Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Twice Exceptional need help to understand FSIQ

The difference between VCI and PRI doesn't invalidate the IQ score, but it may indicate that the FSIQ is not a good representation of her abilities and maybe shouldn't be reported. Did the evaluator note anything like this?

Her PRI is clearly a strength, and it seems she may be more of a visual thinker. This can sometimes be difficult in the American School, where most everything is presented and tested in the verbal realm.

I'm not sure if the APD would affect PSI. PSI is processing speed and weighs heavily on visual motor skills - not listening/ auditory skills. How are her fine motor skills? What kinds of visual motor/ visual processing tests did they use? Her skill actually is not that low relative WMI and VCI.

It is interesting that her WMI and PRI scores practically flipped. What did the evaluator say about that? Were the changes in medication, sleep or anything that might account for a difference in performance?

What is the IEP for? Does she have speech and language supports and reading supports. Given the APD diagnosis and lower VCI, it seems there might be some type of language based reading disability.

It sounds like you might have concerns. How is the school using the WISC? Have they evaluated in any other areas. IDEA mandates that evaluations be comprised upon a number of tests, in all areas of disability. Evaluations should also include observation, teacher assessments, work samples etc.

A couple of things to keep in mind when you go to your IEP meeting.

You have stayput rights. so, if the school decides to exit her from sped, and you disagree, she continues on the existing IEP until the differences are resolved via the legal process. Here's a link with more info: http://www.a2zeducationaladvocates.com/Stay_put.html

Secondly, they cannot use IQ/Achievement discrepancy as the only way to qualify for an IEP. In fact, if the data shows that without continued special ed services, she could not maintain the growth level, this would be reason to stay on an IEP. Ask: Can she make appropriate progress in the general curriculum without specialized instruction, different performance criteria or different delivery methods (ie small group) to make grade level progress.

The VCI doesn't measure comprehension per se, but it does measure verbal reasoning skills - critical thinking, problem solving skills using words. The comprehension sub test measures the student's skills in understanding social conventions.

I am glad you were able to get an independent evaluation. Often outside evaluations are more comprehensive and diagnostic than school based evaluations. For instance, the WJ III often overstates a student's skill level. The test items are VERY brief and don't represent the writing, reading and math skills she would need in the school environment.

Who administered the WISC? I would be very interested in what they have to say about the HUGE change in block design, comprehension and number letter sequencing. I wonder how she approached these tasks and if there were things in her approach that could give insight into her learning profile.

Teaching the CELF is inappropriate!!!!!!!

If there are certain subtests that she scored poorly on, these SKILLS should be addressed. But, not the answers to the test. I'm not sure, but this seems this would be against the professional standards. Additionally, there are other tests that might shed more light on her difficulties and how they should be addressed.

You may want to vist the Millermom forum: http://millermom.proboards.com/index.cgi?

There are a few special educators, slp's and special ed advocates as well as moms and dads of kids with LD. I think they would be able to ask some good questions to help better understand what is going on here, and give you ideas on how to approach your IEP meeting. It may help to post the WISC scores as well as any other scores such as WJ, CELF and any other reading, writing and spelling scores.

I'm interested in that they found phonemic awareness deficits - not suprising due to the APD. I'm wondering what tests they gave. CTOPP? GORT? TOWRE? These would be very helpful.

Best of luck.

Oh - working memory does tap into auditory skills. But, just because WMI and PSI are in tact doesn't mean she doesn't have some deficits in other areas. They need to look at the evaluation as a whole. Not just one or two tests. In fact, IDEA says that decisions CANNOT be made on a single test. Evaluations should include tests using multiple instruments, work samples, teacher input, observation etc.

While it is somewhat unusual for a child to have a reading disability and not have a weakness in either WMI or PSI, it does not prove they don't have a disability. In fact, weaknesses in these areas while a red flag for LD do not guarantee LD.

Would the neuropsychologist be able to join you for the meeting? Have you ever worked with an advocate. It might be helpful to have someone familiar with the tests to join you, so that are less able to twist the data to suit their needs.

It can be pretty overwhelming to do it your self. The meetings move fast and are emotional. Often an outsider can help insure that your child's needs stay front and center.