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I am a parent who is blown away by my DD learning the alphabet and I mean identifying letters both capital and lower case etc. It seems that it is a bit young for me to know whether she will fit into the criteria of "gifted". I am also not sure that I can call any one else's astonishments of their childs abilities as "pseudo gifted". I am sad to think that any child's abilities whether seeming advanced or not could be labeled by another's in comparison with their own child. I also think of how many of us on this board have heard teachers tell us that our kids are something other than gifted and how much that hurts and causes confusion. I have already been seen as someone who is "pushing" my child not because any one watched me do it but because of what my child knows.

I have not heard other parents around my dd's age say that their child knows the ABC's etc. I have noticed when I fist started looking on the internet about this there was alot of people who wrote that their children knew the ABC's etc. I thought that was a bit strange to see so many but not to have met any. At this point I would like to meet another child (around my dd's age)who knows the ABC's.

I think that I use the criteria of the ABC's, counting, recognizing colours etc. because they are pretty quantifiable and commonly recognizable abilities. I guess it takes out some of the subjectivity. Memory is a part of intelligence.

I love your stories of the imaginary play.

Hi flower,

Just want to clarify, of course early learning of the alphabet etc. can be a sign of giftedness, especially if the child is leading the way. I went back and looked at your very first post, where you said "19 month old dd who suddenly showed us two months ago that she knew the alphabet" -- now THAT's gifted!!!

Also, I would never label a specific child "pseudo-gifted." Because, what do I know? I have no way of knowing if that child is eagerly soaking up knowledge, or if instead it's the parents pushing a narrow agenda.

BUT . . .

1) Pushy parents do exist. 2) Most young children, once they've started talking, can be taught to memorize some stuff, if it's important enough to the parents. 3) Our culture doesn't have a clue what giftedness really looks like. Hence, the phenomenon that Min originally posted about. I think the phenomenon is real, and I think "pseudo-gifted" is not a bad term for it.

I'm not sure you really meant this the way it sounds. Taken at face value, this amounts to a call to do away with the the entire concept of "gifted," because it involves comparison. We are all here on this board because we can't escape the fact that our kids are different.

Hi Flower,

I quoted you because I am one of the many here raising my hand to assure you that you have found parents with children just like yours. My 26 month old has also known all of his letters/colors/shapes since 15-18 months, phonics before 24, counts on his own to 20 and does 1-1 correspondence, and is starting to read sight words. My 5 year old did the same thing, and is now a YS. Like someone else pointed out, it's all part of the same rote memorization skills, but the "gifted" sign is that they memorize it so quickly. (For ex, mine doesn't watch tv, which several studies attribute to early learning of these concepts.) I share this with you not to brag, but to let you know that we're not alone.

I have also seen in our family that our HG children are extraordinarily imaginative. While rote memorization is often used to compare milestones, IMO, the true joy of having gifted children comes from this imagination.

As for all the general bragging we hear by so many, here is my thought. We have to remember that the average IQ is only 100, and the milestone books that moms cling to are geared towards that average. In the average social circle of a PG family, my guess is that many of the other children in that circle also come from families well above that average. We have to remember that the gifted line for schools includes 10-15% of the population. That number is skewed even more by demographics in well-educated areas(according to social research). When 30% of your playgroup thinks their children are gifted, by those numbers they may be right. However, when your children are profoundly gifted with IQs in the 160s and higher, it's a different situation. Because these children are so rare and people are so competitive, others question their situation.

That's why YS and forums like this are such a blessing!! IMO, it is both humbling and gratifying to find a group where our children are simply normal. I think we've all been wrongfully accused of either lying about their abilities, browbeating them, being braggarts, etc. Isn't it wonderful to come together and confirm for each other that they aren't aliens or oddities, but just sweet children whom God has bestowed with special gifts.

Thank you so much for sharing all of your experiences, too!

I think pseudo-gifted is a good term for some of these youngsters. I know that in the end, in the bigger picture it doesn't really matter (to me) whether Joe Blow or Jane Doe's kid is gifted or not. The competative parenting does. I admit, it does.

Along the lines of what gratefulmom mentioned, I really enjoy going to a place where bright is normal. Additionally, no one begins with the assumption that I've drilled facts into my kids, and I particularely enjoy the lack of competativeness of these boards. If I post something I don't need to justify or explain, or deal with the apparent contradictions that can seem to be there in a 2E child, and can deal more directly with whatever is on my mind.

Love it.

I completely agree with MegMeg and a lot of you here on this. Where I come from, I've had friends and acquaintances come up to rattle off a list of things their DC has done. Perhaps DS was a talking baby back then (he talked at 6 mths and walked at 13mths, so it seemed incongruous for a while). But they'd want to compare milestones and I was always stunned. Such detailed record keeping month by month of the number of pieces of jigsaw puzzles their kid did, or how many words the child can say at exactly which month. I realized later that, yup, these were checklists from the "What to Expect" series.

Don't get me wrong. It's fabulous of course. But what about the child's personality and his antics? What about the hilarious moments when his specialness shone through and outwitted the parent? That warmth that comes from recounting about the child (any child), rather than rattling a static list that has been checked. Like MegMeg says, I can't judge or assume to know that the other children are not gifted. But I've learnt my lesson well - when I meet parents who focus only on "The List" and not on the children themselves, I just steer clear.

On the other hand, the genuine love, affection and astonishment at your kids is obvious from so, so many of you here on the list. There IS a difference that I can't seem to put my finger on. So yes, I love to hear about how all your kids are doing. Like gratefulmom and Min says, it makes me realize this is a community that we completely belong to and can come to for support.

For once, we belong!

I don't think anyone meant the question of 'the list' to offend anybody on this board and if you were offended I just want to apologize. JMHO but yes rote memorization at an early age is a 'possible' sign of gifted. It really comes down to the wait and see game and also if the child in question learned so in less repetition than the norm. I could rattle off the list of what my DD accomplished at an early age, such as ABCs by 9 months; counting before 1 yr, etc and it goes towards justifying our beliefs that she is gifted, absolutely. But as she got older we noticed the advanced cognitive development which is huge for IQ and her imagination and humor, along with many many more. The bottom line (for me) is all these signs are small pieces to the puzzle and most of the time 'the list' is just the beginning.

Hi, first thanks for the gentle responses. I wrote the note when I could not sleep last night so was not as coherent as I would like to be. In regards to the comparison thing I was referring specifically to these youngsters that are say 18 months old. I'm still uncomfortable with the term Pseudo gifted. I do agree that there are pushy parents but according to the GDC parents who believe their kids are gifted test usually gifted or pretty darn close. I found that to be interesting. I just wonder if I had not had as much information as I do have if I had been reading the posts as a what do you call them, "lurkers" I may have been chased away. I have never been a member of a board like this and do appreciate the people out there saying they have kids who know the ABC's. I am so glad you are out there but I wish I could have a person who I could sit down and have tea with. So here is to a cyber tea play date with you all out there where the kids could play with letters or whatever together.

People love their kids and are proud of them. That's it. What's the big deal? Just say "That's great!" Like a good kind person.

lex, of course that's the right thing to do. It just gets annoying when pushy parents constantly want to play the comparison game. I think it's really a side effect of the ways in which the general public is becoming aware of early childhood development and educational issues, with additional feedback from the internet. I detect traces of it here sometimes. In the end it is usually a bit sad at worst, since it usually shows a parent that's simply angst-ridden more than super-competitive, and I agree that kindness is what's generally called for.

I took my DS2/3 and DS4 to the park yesterday and had a long conversation with a dad that was there with his 3.5 year old son. He was super nice, and while he got a little boastful when recounting his war stories from Iraq (I was a good listener and don't fault him), he got a sad look on his face when talking about his son's language ability, and told me he was worried that his son was behind. I am pretty sure that this happened because my son was there telling him all about the projects he's been doing lately, recounting the full plot of Iron Man 2 with all plot twists and trivia, etc. I hope I did a good job of reassuring him. It was not the first time that I've experienced the other side of the phenomenon, and each time helps prepare me for the more trying times, to remember to be humble and nice. Most parents just aren't bad people-- they're stressed and want constant feedback about where their little one is relative to everyone else.

flower, that's interesting. I wonder if the phenomenon you describe is an effect or a cause. I suspect at least a bit of the latter, as parents who care about development may tend to train or at least encourage their children into increased achievement scores.

Of course that is the thing to do. I haven't noticed any suggestion here of anyone dong otherwise. That doesn't mean I am neither surprised with the focus on lists of skills rather than on the whole child, nor also suprised at the shift in expectations of young children.