Gifted Issues Discussion homepage Forums Learning Environments It's not optimal, but is it ENOUGH?

This is the question that DH and I keep throwing around. He agrees that DS is not at all challenged at school, and we're waiting to hear what their plan is for next year (the school declined our suggestions).

If DS is not learning any significant academics at school (which DH agrees he's not), but he does have a friend or two, and has PE and Art, etc..., and we let him do CTY classes over the summer when it's not too much with homework/sports/activities, is it enough? How do you know?

Is it detrimental for the long-term if DS has 10-30 minutes per day of homework that is virtually all busy-work? And how do you know at what point the curriculum will become enough of a challenge that at least he has to really think regularly at school, and put real work in?

One of the school's comments was that the next grade's curriculum will be more challenging than the last. I find it difficult to believe that it will be significantly more challenging since it's the same kids as the previous year, and they're not being split into ability-based groups. But maybe it's like I've seen with sports -- the same kids come back the next year after not playing much basketball and they're significantly better -- they've grown more coordinated, and have a better understanding of the game. Does the same thing happen with academics?

If anyone has any comments or suggestions, I'd love to hear them. I am disappointed that the school has declined our suggestions and we are trying to figure out whether it makes sense to stick it out and make do, or whether we just have to bite the bullet financially and homeschool.

Any thoughts?

Mama,

I think that many (most?) of us in this forum ask ourselves those same questions -- or try to figure out how to avoid those questions.

I remember when I was a kid, the teachers would always say "just wait until next year" -- but things NEVER got hard.

How old is ds?

I think the answer to whether something is "good enough" might differ based on how possible it would be to have something "better". I'm very pro homeschooling GT kids, BUT not at the expense of that choice hovering over his head, if you know what I mean.

What does enough mean to you?
I haven't really parsed this out, but off the top of my head, "enough" (as opposed to optimal) might mean
-- feels happier more often than not (or at least, feels whatever his baseline is more often than not -- as in, school doesn't typically bring him down)
-- still feels a passion for learning in some form or another, even if he doesn't necessarily get it from school most of the time
-- is healthy (or whatever his baseline is) more often than not
-- feels reasonably happy/comfortable being himself (what "reasonably" means is somewhat age dependent...)
-- is challenged in some aspect of his life. I think this is crucial for the full development of a gifted kid. Of course, this is very personal, and other people might prioritize things differently, but for me learning diligence was one of the thing that took the longest. And without diligence (or some similar attribute) a person can't go to the edge of their giftedness and PUSH and meet whatever their extraordinary potential might be. Which is not to say that your kid should feel pushed -- not at all -- but that he have some experience with tenacity, so that later on, when he wants something hard, he knows how to push himself, and he feels comfortable doing so.

I wouldn't think the 10-30 minutes of busywork a day is detrimental -- certainly not any more so than all the other stuff he has to put up with. That's just something you gotta do and not think much about. Is there some reason why you think it might be detrimental? (Now 3 hours of busywork might turn soul crushing, but 30 minutes? Eh... half the time, the homework might be slightly amusing, even if unnecessary).

I don't know that the curriculum will ever be a challenge on a regular basis without some sort of differenciation. However, hopefully, he will encounter teachers here and there that ask more of their kids, and he'll take that opportunity and know that's a teacher worth impressing, and projects worth sinking his teeth into, and he'll take advantage of that.

HTH...

Great list Clay. We are at the starting point with our concerns but I've pondered the "is it enough" question numerous times. The biggest concern for me is the not learning to learn. If the student is always doing busy work and is never given a challenge they will sooner or later hit a wall and not know how to learn. Usually it is later when they are in middle school or most likely high school and this is a definite cause for concern. Does this mean that you rely solely on the school to teach them this essential skill? I don't think so ... supplementing at home goes a long way. If you find that your DS meets the criteria on Clay's list and seems for the most part happy than it really comes down to giving him opportunities to develop his skill of learning. Summertime is a great time to do so with specialized summer camps and projects at home.

Just some quick thoughts.

I think "enough" is different for every kid. First and foremost, is kid happy most of the time? If no, you have a problem. If yes, then you have to decide about the academics being "enough."

Here's where the crystal ball comes in. Some kids would do just fine w/ enough. The man who wrote Art of Problem Solving materials went to an avg highschool w/ about 30min of busywork homework each night. He said he didn't learn much. He said it was the best thing for him b/c it gave him FREE TIMe to pursue things he wanted to pursue. Now that's at the highschool level and quite different from elementary.

My point being some kids will be just fine. You challenge them at home since he won't have a lot of homework, on summers and weekends. Follow his passions.

Other kids will wither away as mine did. His whole personality changed. Plus, he was having 2hrs of homework each evening and we had NO time for afterschooling his interests. And he was in such a foul mood from school, there was no point.

Do I think it will get more challenging? Probably not. I think if you're dealing with an academically motivated child, a bright child, perhaps an MG kid in a good school - then yes. Once everyone learns to read and gets beyond simple adding/sub/multi/div then things will get more interesting. If you're dealing w/ an HG+ kid, probably not. If you're already 2-3+ years advanced (even if not in material but in acquisition of new info, making connections), then another year will not make a difference. That was my son's issue. He had things he needed to be learn, to be exposed to .... but they entire school year could have been compressed into about 4-5months.

And you mention if it's like sports.....the other kids might have spurts and have better understanding....BUT, your son will also have a spurt so you see, the distance is not closing and in fact might be getting wider.

You really have to look at your DS's personality. It might be enough for him. My Dh said "but in high school he'll have AP classes." the only problem was that DS was in 2nd grade.....that's a long time to wait to be challenged. BY then, your brain is mush, you don't see school as a place to learn, you're hanging out w/ the druggies at recess....

I think b/c most adults want the easy way out and don't want to be challenge (we have many items competing for our attention) that they can't imagine that kids thrive on challenge. People think it's great to be smart and just be able to coast. And for some, that is certainly true....gifted underachievers. But for many, lack of challenge is detrimental.

The only thing I can think of is now that I am grown up I don't look back at my schooling and think "that was awful, but at least I had a couple of friends." I had friends I liked better NOT in school, so I don't think school is a necessary component.

Love the suggestions and this is an ongoing discussion at our house as well - we have homeschooled 2 years with 2 attempts at public schooling...I agree with everyone's posts - our biggest issue was - was he happy and - and was he challenged enough. We were worried that things were so easy for him because they did zero differentiation and we were worried that when things finally would get challenging, he wouldn't know how to handle it. We also saw a very unhappy little boy who complained about sitting around all day "learning nothing new".

My DYS DS did 1st thru 3rd in a school that was not challenging enough. They kept promising more challenge each year. I think the school, including the gifted teacher will never understand his needs. I felt like school was hurting his learning attitude, self esteem and home attitude. It is good he made 2 best friends locally who are a good match for him, while going to this school. It had to get really bad at school for me to make the big change to another school 30 mins from home. He will appreciated the gifted school more because of his bad experience.

I would suggest looking into other options. Knowing what your other options can help your decision.

I think a underchallenging school can be enough if the child does enough activies outside of school that are challenging. My son didn't want to do much with extra activities because he wants to use his free time for sports and doesn't like to get over scheduled.

Some school will accept part time homeschooling, course subtitution, or accelloration which can balance a child day. Our school thought he should do more work above the normal load to meet his needs and this caused resentment.

We are in the same boat and I ask myself the same question all the time. My feeling it that it is not enough but it is the best that I can do. The one gripe I have with CTY (with the math) is that it is not enough practice. I just don't have the time to create worksheets for practice and w/regular busy work from school there is not a lot of time to even do those practice sheets. I figure it is better than nothing and whatever sticks sticks and what doesn't doesn't. Of course a true gifted school would be great but not an option. We did do one grade skip but still the schools are just soooooo slow.

You could supplement with something else. My DS9 has done a several Mindware.com books.

That is a great site onthegomom! I never thought having a kid would make me feel so dumb. I looked at those history card games geez I dk anything. Recently he said to me just because I wasn't smart doesn't mean I am not a good mom.

I am def going to order some stuff. What has your DS liked the most?