A very interesting and well written piece out of NY. I wonder how gifted parents will respond to this one. Do you think we are the same, or maybe even worst? Does the fact that we strongly believe that without our advocacy our kids would be lost in the school jungle justifies our actions? Or maybe it is all just empty talk...

Ania

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-dyn/content/article/2007/03/02/AR2007030202042.html

Unfortunately, I think many people perceive parents of gifted kids as pushing and "helicoptering". What we know to be the real truth is that our kids have NEEDS that are outside of the norm, and getting these needs addressed is going to sometimes make us appear to be a helicopter parent.

Another thing that contributes to that view is that parents of gifted kids are often gifted themselves. And that means the parent may have a "rage to master", and in many cases knows more about gifted education than the school administrators. To me, it's just a need to know and understand, but I think many educators see that as meddling, pushing, etc.

In my opinion, an actual helicopter parent is one who is pushing for his/her own needs (as a parent) rather than what the child needs. That can be any parent of any child, so I'm sure there are helicopter parents of gifted children out there just as there are helicopter parents of non-gifted children.

What really drags me down is when non-parents start to point the "helicopter parenting" finger, when they have never raised a child at all and have no concept of responsibilities of a parent. I hear that a lot in my workplace. Ugh.

Christi

It bothers me most when they say things like "let him enjoy his childhood" or "why push him?"

He's NOT enjoying his childhood. He's stuck in the mire of impoverished education. That's the point!!!

I'll be a Black Hawk if that's what Mite and Rite need.

My simple test for "am I a pushy parent or am I a parent trying to get some unmet needs met" is this:

I visualize my son's classroom. I visualize a new student with parents who have just moved into the area bringing the child in to DS's classroom. The child is clearly brighter than mine. I feel:

A) thrilled and relieved
B) threatened

If I can honestly answer "A" - then I know I'm alright!

Christi - thanks for that great insight into gifted parents who have a "rage to learn" out-prepping the local school administrators and therefore comming accross as a bit strange to family and school adults. BTDT!

Love and More Love,
Trinity

As long as my child has a need that I perceive to be a need, it is my right to "helicopter" if not my moral obligation. Who else knows what is best for a child than the parent? Usually people who care very little about your child and want them to fit into a little mold - so that it is easier for them.

What is really funny is the results of parenting. There have been several studies that have said children with involved parents, that spend time with their parents do much better than "hands off" parents. But, being "hands off" makes it easier for schools and society in general to push "their will" on our children.

Yes, there are some parents that live through their children, but I doubt that is the norm. However, articles like that one make concerned, involved parents question what they are doing. No, I am not going to put my kid on a bus and let him be shipped off to a school where I have no idea of the background of the teacher, no - I am not going to just leave my kid at a ball park and think that the coach only has good intentions and would never do anything inappropriate. If being a helicopter means keeping my kid out of the hands of predators or bully adults or what have you then I am all for it.

I definitely think many kids today are over committed, but I don't think the parents are bad - they are just trying to keep their kids occupied - yes, having dinner together every night would do fine, but that isn't everyone's reality. I would much rather be a helicopter parent than a parent like one of my friends students.

Teacher calls parent: "we need to talk about your child"

Parent: "look, your shift is 8-3; I don't call you during my shift so you don't call me during your shift".

Now, whose child has a better chance at success in life?

A friend of mine says that when we are little and shipped off to school we tend to feel scared and powerless.

Then we grow up, and our children go off to school.

Unless we have had a chance to face whatever feeling we had back then, there is a good chance that we will experience them again -and it isn't fun.

It also isn't fun for the School Folks who greet us on the other side, here in the present, if we are having all this emotion left over from the past.

I can remember being very full of feeling while walking through the halls of my son's school for "Parent Night," particularly in his early years.

sound familar to anyone else?

Trinity

To me,� helicopter parenting� denotes more of the stereotype of parents who are over invested in the process and completion of their children�s school assignments.

Our school started a new procedure for the science fair this year which I think was sorely needed. They implemented the requirement for each child to meet with the judges in front of their projects for a personnel interview (during the school day-no parents).

I don�t believe the parents of the gifted students were the major offenders in previous years. Unfortunately, the same old problem persists at the regional competition.

BTW, our school uses Edline. As described in the article, you can log on any time to view the latest update for any given subject. Of course it is only as current as the last time a teacher input the information. I can tell you that my kids log on at least twice as often as I do. I think it is a great tool.

Off subject here :
1. In our area, kids have always been asked to present their science experiments to the judges without the parent present.
2. Our school uses PowerSchool and we also love it

The discussion has been lovely, keep it going...

I have probably mentioned somewhere before, that I frequently give books as gifts to educators. Last year for Christmas the principal got King Matt the First from us and a few weeks later she could not thank us enough for introducing her to this book. She was truly grateful. This year I gave her Genius Denied and so far she has not mentioned it at all...which makes me feel kind of strange...after all she does ability grouping and is open to tons of things that help gifted learners. Was it too pushy?

Hmm, I think that educational books for educators may be more appropriate as a donation rather than a personal gift. Of course, I�m probably more off base thinking that everyone enjoys smelly soaps and candles as much as I do. If we did a poll, the winning answer would probably be gift cards and cash.

I�m sure that some teachers and administrators are offended by parents who give them current education books, but I�m sure many appreciate it. We have donated a few books in the past for the teacher�s resource library.

It exhausts me...being the black hawk. I prefer to call it advocate or facilitator. I have run up against the "why can't you just let them be kids" and "what's the rush?" comments. I actually changed schools because the headmaster was vehemently against grade-skipping. He said about his own 5th grade son, "Could Alex do 7th grade math? Probably. Will I allow him to do it? Absolutely not!" On the soccer field, one mom was previously a teacher and told me she has never seen a case where skipping has benefited a child and that she thought holding them back a year enabled them to be more mature and well-adjusted. I do not refute these opinions when they are offered. We simply agreed to disagree. Why should my kids have to wait--several years--for what they're able and eager to do now? What a waste! They are different from most kids and it is an all-consuming process of figuring out what's right for them. Even then, I'm sure it's not exactly right. I wish I could just let it go and say, "good luck!" each morning, but they're my babies. I try hard to be reasonable, patient, non-adversarial, and willing to do any groundwork that's needed to make it easier for teachers and administrators.
Tiffany, I agree with your self-test. I was so disappointed when a very bright boy in my son's class moved away. He provided motivation for my son to work at his math. Afterwards, my son relaxed and basically didn't do much in the self-paced math program for almost an entire year.
One thing I have eased up on a bit is involving the kids in lots of afterschool activities. They still do piano and sports, but they really need free time, too.

I think facilitator is a key role. I find myself having to facilitate communication all the time. It bothers me because I really feel it is the educator's job to fac. communication with the family, not the other way around.

I know in my education training I took a whole course in communication and facilitation. The point of the course was that families are dealing with so many emotions, from fear to pride, from hope to defeat, etc, that it is difficult for them to deal with the tensions of controversial conversations.

In my son's class there is one other child who seems to be gifted. He's definitely a natural at competition with my son. Their personalities clash, but they do feed off of each other. I think Mite does't feel so very alone when the other kid is there.

I agree with most of you on the importance of advocating for gifted children especially when their needs are not met by the normal school environment. However, we do need to back off a bit when they get older. They need to learn from their own (or other's) mistakes. They need to learn to deal with different challenges thrown at them from handling bullies to encountering difficult courses for first time. Ultimately, we want them to be successful without our help.

My question to you is when is a good time to let go and how to do that. You will have to let go 'the baby' when they go to colleges unless you plan to tag along, which will not be appreciated. It is probably better to start earlier than that.

I don't see the process as "backing off," as much as taking advantages of opportunities. When my son had just turned ten, I was sure that a private school was needed, he got to visit and choose amoung three that I was willing for him to go to. I made the spreadsheet of pluses and minuses, but if her were older, I would have had him make the spreadsheet. In a way, I feel uncomfortable being percieved as a mom who let her ten year old choose which school, it sound too weird to me, on the face of it. But he was going to have to put up with the negatives and take advantage of the positives, and afterall, his giftedness is in exactly this area of understanding. We had many wonderful conversations, and in the end, choose a school that I wouldn't have chosen, but that I was confident would be an improvement over the public school. It turned out that the school is an excellent place for him to be, and I have been able to have a whole new life as someone who doesn't spend all her time fretting.

I think this is a good example of looking for situations where the child gets to pick between 2 or 3 acceptable choices, and then learn about their consequences. Each time he makes a choice I learn a lot about how far to trust him in this way. spending Money is a classis way to learn about decision making.

One of the things I like best about my DS10 is that we can talk about his feelings and he is willing to admit the "less desirable" motivations, at least when we are alone together. He can say things like: "I want to have a Nintendo Wii 20% because it will impress other kids, but 60% because it will be fun, and 20% for the fitness training." How many people can own up to the effect of social pressure on their desires?

BTW - Some children have disabilities so that they will never be independent in the commonly understood way. Including some Gifted Children.

Off topic -
I think that there is a bit of a double standard in place with young adults and independence - many people marry someone with whom they can divide up responsibilities based on their strengths, but we expect unmarried young adults to "do it all" and "do it on their own." Seems a bit odd to me that this is the only group for which the expectation is that they will handle every department of their life.

Love and More Love,
Trinity

I am perfectly happy to let them make the mistakes while in the lower grades of school. I think it makes them stronger students when they lose points for their mistakes rather than have my husband or I polish their work before they turn it in. They learn what works and doesn�t.

I�m not too concerned about grades until 6th grade anyway, so in my opinion, Bs and an occasional C are motivators.

When asked by other parents why we grade advanced our daughter, I tell them, �I don�t need for her to be a big fish in a small pond, I want her to learn to swim hard to keep up with the (real) leading group�. It would defeat my purpose if I helped too much.

This past weekend, my 10 year old realized Friday night that he had not turned in the intent form to participate at the regional Science Fair. He was extremely upset because without the form he could not compete. I suggested he call his science teacher at home. We could not find her number, so I suggested he call the assistant principle and ask for it. As I handed him the phone, he asked me to do it and it was clear that he did not want to. I told him that I agreed that it would be much easier for him if I did it, but I wasn�t going to. He made the call himself and will compete this weekend.

He learned that deadlines are important and he learned that he is competent at handling his own issues.

Regarding chenchuan's comment about letting go--I am struggling with this now. My oldest son is 12 and we had his IEP yesterday about transition to high school. The teachers provided a standard menu of honors/AP classes forecast over the next 4 years. I told him that just because someone presents you with a recipe doesn't mean you have to follow it. You can choose to be creative, if that's what you want. For instance, his ACT scores are very high and I feel I could easily advocate for going right to the jr yr courses. I told him it would mean that he would not be in the same classes as his few friends and might run out of high school classes, but we could figure out online stuff or community college courses. In other words, there are many possibilities and choices. I definitely don't want to make the choices for him at this point because he'd resent me if they didn't work out well. But I hate for him to just sit there and followed someone else's prescribed regimen when something else might be more appropriate for him.

I'm battling the adolescent attitude with him right now (does anyone else hear the leaking tire "pssssssss" every time they say something to their darling child?) So, I'm inclined to let him do the "recipe" and see if he gets frustrated or disgusted and then come to me. At least I told him there are lots of different possibilities that he could choose from.

Am I being childish?

Cym,
I'm not sure what you mean by "being childish" but if it's letting him fry for not following your advice, then, sure, at least a bit. I think at age 12, you job is to let him pick between reasonable choices. Either the school's plan is reasonable, and you can calmly hand him the "keys," or it isn't.

there is another way, depending upon how sneaky you feel comfortable being.

You can contact the guidance department seperatly and share your concerns. Find out if there is a drop/add period where he can try the regular plan and then "go up" if needed. Lots of schools have this level of flexability.

For me, the toughest times with parenting have been when the school work is underchallenging and he gets "prematurly big for his britches." What seems to help so far is,
1) recruiting other respected adults who agree with you to share their experiences.
2) schedual regular times to be together on his terms, perhaps doing activities that he enjoys and you don't. (He doesn't have to know that you are planning to schedual regular times.)
3) Get lots of support for yourself during this difficult time.
4) Give him plenty of opportunities to overhear you saying positive things about him.

Best Wishes,
Trinity

Thanks Trinity,
Yes, I agree, and thank you for great ideas. I really need to be more positive with him--you're right. I do hope to meet with the gifted counselor at the high school with my son and get her input. I asked our ditd counselor, too, and she wisely said don't look too far ahead (don't get bogged down with the 4-yr plan yet). Start with what he wants and change it if it's not working. She also encouraged using his free time for mentorships or community service project (which he otherwise might not have time for if accelerated too much). I thought this was a great idea, too.

Cym

Cym - That is a terrific point about the free time. If you have a child that you think can use free time productivly, I think that's a wonderful point. I read somewhere that a major part of the learning in HS is from the clubs and organizations.

...as long as the academics are meaty enough that he can still get the "A"s he needs....

Seriously I would "premeet" the gifted counselor at the high school before you set up any three way meetings. I've learned the hard way (with DH) not to engage any professionals until I know that I trust and agree with them. It "sounds" terrible, but really, what are the odds that any given local professional is going to have tons of experience with kids that have scores that get them into the Young Scholar Program? Statistically speaking they are very low. And this matters. Would that it didn't.

Which is not to say that it's impossible to find a local person who has a lot of wisdom, some people have amazing resources of integrity, immagination, and network and can be very valuable, anyway. I'm urging you to see it as your homework to check this out in advance.

Love and More Love,
Trinity