people he doesn't like much." According to DS, snide remarks continued sort of under her breath aimed at DS (eyeroll). I complied with keeping him in her group - at first. ONe particularly horrible December day for him I had enough and liteally marched up the school and demanded he be pulled from her group immediately and placed in another. That was the first time we started seeing improvement - not only did his behavior stop deteriorating, it began to improve - and it was immediate and noticeable.

Anyway, I knew I had to figure out what really happened - fundamentally. I couldn't have that happen again. I needed to get to the root. My suspicion was he was 2E - but I did not even know that terminology back then. I knew he was very smart and so much so that it can cause problems and I knew something was stressing him a great deal. I already knew he had hypotonia but I wasn't truly appreciating the impact that was having - and neither was anyone else. I took him to be evaluated at a local children's hospital and put him therapy. I specifically told the hospital that I suspected he was 2E (though I didn't use that term b/c I didn't know it but that is essentially what I explained). I told them I strongly suspected a learning disorder. I went to the wrong place. I realize now that such a place was more into diagnosing childhood behavior disorders and such - they completely dismissed my concerns about a learning disability. They got distracted the behavior evals and were merely trying to fit him into a psychological or behavior disorder and didn't pursue the learning problem aspect at all. The only useful thing that came out of that experience were I got to observe him take the WISC (very very helpful for me), I got WISC scores (more clues to where his learning issue is) and I got an anxiety disorder diagnosis (so that the next time a para or teacher starts freaking him out I could get him removed from the situation immediately. It also made the school take GREAT care in whose class they placed DS in the next year - very helpful.

But I wasn't done.

One thing I realized when watching him take the WISC is that something was up with his vision - the way he processes visual information. The psychologists thought I was nuts when I said this to them. My DH jokes they just looked at me like I had some sort of rodent on my head when I mentioned it to them. I was suspecting dyslexia. And they were like "no - even though it doesn't quite fit - we think he is "on the spectrum." They said the only thing wrong with his vision was that because he is on the spectrum he can't see things from other people's perspective and is too rigid. I left in tears. I decided to disregard their advice and look into dyslexia. But first I wanted to rule out vision issues b/c I suspected that too. Undaunted by psychologists' rolling eyes, I took him to a very respectable optometrist and low and behold, his one eye crosses in intermittently so basically seeing and reading was a little crazy for him. It meant his depth perceptions was off, words and letters "moved" on him, he physically has trouble focusing visually, etc. He had no idea how he was seeing was "off" because that was all he ever knew. Now we know why he was falling apart at reading time and with close-proximity work in general!

Once I got an iep for anxiety - I basically wrote the entire IEP itself and I put into place strong accommodations for his visual disorder. AND, for the hypotonia, I put in strong accommodations - the same ones used for dysgraphia (I came here and got great help from others who have 2E kids with writing disabilities). We also got 'kid-glove,' as I like to call them, accommodations for DS's anxiety.

I still was not done. I was still concerned he either had dyslexia or dysgraphia. I was either going to get him evaluated (by a person who would actually take me seriously this time!) privately or by school. The school psych said she'd do it, I liked this one (the one he had in kindie I didn't) and I trusted her. She didn't think he had either but I also felt like she did take my concerns seriously nonetheless. She did a good deal of testing and observing DS for me. It was through these evals that it became more clear that DS does have dysgraphia.

My kid is pretty much himself again. The school psych this year called him "delightful." She talked about how much fun he was to test. His teachers say he's doing well,etc. He is not perfect - he is never been "easy" in the sense that he is intense and smart and a bit argumentative by nature. But even he even says he didn't know who he was last year! He is embarrassed about it (poor thing - often hoping kids who knew him then don't remember how weird he acted I assure him most don't remember it at all and will remember none of it by next year.)

The morale of my story is... undetected learning and vision disorders can wreak havok. They can lead your child to look like someone he isn't. It doesn't come out I think until demand so school start stressing the child. Maybe look at that closely even just on your own first, you now? To see if something like that may at the root. I hope this helps you somewhat!