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Posted By: onthegomom Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 11:33 AM
DS10 is really into music now. Any suggestions to keeping it positive and appropriate. Yesterday, he borrowed a Queen CD from the libary. Well, I'm not ready for him to listen to Fat bottom girls make the rocking world go round...
Posted By: Wren Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 12:15 PM
I feel really old and out of it and wondering about some of this music. I was listening to something on the radio, the melody was great and listening to the lyrics it was about going clubbing in the middle of the night, taking your clothes off and having sex in the club with everyone.

Ren
Posted By: Bostonian Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 12:19 PM
I don't have an answer to your question, but you may be interested in a recent study finding "a statistically significant trend toward narcissism and hostility in popular music".

http://www.nytimes.com/2011/04/26/science/26tier.html
A Generation�s Vanity, Heard Through Lyrics
By JOHN TIERNEY
New York Times
April 25, 2011

A couple of years ago, as his fellow psychologists debated whether narcissism was increasing, Nathan DeWall heard Rivers Cuomo singing to a familiar 19th-century melody. Mr. Cuomo, the lead singer and guitarist for the rock band Weezer, billed the song as �Variations on a Shaker Hymn.�

Where 19th-century Shakers had sung � �Tis the gift to be simple, �tis the gift to be free,� Mr. Cuomo offered his own lyrics: �I�m the meanest in the place, step up, I�ll mess with your face.� Instead of the Shaker message of love and humility, Mr. Cuomo sang over and over, �I�m the greatest man that ever lived.�

The refrain got Dr. DeWall wondering: �Who would actually sing that aloud?� Mr. Cuomo may have been parodying the grandiosity of other singers � but then, why was there so much grandiosity to parody? Did the change from �Simple Gifts� to �Greatest Man That Ever Lived� exemplify a broader trend?

Now, after a computer analysis of three decades of hit songs, Dr. DeWall and other psychologists report finding what they were looking for: a statistically significant trend toward narcissism and hostility in popular music. As they hypothesized, the words �I� and �me� appear more frequently along with anger-related words, while there�s been a corresponding decline in �we� and �us� and the expression of positive emotions.

�Late adolescents and college students love themselves more today than ever before,� Dr. DeWall, a psychologist at the University of Kentucky, says. His study covered song lyrics from 1980 to 2007 and controlled for genre to prevent the results from being skewed by the growing popularity of, say, rap and hip-hop.

Defining the personality of a generation with song lyrics may seem a bit of a reach, but Dr. DeWall points to research done by his co-authors that showed people of the same age scoring higher in measures of narcissism on some personality tests. The extent and meaning of this trend have been hotly debated by psychologists, some of whom question the tests� usefulness and say that young people today aren�t any more self-centered than those of earlier generations. The new study of song lyrics certainly won�t end the debate, but it does offer another way to gauge self-absorption: the Billboard Hot 100 chart. The researchers find that hit songs in the 1980s were more likely to emphasize happy togetherness, like the racial harmony sought by Paul McCartney and Stevie Wonder in �Ebony and Ivory� and the group exuberance promoted by Kool & the Gang: �Let�s all celebrate and have a good time.� Diana Ross and Lionel Richie sang of �two hearts that beat as one,� and John Lennon�s �(Just Like) Starting Over� emphasized the preciousness of �our life together.�

Today�s songs, according to the researchers� linguistic analysis, are more likely be about one very special person: the singer. �I�m bringing sexy back,� Justin Timberlake proclaimed in 2006. The year before, Beyonc� exulted in how hot she looked while dancing � �It�s blazin�, you watch me in amazement.� And Fergie, who boasted about her �humps� while singing with the Black Eyed Peas, subsequently released a solo album in which she told her lover that she needed quality time alone: �It�s personal, myself and I.�

Two of Dr. DeWall�s co-authors, W. Keith Campbell and Jean M. Twenge, published a book in 2009 titled �The Narcissism Epidemic," which argued that narcissism is increasingly prevalent among young people � and possibly middle-aged people, too, although it�s hard for anyone to know because most of the available data comes from college students.

For several decades, students have filled out a questionnaire called the Narcissism Personality Inventory, in which they�ve had to choose between two statements like �I try not to be a show-off� and �I will usually show off if I get the chance.� The level of narcissism measured by these questionnaires has been rising since the early 1980s, according to an analysis of campus data by Dr. Twenge and Dr. Campbell.

<end of excerpt>

I'm sure my children will form their own musical tastes, but I will try to expose them to some of my favorites, such as Billy Joel or Fleetwood Mac. By a strange coincidence the best music ever was made when I was growing up smile.

Posted By: Iucounu Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 12:33 PM
I may not be the best person to weigh in, as DS5 likes all sorts of stuff that we let him listen to that a lot of people would find inappropriate (e.g. he likes Black Sabbath, Danzig, etc. when it comes up in our music rotation blush in amongst the Fleetwood Mac and Pixies). But I guess as long as you keep tabs on what he physically brings in the house, that's one avenue of entry covered. I'd be worried about the computer and MP3s more. For any computer he uses, you can regularly check for MP3 files, the presence of music-sharing software or links to sites where music sharing happens, etc. You can use software controls like Net Nanny (off the top of my head) to control sites he visits, restrict his level of user access on the computer to install programs, personally monitor his computer use, etc.

In the end, if he sneaks around he can probably at some point listen to things of which you wouldn't approve. I would just make sure the lines of communication are open and stay watchful, I guess.
Posted By: Nik Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 02:59 PM
FWIW, way back in the late 70's my 8-9 year old buddies and I would frequently sing and motion/dance the soundtrack to Grease with great enthusiasm. Years later, my daughter wanted a 50s theme sleepover so I bought the movie and I was absolutely horrified at the explicit lyrics and inappropriate theme. I guess it all went right over our heads at that age.

I really don't buy into the notion that certain music alone will detrimentally influence how kids turn out, but I do think trying to shelter them from it by banning/censoring it will likely make it more appealing to them. I agree you don't want your kid going around singing offensive things in public and I think you just do what you can to educate them on that end.

�Late adolescents and college students love themselves more today than ever before,� Dr. DeWall, a psychologist at the University of Kentucky, says. I don't agree with this conclusion at all, I think today's youth are lonelier than ever with computers and social networking replacing real personal connection. I am curious if the suicide rates among this age group over the period of the study would support the conclusion being drawn.
Posted By: Ametrine Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 06/30/11 03:59 PM
laugh
I have to laugh at your Queen reference. Queen's harmonizing is outstanding (in my book), but I get what you mean about the lyrics.

We have Sirius on cable and one of my favorite channels is Hair Bands of the 1980's. I noticed that our parental blocking code pops up whenever I want to listen to it, yet doesn't pop up for the other 80's rock channel. Apparently, Sirius has already done some of the filtering for parents. I don't know if Queen would be categorized as a "hair band", though...unlike Twisted Sister, for instance.

There are good bands with clean lyrics: Owl City

I like to check out online the lyrics of a few songs before I buy CD's for my son.

Posted By: Nautigal Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 03:02 AM
I don't know. So far, it's a battle just to keep rap out of the house, since it seems to have seeped into all the cartoons and everything. I just let them have one of my CDs in their players at bedtime, and there isn't any rap in there. There is a fair amount of stuff that other parents might consider inappropriate, which I thought about when DS8 wanted to take Jimmy Buffett and Devo to school for his class to listen to at writing time. Teacher said she had a good handle on Buffett and Devo and it was ok. smile And then there's Meatloaf, which I had to consider on the trip to Denver for DI when I found myself watching two neighbor boys absorbing the lyrics to "Paradise by the Dashboard Light". Umm yeah anyway.

But mostly they choose (DD) Tanya Tucker, Lorrie Morgan, Loretta Lynn, and (DS) Don McLean, Gordon Lightfoot, CW McCall, Fleetwood Mac (what is it about Fleetwood Mac in this thread, anyway?) and the aforementioned classics. There is hope.
Posted By: MumOfThree Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 04:06 AM
I think music is just hard full stop. We had to stop playing Susan Vega in the car when our eldest started asking difficult questions at 3yrs old.
Posted By: chris1234 Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 11:52 AM
I figure as long as we discuss the appropriate use of some of these words, and whether or not what is suggested in some songs is ever appropriate, we are doing ok. That said, there is a huge difference between warren zevon (mr. Bad example?) And anything by folks like marshall mathers (and I like his stuff). In the very end, if the work is a worthy piece of art I am not going to freak out about lyrics. Hopefully ds will continue to share what he likes and vice versa to keep communication flowing.
Posted By: Bostonian Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 12:18 PM
Originally Posted by Nautigal
I don't know. So far, it's a battle just to keep rap out of the house, since it seems to have seeped into all the cartoons and everything.

I don't like rap as a musical form, but as long as the lyrics are not evil, I would be reluctant to ban it just on aesthetic grounds. There are CDs with rap songs to learn the multiplication tables -- for example Multiplication Rap -- that my children have listened to.
Posted By: elh0706 Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 02:05 PM
Not knowing what your religious beliefs are, I hesitate to mention that the Christian Rock music genre has a very large selection of music that has the beats that my 12 year old loves along with lyrics that are not promoting sex and violence.

That said, DS loves to listen to any and all music from Gregorian chants, folk music and classical to what you hear on today's pop music radio stations. Country, Jazz, Classic Rock (Anyone else find it odd that the 80's music is now in this catagory?). I mean he loves everything. So far our attitude has been to make sure he asks about lyrics he doesn't understand. When we hear some of them, we ask him what he thinks the song means. This has been pretty good for keeping the lines of communication open. We do tell him sometimes that the lyrics are not appropriate to his age and that there are adult themes that we prefer him not to worry about right now. Usually, then he changes the radio station when those songs come on.

But, on the positive side, knowing the current music scene does give him some social confidence at school.

Good luck! We are just starting down the Teenage path with DS. It is going to be a rough road...
Posted By: daytripper75 Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/01/11 04:13 PM
http://www.commonsensemedia.org/music-reviews
This is the site I recommend to patrons.
Posted By: onthegomom Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/02/11 02:25 AM
thanks for the suggestions. I think I'll come back to this again for tips.

If I can find a few CDs that DS10 can get into he will be content. He has basically listened to 2 kids bop CDs last year almost daily. He like singing to them. I didn't know common sense had music. Thank you that will be a big help.
Posted By: La Texican Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/04/11 12:02 AM
"Eagles, many of they broke up-Glenn Fry, Joe Walsh, Don Henley all of them went on as solo artists. Some of them say some things but I love their music. Even George Straight has some explicit lyrics "they call me the fireman", but it's in everything. Some things are about the lyrics and some things are about the music."
-my hubby
Posted By: Ametrine Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/14/11 04:11 PM
Originally Posted by daytripper75
http://www.commonsensemedia.org/music-reviews
This is the site I recommend to patrons.

The site below has been helpful for us. It gives in-depth details on the content in movies, DVD's, music, etc. Plugged In Online
Posted By: Taminy Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/14/11 04:47 PM
My kids have both hit the age where they are listening to the radio, including a lot of lyrics that I hate. My biggest misgivings have to do with the way in which women are referred to and the way in which women refer to themselves in modern music.

I laughed as I read several of the comments on this thread--I rented Grease for DD's birthday party last year (same age I was when it came out) and had a definite...."huh." moment. DH is a huge Jimmy Buffett fan and we would frequently include his music when we would burn CDs for car trips. Now that we are loading onto iPOD we are more likely to have whole albums. Wish I hadn't forgotten about the song "Why Don't We Get Drunk...." blush

Funniest experience we ever had with music: Johnny Cash's "A Boy Named Sue" which ends with a string of bleeps on our CD. The song was apparently written by Shel Silverstein. I checked out a Shel Silverstein CD from the children's section of the library a few years back for my daughter. Later that evening she came running out and said, "Mom! Now I know what all the bleeping was in a Boy Named Sue". No bleeping in the Shel Silverstein version.... Oops. crazy
Posted By: Austin Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/14/11 07:20 PM
Mr W can sing anything after he hears it once. And he has phenomenal hearing and can tune in to one thing to the exclusion of everything else.

This makes things very interesting.

He was singing something with simulated flatulence noises added in. I asked him where he heard it and he said at the mall. After a few more questions, I narrowed it down to a rap song.

LOL

He picked up another song about flatulence on the playground at school from a boy who just graduated from Kindergarten - or he made it up. Sometimes I can't tell. I had to tell him not to sing that one out loud.


As his known list of words expands and he no longer mouths words from his aural memory, I suspect we'll get some tricky questions.


Posted By: Adrienne Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/14/11 09:44 PM
I had to come out of hidding for this post...I just love Queen.

I let the kids listen to many different artists, like Queen, but if I start hearing content coming across that I don't like I make them change the channel on the radio. Then we have a discussion about listening to the words, such as the phrase "brush my teeth with a bottle of Jack" (just hate that song) and what that means, what Jack is, why kids their age shouldn't be singing it and so on.

I try and show them to not just blindly listen and repeat like others at school, but listen and pick apart music. Also to form ideas for themselves instead of blindly following others in school or in popular media. Then they know what I expect of them no matter what kind of stuff they come across.
Posted By: Giftodd Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/15/11 05:28 AM
DH and I don't listen to much current music (I'm stuck in the early 90s), but I have to admit I'm not too fussed about what dd listens to with the exception of some of the more chauvinistic offerings doing the rounds. She's not allow to watch music videos (well, when I say not allowed - she doesn't know they exist yet, but once she does, I wont be letting her watch them for some time yet).

With regard to swearing and so on - DH and I both swear like troopers, despite our best efforts not to at home. Dd's favorite songs all contain swear words, yet she's never sworn in her life (or not in my presence anyway and I've had no reports of it elsewhere). I just don't think they hold any power in our household and dd is very sensitive to the nuance of responding appropriately in different situations, so I think she'd be unlikely to swear inappropriately out in the world either. I'm not suggesting that that would work for every family, but so much good music would have to be cut out of our play lists if we censored based on swearing! Like Adrienne, we'll discuss the lyrics where we think its important - or in some case we just don't discuss them at all because it's a fun song that without an explanation wont do any harm (thinking of the Grease references - the lyrics are meaningless when you're that age, without context).

Interestingly there are reports of gifted kids showing a preference for heavy metal music... here's one smile http://www.telegraph.co.uk/science/...etal-a-comfort-for-the-bright-child.html
Posted By: MumOfThree Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/15/11 06:55 AM
Quote
With regard to swearing and so on - DH and I both swear like troopers, despite our best efforts not to at home. Dd's favorite songs all contain swear words, yet she's never sworn in her life (or not in my presence anyway and I've had no reports of it elsewhere). I just don't think they hold any power in our household and dd is very sensitive to the nuance of responding appropriately in different situations, so I think she'd be unlikely to swear inappropriately out in the world either.
Gosh I am glad I am not alone in this. DH and I both swear a lot more than we intend to and yet have done quite well at teaching our children not to, in part because it doesn't' get much reaction from us. Each of our older children have experimented extremely briefly as toddlers and moved on - to chiding us gently when we do.

My concerns with lyrics are much more about meaning, or air-headed lack there of, than profanity.
Posted By: edina Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/19/11 01:54 PM
We try not to be flagrant but my husband and I both love music and it is hard to shelter from many different types of words. Cee-Lo's clean version of his hit was completely lost on her as in passing she heard one line of the real version. She adores Lady Gaga and listens to her non-stop. The only songs that have caused questions are "Government Hooker" and the "Disco Stick" song. I told her I don't want her listening to them because they are inappropriate and she understands why. It's hard to explain sexual inappropriateness to someone who barely understands sex, but we do our best. She doesn't curse and she doesn't share our discussions or the inappropriate things she comes across with her friends. I'm not going to freak about music, especially Gaga, as I see how it inspires her. She gets teased a lot for her speech (articulation challenges) and "Born This Way" and "Bad Kids" give her a lot of solace.
Posted By: AlexsMom Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/19/11 04:19 PM
Originally Posted by Taminy
Funniest experience we ever had with music: Johnny Cash's "A Boy Named Sue" which ends with a string of bleeps on our CD. The song was apparently written by Shel Silverstein. I checked out a Shel Silverstein CD from the children's section of the library a few years back for my daughter. Later that evening she came running out and said, "Mom! Now I know what all the bleeping was in a Boy Named Sue". No bleeping in the Shel Silverstein version.... Oops. crazy

Radio was the only music I ever heard until I went to college. Where I bought a CD containing a song that (on the radio) had cute little electronic noises at certain parts. Alas, not so on the CD!

DD and I like Gordon Ramsay's TV shows, and depending on the channel, they bleep more or less of the constant profanity. We were watching one on BBC America the other day, and they didn't bleep "ass." "Mom! Why didn't they bleep that word!?!" I explained that different stations had different thresholds. "You mean there are *worse* words than *that*!?!"
Posted By: Bostonian Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/21/11 01:03 PM
My 8yo son asked for the Rock Band 2 program for the Wii. He and his 6yo brother have treated us to hearty renditions of 70's/80's classics such as "Eye of the Tiger" (Survivor) and "Go Your Own Way" (Fleetwood Mac). My wife thinks it is good voice training. I have not yet noticed songs with objectionable lyrics.
Posted By: Sweetie Re: Monitoring Rock Music - 07/21/11 04:27 PM
Not to be picky...but Eye of the Tiger was Survivor
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